D.C. radio slams Ralph Wilson

[plenzmd1]

T

 

The league itself does an incredible job of marketing.  Is it fair that the hardest working owner brings in the same profit as the laziest?  No.  But that was the concept they agreed to when they joined the club, just like the illegal draft, unguaranteed contracts and every other unfair violation of individual rights that the NFL is built upon.

 

 

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First off, I cannot believe Bram has his own show. Haven't lived in DC for two years, but lord was he awful, even on updates. Nothing on the other satation?

 

Scondly, BADO i would dipute this point above. Snyder, McNair, Jones etc bought their teams under the assumption that certain revenues would NOT be shared. What Ralph and his cadre of small market teams are trying to do is change the rules now! I happen to agree with Ralphs point.

 

 

Now, if everything is shared, think about how the values of the franchises are affected. The Bills suddenly become worth as much as the Redskins(minus the stadium worth, which the Skins own). Now put yourself in Snydres place. You payed up for the Skins because you believed they could generate more revenue than say the Cardinals or the Bills. However, now with each club having essentially the same revenues guaranteed, it only makes sence that the relative worth of each franchise becomes essentially equal.

 

WE hate to admit it, but ole Ralph likely going to that big football field in the sky within the next 10 yrs at most. As`a father, would you not want to increase the value of the team as much as possible as a legacy for your family. As has been mentioned, his kids do not want the team.

[zow2]

The bottom line is that Ralph is posturing for the small market teams. Sure, some of it may sound unreasonable but that's how you get things done. Make a stink about it...ask for all local revenues to be shared and maybe end up with 50%. IF he doesn't make a big deal about it, he never gets the 50%.

[ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN]

all the posters have made good points. but one has to remember that there IS A SALARY CAP in place right now - and thus, wilson has is only premptively trying to get reveniews if and when the slary cap disolves - if and when the CBA disolves. right now, jones and sheieder make their money their own way, and ralph wants some of that cash. but wilson's team is protected with the league wide salary cap, so those monies brought on by other owners should be deemed unnecessary for him to get. right?

[MadBuffaloDisease]

all the posters have made good points.  but one has to remember that there IS A SALARY CAP in place right now - and thus, wilson has is only premptively trying to get reveniews if and when the slary cap disolves - if and when the CBA disolves.  right now, jones and sheieder make their money their own way, and ralph wants some of that cash.  but wilson's team is protected with the league wide salary cap, so those monies brought on by other owners should be deemed unnecessary for him to get.  right?

This is ALL in response to the proposed new CBA where all revenue will be subject to the salary cap but not shared equally. Better to fire a pre-emptive strike than agree to a rotten deal and then see the effects. And it's plainly obvious that the lower-revenue teams will NOT be able to compete under the new CBA, so again a pre-emptive strike is necessary. Why that's so hard to see, I cannot understand.

 

Oh and again, Ralph isn't proposing that all owners make the same money. Just that all teams are able to spend up to the new cap limit without going into debt. The Redskins will still make gobs of money for Snyder, they just won't be able to outspend all the other clubs and be able to potentially field a better team. If that happens, it will be JUST like MLB with the Yanks and Sox. They don't call him "Snyderbrenner" for no reason.

[ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN]

indeed, but synder and jones are not going to agree to such a deal - as they are spending the money TODAY - to produce a winner in winner in years when and IF the cba does not provide a cap to protect the small teams (buffalo). so why should synder worry about wilson NOW? he owes wilson nothing. what money synder makes is his money and if the league wants to amend the CBA in a few years then they can cross that bridge when they get there. but for wilson to start sticking his hands in other owner's pockets before is tortious IMO. what standing does he have to do so? jones and gibbs have NASCAR nhl logo cars coming this season. ralph wilson deserves some of this cash?

 

 

 

 

 

This is ALL in response to the proposed new CBA where all revenue will be subject to the salary cap but not shared equally.  Better to fire a pre-emptive strike than agree to a rotten deal and then see the effects.  And it's plainly obvious that the lower-revenue teams will NOT be able to compete under the new CBA, so again a pre-emptive strike is necessary.  Why that's so hard to see, I cannot understand. 

 

Oh and again, Ralph isn't proposing that all owners make the same money.  Just that all teams are able to spend up to the new cap limit without going into debt.  The Redskins will still make gobs of money for Snyder, they just won't be able to outspend all the other clubs and be able to potentially field a better team.  If that happens, it will be JUST like MLB with the Yanks and Sox.  They don't call him "Snyderbrenner" for no reason.

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[Sound_n_Fury]

all the posters have made good points.  but one has to remember that there IS A SALARY CAP in place right now - and thus, wilson has is only premptively trying to get reveniews if and when the slary cap disolves - if and when the CBA disolves.  right now, jones and sheieder make their money their own way, and ralph wants some of that cash.  but wilson's team is protected with the league wide salary cap, so those monies brought on by other owners should be deemed unnecessary for him to get.  right?

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I don't see this as a salary cap issue. It's more of a signing bonus issue. Bonus money paid up front has to come out of either the team's operating budget or the owners pocket. Amortizing the bonus (for cap purposes) over the life of the contract is just an accounting game.

 

Ralph's argument is that the big market teams have more revenue to dole out in large signing bonuses, so they have a competitive advantage over the small market teams in snagging the premier FAs.

[ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN]

true, but the bonus - no matter how you pay it out - counts towards the cap. the CAP keeps the lesser market teams competive, simple as that. synder and gibbs and jones are making money on their teams and wilson wants that money - even though he needs non of it to operate his club under the cap.

 

 

I don't see this as a salary cap issue.  It's more of a signing bonus issue.  Bonus money paid up front has to come out of either the team's operating budget or the owners pocket.  Amortizing the bonus (for cap purposes) over the life of the contract is just an accounting game.

 

Ralph's argument is that the big market teams have more revenue to dole out in large signing bonuses, so they have a competitive advantage over the small market teams in snagging the premier FAs.

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[buckeyebrian]

Dan Snyder and the way he runs the Redskins is the problem. The Redskins are going to kill the NFL. Not Mr. Wilson and the way the Bills run things.

 

The Redskins make big profits and don't want to share them. Fair enough as there is plenty of money to go around for now but keep it up and that makes for a league that would look like MLB or even the NHL. Five or Six gigantic payroll teams in the playoffs every year, a couple fluke teams in the playoffs and 20 teams that can't compete. People in the smaller market cities will eventually give up spending their money on consistently losing teams and the league will fall apart much like the NHL has.

 

Fans in Washington get raped year after year by Dan Snyder yet they continually sell out every game even though they don't even sniff the playoffs. I can't figure out why they can treat their fans like dog crap and still be as profitable as they are. I sense a ton of jealousy coming out of DC towards the Bills for no other reason than they wish they had our owner instead of what they have.

 

All Mr. Wilson is doing is looking out for the Bills and the other smaller market teams and in fact, trying to look out for the best interests of the entire league.  (I wouldn't really call the Bills small market except in terms of non-league revenues as we are always in the top 10 in attendance and get gigantic TV ratings in the area market). If they let Dallas, Washington, ect. run wild it will kill the league as we know it.

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Let's not confuse football fans with the corporate and government types that populate the stands and suites at Redskins games. You won't see many Joe Lunchpails at these games. And, since it is the stockholders or taxpayers that are frequently paying the bill for that seat or suite, "fans" don't care what it costs. Add that to the fact that the new stadium in D.C. is HUGE (substantially larger than old RFK), and that there is a waiting list for season tix, and that they have probably the largest suite and premium seat revenue in the league, it's no wonder that the midget throws big bucks at every free agent that comes down the pike. You would think that by now he would realize that championships are not won in that fashion. Snyder is just another carpet-bagger like Jones that is motivated by greed and ego. At this point, RW (who by the way we should not weep for considering how his $25,000 investment made in 1960 has done), is thinking about his legacy and what competitive balance has done for the league in the past few years. Hopefully, the owners will agree on something that will allow the smaller market teams to compete. One would think that even the big guys would not want to end up with a 12 or 16 team league. For sure the players would not.

[jad1]

Sorry, but I have a hard time mustering any sympathy for new owners like Snyder and Jones.

 

Snyder and Gibbs want to put the Redskins logo on NASCAR cars? Whoop-de-friggin-do. Jones wants to turn Cowboy stadium into an amusment park? Big deal.

 

I'll side with the guys who created the Super Bowl over these two clowns.

 

I'll side with the owners who have the networks kissing the NFL's ass every time a new TV contract is signed.

 

I'll side with the owners who have figured out how to have successful franchises in Pittsburgh, Green Bay, and KC (has anyone heard from the Pirates, Brewers, or Royals lately?)

 

If Snyder and Jones can't make back their investments owning two flagship franchises of the NFL, they should sell their teams. These guys can't hold the jocks of the old-school franchise owners.

 

The NFL should cut these two idiots loose and let them try to make it on their own. Judging by their team's performance on the field, they'd go bankrupt in three seasons.

[Kelly the Dog]

Ralph doesn't want to take all of the local money, just a portion of it so the small market teams can field teams fairly. The NFL, as Badol eloquently explained, is far, far better than other sports because of a simple business model: They think of the NFL as the company and all of the teams as satellite offices of that company, all trying to win employee of the month awards. All other leagues, inferior leagues and business models, think of franchising the teams like Subway Sandwiches, privately owned and all under the same name but looking out for and only profiting themselves.

 

The NFL is successful today because Pete Rozelle explained and convinced owners in the large markets like the Maras in NY and Halas in Chicago et al that this was good for the whole, the company. And they bought into it, and agreed they would make less but the league would make more, and they were proven so right it is virtually inarguable. Guys like Jones and Snyder want to break that, and they're selfish and wrong and threaten the company.

[Sound_n_Fury]

true, but the bonus - no matter how you pay it out - counts towards the cap.  the CAP keeps the lesser market teams competive, simple as that.  synder and gibbs and jones are making money on their teams and wilson wants that money - even though he needs non of it to operate his club under the cap.

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I still disagree with you. The cap is not the issue. Small market teams manage the cap as well as (or compared to the Skins', better than) the large market teams.

 

Ralph's worried that the competitive balance will shift to the large market teams if they can start giving out larger and larger signing bonuses. The best FAs will go where the money is and the NFL will become MLB with a handful of haves and a whole lot of have-nots.

 

Bonus money after the initial check is cashed is just an accounting entry on the salary cap. If a guy gets a $20 million signing bonus on a 5-year contract, nothing goes out the door in terms of hard cash in years 2-5, even though the team carries a $4 million charge on its cap each year.

 

The big hit is coming up with the $20 million. For small-revenue teams, it's a whole lot harder than for the Snyders' and Jones' of the world.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

indeed, but synder and jones are not going to agree to such a deal - as they are spending the money TODAY - to produce a winner in winner in years when and IF the cba does not provide a cap to protect the small teams (buffalo).  so why should synder worry about wilson NOW? he owes wilson nothing.  what money synder makes is his money and if the league wants to amend the CBA in a few years then they can cross that bridge when they get there.  but for wilson to start sticking his hands in other owner's pockets before is tortious IMO.  what standing does he have to do so?  jones and gibbs have NASCAR nhl logo cars coming this season.  ralph wilson deserves some of this cash?

Snyder owes Wilson nothing, true. Wilson owes Snyder even LESS, though. And if a compromise isn't reached, the majority of the owners (i.e. a good chunk of the 75% who need to pass a new CBA) will vote against the currently proposed CBA, and Danny Boy can expect an uncapped year in 2007 (probably his ONLY chance at a SB ring with the Redskins) and a lockout in 2008, that will suck huge sums of money from his pocket. That's why he should worry about Wilson and the other smaller market owners. Again Snyder and Jones are nothing without the NFL. It's not like they can break-away from the NFL and still expect to make money. And they can put logos on their asses and parade them in-front of people if they want, but it will be almost impossible to determine what revenue such things will bring to the NFL. Maybe merchandise, but that's already shared. It certainly won't improve ticket sales, since both have waiting lists for tickets.

 

I'm done with this thread. I can only say the same things over and over again. The bottom line is Snyder and Jones are looking to ruin the NFL for their own personal gain. Wilson and others won't let that happen. Sorry. Deal with it.

[BuffaloRebound]

Simple minded people try to say X is exactly like Z because then they don't have to independently think through the differences. The NFL is not like MLB and is certainly not like a regular business from a pure capitalism sense. Each individual team cannot function without the NFL or the other teams, thus they are not really competitors. If Snyder formed his own football team that wasn't part of the NFL, it would be a miserable flop. If I own a pizza joint, I don't need 30 other competitor pizza joints to be successful. If all of those competitor pizza joints went out of business, that can only be good for my pizza joint. There has to be a competitive balance in professional sports leagues and that is why up until this point, the NFL is far and away the premier sports league in America.

[ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN]

You make a fine post, then finish pathetically with a conclusion that's immature. Jones and Synder "can deal with it?" They are the richest owners and are in teh big markets. They ARE IN THE DRIVER's SEAT - not wilson. They are making the league huge, not wilson. Wilson is in the minority now - this is NOT 1961. Read the N.Y. Giant's news clip on the front of the website. you will see that wilson is going to get buried with a negative backlash re: his views and when the cap is lifted will have a hard time fielding a winnig team.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Snyder owes Wilson nothing, true.  Wilson owes Snyder even LESS, though.  And if a compromise isn't reached, the majority of the owners (i.e. a good chunk of the 75% who need to pass a new CBA) will vote against the currently proposed CBA, and Danny Boy can expect an uncapped year in 2007 (probably his ONLY chance at a SB ring with the Redskins) and a lockout in 2008, that will suck huge sums of money from his pocket.    That's why he should worry about Wilson and the other smaller market owners.  Again Snyder and Jones are nothing without the NFL.  It's not like they can break-away from the NFL and still expect to make money.  And they can put logos on their asses and parade them in-front of people if they want, but it will be almost impossible to determine what revenue such things will bring to the NFL.  Maybe merchandise, but that's already shared.  It certainly won't improve ticket sales, since both have waiting lists for tickets.

 

I'm done with this thread.  I can only say the same things over and over again.  The bottom line is Snyder and Jones are looking to ruin the NFL for their own personal gain.  Wilson and others won't let that happen.  Sorry.  Deal with it.

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[Kelly the Dog]

You make a fine post, then finish pathetically with a conclusion that's immature.  Jones and Synder "can deal with it?"  They are the richest owners and are in teh big markets.  They ARE IN THE DRIVER's SEAT - not wilson.  They are making the league huge, not wilson.  Wilson is in the minority now - this is NOT 1961.  Read the N.Y. Giant's news clip on the front of the website.  you will see that wilson is going to get buried with a negative backlash re: his views and when the cap is lifted will have a hard time fielding a winnig team.

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The Giants and The Bergen record are blasting Wilson because they want their stadium. I would be willing to wager of the 32 owners, more like, respect and would side with Ralph Wilson instead of Dan Snyder. And no, they are not making the league huge, the league is making the league huge, and the league means the smaller market as well and equally as the big market. The NFL model, again, is what makes it successful. The sharing model, not the local rev kept model.

[stuckincincy]

The NFLPA is a bit of an unknown, but I'd think it unlikely that the Snyders and the Jones will prevail in upsetting the NFL applecart. This sports business has but 16 games per season plus the handful of playoff games. Nationwide interest is vital.

[ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN]

the entire of this thread, if you go back and read - if that the 'model' you talk about is going to be ruined once the CBA leaves and hence, the salary cap is lifted. the cap protects wilson, once gone, wilson is up **** creek without a padel, thus he is crying bloody murder 3-4 years early. but the other owners will balk at this attempt, as they go forward and he is stuck in 1st gear

 

The Giants and The Bergen record are blasting Wilson because they want their stadium. I would be willing to wager of the 32 owners, more like, respect and would side with Ralph Wilson instead of Dan Snyder. And no, they are not making the league huge, the league is making the league huge, and the league means the smaller market as well and equally as the big market. The NFL model, again, is what makes it successful. The sharing model, not the local rev kept model.

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[Kelly the Dog]

the entire of this thread, if you go back and read - if that the 'model' you talk about is going to be ruined once the CBA leaves and hence, the salary cap is lifted.  the cap protects wilson, once gone, wilson is up **** creek without a padel, thus he is crying bloody murder 3-4 years early.  but the other owners will balk at this attempt, as they go forward and he is stuck in 1st gear

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That is precisely why RW is trying to preserve the sharing model, which needs to be adjusted because of recent events involving new stadiums and local revenues, so the CBA doesnt run out. And why RW will prevail and will be protected and not up the creek. And why Snyder and Jones will begrudingly acquiesce a bit and not prevail. Because the league knows what is best for the league in the long run.

[eventualchamps]

16. Green Bay Packers $609

17. Pittsburgh Steelers $608

18. St. Louis Rams $602

19. Kansas City Chiefs $601

20. New Orleans Saints $585

21. Oakland Raiders $576

22. New York Giants $573

23. Jacksonville Jaguars $569

24. San Francisco 49ers $568

25. New York Jets $567

26. Buffalo Bills $564

27. Cincinnati Bengals $562

28. San Diego Chargers $561

29. Indianapolis Colts $547

30. Minnesota Vikings $542

31. Atlanta Falcons $534

32. Arizona Cardinals $505

 

These are the listed Franchise values for NFL teams (in the bottom half of the league). I couldn't find the actual revenue numbers but I have to imagine that they equate pretty darn close.

I say Ralphie should tell the Skins, the Boys and the others to stick it and we'll form our own league with the "small market" teams. Seems to me like we could put a pretty good product on the field: Michael Vick, Peyton Manning, Favre, Rothlesberger, Eli Manning (assuming he gets better)......and heck, that's only the QB's.

Those other teams need us to make them whole and boost their revenues. Without us they would be MUCH LESS valuable (and vice versa).

Go get 'em Ralph!

[ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN]

what is the date of these numbers?

 

 

16. Green Bay Packers $609

17. Pittsburgh Steelers $608

18. St. Louis Rams $602

19. Kansas City Chiefs $601

20. New Orleans Saints $585

21. Oakland Raiders $576

22. New York Giants $573

23. Jacksonville Jaguars $569

24. San Francisco 49ers $568

25. New York Jets $567

26. Buffalo Bills $564

27. Cincinnati Bengals $562

28. San Diego Chargers $561

29. Indianapolis Colts $547

30. Minnesota Vikings $542

31. Atlanta Falcons $534

32. Arizona Cardinals $505

 

These are the listed Franchise values for NFL teams (in the bottom half of the league).  I couldn't find the actual revenue numbers but I have to imagine that they equate pretty darn close.

I say Ralphie should tell the Skins, the Boys and the others to stick it and we'll form our own league with the "small market" teams.  Seems to me like we could put a pretty good product on the field:  Michael Vick,  Peyton Manning, Favre, Rothlesberger, Eli Manning (assuming he gets better)......and heck, that's only the QB's. 

Those other teams need us to make them whole and boost their revenues.  Without us they would be MUCH LESS valuable (and vice versa).

Go get 'em Ralph!

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