Trade of Chad Johnson?

[Mark Long Beach]

This is about the dumbest post I've ever seen, only because you are convinced that there isn't any argument. Roscoe Parrish has already accomplished more than Josh Reed has in the NFL. And for some of the TD's that Parrish has caught, or has caught and turned into TD's, in limited playing time, he must be running some kind of routes out there.

 

There is NOBODY in the NFL that fears Josh Reed. Not one team. Roscoe Parrish is often talked about as the most feared weapon for the Bills BOTH on special teams and as a WR. Hell in Pittsburgh before the game, their whole pregame focus was about how to stop Parrish as a special teams player AND WR.

 

Get a grip, you are defending a below average WR in Josh Reed. Reed is likeable, but he's not that good, and his raw talent level is marginal. There isn't a personnel man in the NFL that would take Josh Reed over Parrish as a wideout.

 

There also isn't a pro personnel guy in NFL that would take the combo of Lee Evans and Josh Reed over Chad Johnson and Roscoe Parrish. Not one.

 

Come on man, I know it's March, but wake up.

 

Um... I also don't agree with your opinions here, and you're being pretty abusive for those who don't share your opinions. We are not blind, and we are not asleep.

 

Josh Reed, while not a steller WR, is a decent option to have. He's a possession receiver who can reliably catch the ball and get a first down. (he's really overcome his dropsy problem early in his career) He's also a solid blocker who can help our run game should it ever get to the second level. Don't get me wrong, he's a #3 receiver. But he's fine as a #3, just not a #2.

 

Roscoe Parrish hasn't proved that he can be an effective WR. He doesn't seem to run routes well. Yes he's explosive, yes he can "hit the home run" but only in the open field. This is why he excells as a punt returner. Steve Smith he ain't. I'm hoping he continues to develop, but at the moment, he's where he should be, a platooning #3 WR. He still has potential to improve, while JR isn't likely to get a lot better. Here's to hoping Roscoe works hard and turns into a late bloomer.

 

As for your comparison of Lee Evans & JR vs Chad Johnson & RP... I love LE, but CJ is the better receiver. He's got other issues, but he's hands down the better receiver. I base this on watching both of them, but if you want stats to back them up (not that they tell the whole story at all) but LE averages 932yds/year with only one season(in his 5 year career) above 850 yards. CJ has averaged 1340 yds/year over the last 6 years. Averaging above LE's most sucessful season for longer than LE's been in the league. As last year shows LE can be schemed out of the game.

 

So it's lunacy to use any comparison of LE vs CJ to prove JR vs RP as CJ dwarfs LE.

 

I'm also not sure how you can say that RP is a more accomplished WR than JR. He's not. In his career, he has waaaay less receptions and significantly fewer yards each season, and the same TDs.

 

That is NOT more accomplished.

 

On the good side, RP has improved every year in # of receptions 15 to 23 to 35, and in yards/year 148 to 320 to 352.

 

Again, here's to hoping he continues that streak.

[HeHateMe78]

I am sorry, I forgot that you and other fans have more insight into our players than our coaches, please forgive me.

 

Yeah, Parrish could be unstoppable, thats why he plays so much.

 

If Evans played on an NFL caliber team, he would be doing much better than he does in Buffalo

Are we alluding to the same coaches that have not achieved a playoff spot in the 21st Century (2nd worst in the league) ????

[Adam]

Are we alluding to the same coaches that have not achieved a playoff spot in the 21st Century (2nd worst in the league) ????

Which group of coaches, I forget. We seem to change every couple of years

[Oneonta Buffalo Fan]

I read the football365 article and it made a lot of sense. Why not trade for CJ?

 

BUF Gets:

-WR Chad Johnson

-CIN 2nd RD Pick

 

CIN Gets:

-BUF 1st RD Pick

-DE Chris Kelsay

There's no way we should trade for CJ. I don't care how good he his or how he might put the Bills in the SB, he has what seems like WORSE character issues than TO. Tht would spell absolute disaster in the locker room and the team already very good chemistry.

[Lv-Bills]

Um... I also don't agree with your opinions here, and you're being pretty abusive for those who don't share your opinions. We are not blind, and we are not asleep.

 

Josh Reed, while not a steller WR, is a decent option to have. He's a possession receiver who can reliably catch the ball and get a first down. (he's really overcome his dropsy problem early in his career) He's also a solid blocker who can help our run game should it ever get to the second level. Don't get me wrong, he's a #3 receiver. But he's fine as a #3, just not a #2.

 

Roscoe Parrish hasn't proved that he can be an effective WR. He doesn't seem to run routes well. Yes he's explosive, yes he can "hit the home run" but only in the open field. This is why he excells as a punt returner. Steve Smith he ain't. I'm hoping he continues to develop, but at the moment, he's where he should be, a platooning #3 WR. He still has potential to improve, while JR isn't likely to get a lot better. Here's to hoping Roscoe works hard and turns into a late bloomer.

 

As for your comparison of Lee Evans & JR vs Chad Johnson & RP... I love LE, but CJ is the better receiver. He's got other issues, but he's hands down the better receiver. I base this on watching both of them, but if you want stats to back them up (not that they tell the whole story at all) but LE averages 932yds/year with only one season(in his 5 year career) above 850 yards. CJ has averaged 1340 yds/year over the last 6 years. Averaging above LE's most sucessful season for longer than LE's been in the league. As last year shows LE can be schemed out of the game.

 

So it's lunacy to use any comparison of LE vs CJ to prove JR vs RP as CJ dwarfs LE.

 

I'm also not sure how you can say that RP is a more accomplished WR than JR. He's not. In his career, he has waaaay less receptions and significantly fewer yards each season, and the same TDs.

 

That is NOT more accomplished.

 

On the good side, RP has improved every year in # of receptions 15 to 23 to 35, and in yards/year 148 to 320 to 352.

 

Again, here's to hoping he continues that streak.

We had a comment by Adam in this thread that Chad Johnson is a lesser version of Lee Evans which is absurd. We also know that he likes Reed over Parrish, thus comes the comparison in this thread that no pro personnel guy would take the combo of Lee Evans and Josh Reed over 85 and Parrish. None. Not one in this league.

 

As far as Reed goes, he's NOT a good WR. He's adequate as like a #4 in an empty backfield situation or something like that. We already know Lee Evans is a pretty darn good WR. And on the other side sits Josh Reed. Reed hasn't done jack to lessen presure on Evans. Nothing. Period. He's not fast, he's not explosive, and he's not a big target. He's basically average, at best. And average is kind. Reed also had his chance in the slot. He was mediocre there too. He had drop problems, and had basically the same skill set that he has now, which is pretty much nil. Reed is a good downfield blocker. That's not really what the Bills need.

 

As for Parrish. This route running stuff all of a sudden is pretty stupid. The fact of the matter is this........Parrish is on the field about half of the time that Reed is, and he's almost just as productive. He's made more big plays to help the Bills in games, in a lot less chances. He's explosive. He's fast. He's elusive. He's also a guy that many on the Bills defense say is almost impossible to cover when in trying to cover him in practice. So, you take all of that information, and wonder why in the hell he wasn't used more by Fairchild. The route thing is garbage. For a WR in the slot, most of the time you are finding seams or soft spots zone defenses anyway. THere really isn't any route running ability needed there. You may need some smarts, which I'm not sure where Roscoe stands, but it's not hard to find and run to open spots in zones. Wes Welker is a great example of this. Watch a Pats game and concentrate on him. Most of time, Welker is the last WR off of the line........and this is on purpose to let all of the other WR's clear out the secondary. Then, Welker takes off and exploits all of the open spaces in the defense created by thier WR's and TE. He caught over 110 balls doing this. This is exactly how Parrish should be used. Parrish would maybe be more explosive than Welker. Not better hands, but more explosive.

 

So, don't give me this crap about route running, and NFL coaches knowing more, blah blah blah. Fairchild was a gutless moron who didn't use his personnel to their stretngths. His scared play calling in the red zone was embarassing. Period.

 

Josh Reed on this team does not add much. Take him away, and the Bills will miss pretty much nothing. He's easily replaced. Roscoe, on the other hand, still has a ton of potential, and the fact that he's shown signs of explosiveness should get him on the field more with a better offensive coordinator.

[Adam]

We had a comment by Adam in this thread that Chad Johnson is a lesser version of Lee Evans which is absurd. We also know that he likes Reed over Parrish, thus comes the comparison in this thread that no pro personnel guy would take the combo of Lee Evans and Josh Reed over 85 and Parrish. None. Not one in this league.

 

As far as Reed goes, he's NOT a good WR. He's adequate as like a #4 in an empty backfield situation or something like that. We already know Lee Evans is a pretty darn good WR. And on the other side sits Josh Reed. Reed hasn't done jack to lessen presure on Evans. Nothing. Period. He's not fast, he's not explosive, and he's not a big target. He's basically average, at best. And average is kind. Reed also had his chance in the slot. He was mediocre there too. He had drop problems, and had basically the same skill set that he has now, which is pretty much nil. Reed is a good downfield blocker. That's not really what the Bills need.

 

As for Parrish. This route running stuff all of a sudden is pretty stupid. The fact of the matter is this........Parrish is on the field about half of the time that Reed is, and he's almost just as productive. He's made more big plays to help the Bills in games, in a lot less chances. He's explosive. He's fast. He's elusive. He's also a guy that many on the Bills defense say is almost impossible to cover when in trying to cover him in practice. So, you take all of that information, and wonder why in the hell he wasn't used more by Fairchild. The route thing is garbage. For a WR in the slot, most of the time you are finding seams or soft spots zone defenses anyway. THere really isn't any route running ability needed there. You may need some smarts, which I'm not sure where Roscoe stands, but it's not hard to find and run to open spots in zones. Wes Welker is a great example of this. Watch a Pats game and concentrate on him. Most of time, Welker is the last WR off of the line........and this is on purpose to let all of the other WR's clear out the secondary. Then, Welker takes off and exploits all of the open spaces in the defense created by thier WR's and TE. He caught over 110 balls doing this. This is exactly how Parrish should be used. Parrish would maybe be more explosive than Welker. Not better hands, but more explosive.

 

So, don't give me this crap about route running, and NFL coaches knowing more, blah blah blah. Fairchild was a gutless moron who didn't use his personnel to their stretngths. His scared play calling in the red zone was embarassing. Period.

 

Josh Reed on this team does not add much. Take him away, and the Bills will miss pretty much nothing. He's easily replaced. Roscoe, on the other hand, still has a ton of potential, and the fact that he's shown signs of explosiveness should get him on the field more with a better offensive coordinator.

I AM saying that Reed should be a #4 WR! Where did I ever say he should be opposite Lee Evans- Go ahead and find where I said that. He is a reliable #4.

 

As far as you knowing what personnel people think, that is nothing more than jibberish. With nothing around him, Evans still made plays for us. Chad Johnson struggled last year with a great supporting cast, and for most of the season he was outplayed by TJ Houshmanzedah

 

Parrish more explosive than Welker? Please get me some of the stuff you are smoking. Wes Welker is one of the most precise route runners in the NFL. Parrish has the physical skill to run better routes and make better cuts than Welker, but he made no effort in college or the pros.

 

Parrish has great value as a kick returner- which was clearly displayed when he was hurt and wasn't returning kicks. Our return game suffered. But he doesn't make adequate cuts and fakes to get open, and thats that.

[stuckincincy]

I AM saying that Reed should be a #4 WR! Where did I ever say he should be opposite Lee Evans- Go ahead and find where I said that. He is a reliable #4.

 

As far as you knowing what personnel people think, that is nothing more than jibberish. With nothing around him, Evans still made plays for us. Chad Johnson struggled last year with a great supporting cast, and for most of the season he was outplayed by TJ Houshmanzedah

 

Parrish more explosive than Welker? Please get me some of the stuff you are smoking. Wes Welker is one of the most precise route runners in the NFL. Parrish has the physical skill to run better routes and make better cuts than Welker, but he made no effort in college or the pros.

 

Parrish has great value as a kick returner- which was clearly displayed when he was hurt and wasn't returning kicks. Our return game suffered. But he doesn't make adequate cuts and fakes to get open, and thats that.

 

It's so, that the NE* wide-outs pull coverage. Every team does that when they run a 3 WR set. IMO, Walker does a great job getting off the line and running to the middle. Brady scans and reliably knows that Welker will be there. In a 1st-down gaining spot. Then Welker usually falls down. Mission accomplished. - he's not going to risk a fumble or getting killed.

 

Were I a DC, I'd take the risk and shadow Welker, and repeatedly plant him - hard. Yep - you may be beat, but there is something to be said for saying this guy isn't going to beat me. That can transfer over th the next meeting...

[Adam]

It's so, that the NE* wide-outs pull coverage. Every team does that when they run a 3 WR set. IMO, Walker does a great job getting off the line and running to the middle. Brady scans and reliably knows that Welker will be there. In a 1st-down gaining spot. Then Welker usually falls down. Mission accomplished. - he's not going to risk a fumble or getting killed.

 

Were I a DC, I'd take the risk and shadow Welker, and repeatedly plant him - hard. Yep - you may be beat, but there is something to be said for saying this guy isn't going to beat me. That can transfer over th the next meeting...

I like your line of thinking. I would rather make them beat me deep with Moss than short with Welker- give them the low percentage pass, and if they hit it, you just aren't going to beat them. Take the sure thing away.

[ndirish1978]

I object to this thread purely on the basis that I do not like how it is worded. I would have preferred

 

Trading Johnson

Johnson Trade

Johnson Trade Talk

 

but Trade OF Johnson? It sounds like you're an exchange student from Sweden "Have you heard of the talking of people about the trade of Johnson?"

[stuckincincy]

I like your line of thinking. I would rather make them beat me deep with Moss than short with Welker- give them the low percentage pass, and if they hit it, you just aren't going to beat them. Take the sure thing away.

 

CIN does just that within their division. Unless they neutralize and smack around PIT's Polamau and BAL's Lewis, they have little chance of a win.

 

When faced with an exceptional player, you have to take those chances.

 

Welker...112 receptions...65 1st downs. Impressive.

[JPicc2114]

Welker...112 receptions...65 1st downs. Impressive.

 

 

Tom Brady

[stuckincincy]

Tom Brady

 

A plus.

 

Welker w/ MIA in '06: 67 receptions, 33 1st downs, 2 starts in 16 games. QB's were Harrington, 11 games, McNabb, 4 and Lemon 1. MIA certainly spread the ball around that season - Chambers caught 59, Booker, 55, and McMichael 62.

[Westinghouse]

I read the football365 article and it made a lot of sense. Why not trade for CJ?

 

BUF Gets:

-WR Chad Johnson

-CIN 2nd RD Pick

 

CIN Gets:

-BUF 1st RD Pick

-DE Chris Kelsay

Do you really want to have to watch that retard every week ?

[ndirish1978]

I would be pretty nervous about him coming to Buffalo because of his attitude. That being said, CJ could follow me around town punching me in the face and I would forgive him and put up with all his junk if he got us to a championship. Winning trumps character in this country

[Adam]

I would be pretty nervous about him coming to Buffalo because of his attitude. That being said, CJ could follow me around town punching me in the face and I would forgive him and put up with all his junk if he got us to a championship. Winning trumps character in this country

Not really, we are just told that by ESPN.

[Big Turk]

I read the football365 article and it made a lot of sense. Why not trade for CJ?

 

BUF Gets:

-WR Chad Johnson

-CIN 2nd RD Pick

 

CIN Gets:

-BUF 1st RD Pick

-DE Chris Kelsay

 

I posted about trading for him like 3 months ago...nice to see this author finally caught up...

[stuckincincy]

For those that care...

 

More Chad sh*t...

 

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art...PT02/804020370/