Rayzer32 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 You hope. 258888[/snapback] Damn right I do!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Well at least he'll have 3 rings to console himself! 258850[/snapback] Yeah, I don't feel too sorry for Troy Brown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Renko Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Are we ignoring the fact that Troy Brown restructured the year before? He deferred all this salary with the idea that he would be paid this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood Donahoe Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Are we ignoring the fact that Troy Brown restructured the year before? He deferred all this salary with the idea that he would be paid this year. That not how restructures work. Brown got more money up front in guaranteed bonus, which was then spread over the life of the contract, lessening the '04 cap hit and increasing the '05 cap hit. Brown likely knew that the restructure meant he would be released in '05. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fartacus Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 That not how restructures work. Brown got more money up front in guaranteed bonus, which was then spread over the life of the contract, lessening the '04 cap hit and increasing the '05 cap hit. Brown likely knew that the restructure meant he would be released in '05. 258933[/snapback] AHHHHHH! FACTS, MY EYES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Renko Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 That not how restructures work. Brown got more money up front in guaranteed bonus, which was then spread over the life of the contract, lessening the '04 cap hit and increasing the '05 cap hit. Brown likely knew that the restructure meant he would be released in '05. 258933[/snapback] My understanding was that he did not receive much upfront money in the form of a signing bonus in his 2004 restructuring. He was only paid 760K in salary and in this coming season he was going to make 2.5 million in salary with a 2.5 roster bonus. Can you provide the details of this restructuring prior to 2004? If it was all about converting salary into upfront money it seems that there should not have been this much savings on the table to cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Renko Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 AHHHHHH! FACTS, MY EYES! 258937[/snapback] Thanks for your contribution. But by the way, the standard and basic way of restructuring is to covert salary to bonus but it is often far from the only way. Sometimes players take straight paycuts, sometimes players move actual salary to later years as well as put things like roster bonuses in their contracts for later years. This and initial contract neogotiations is precisely why there are often so many huge cap numbers for players in later years that can be saved by cutting them. This wouldn't be the case if it was pure bonus because otherwise, cutting wouldn't really save any money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood Donahoe Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 My understanding was that he did not receive much upfront money in the form of a signing bonus in his 2004 restructuring. He was only paid 760K in salary... He didn't receive any new upfront money in his '04 restructuring, because that's not how restructuring works. His salary was only $760,000 because the Pats converted the rest into guaranteed bonus to be spread over the life of the contract. The money he got was EXACTLY the same, he just got it sooner, and the team was able to spread parts of it over two years instead of one. Again, this is all common restructuring stuff. Here's the link to some documentation. Scroll down to Brown's May 26, 2004 update. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandt38 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 He didn't receive any new upfront money in his '04 restructuring, because that's not how restructuring works. His salary was only $760,000 because the Pats converted the rest into guaranteed bonus to be spread over the life of the contract. The money he got was EXACTLY the same, he just got it sooner, and the team was able to spread parts of it over two years instead of one. Again, this is all common restructuring stuff. Here's the link to some documentation. Scroll down to Brown's May 26, 2004 update. 259214[/snapback] But they saved 2.5 in a signing bonus for this year. Sure it was the same money overall, but by deferring the bonus to this years contract they sucessfully screwed him out of 2.5 in deferred signing bonus, and the backloaded salary also cost him money. The same money would have been made had he been kept on this year, but he was not and therefor lost money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood Donahoe Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 But they saved 2.5 in a signing bonus for this year. Sure it was the same money overall, but by deferring the bonus to this years contract they sucessfully screwed him out of 2.5 in deferred signing bonus, and the backloaded salary also cost him money. The same money would have been made had he been kept on this year, but he was not and therefor lost money. I have no idea what you're talking about. Brown lost no money in this deal. Please read the documentation further if this is not clear to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKC Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 Say what you will about Belichek, but he seems to know when to let a player go. If he says it was in the Pat's best interests to let Brown go, it probably was. 258760[/snapback] The value proposition of carrying a guy who obviously doesn't fit your O model anymore in the first 2 slots at his primary position plus will be easily replaced with a real CB at a lesser salary makes the move the right one for the good of their talent pool. The deeper question is whether the well begins to dry up on the "team" campaign with these types of moves and to date with Belichick it hasn't. You can't argue with the rings- then again if I had a Cohiba for every genius who returned to a steady diet of cans in this league I wouldn't have all that space in my humidor right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 You know it will end at some point! Milloy came off as an ass in that interview a few weeks back, but essentially, he was right...team loyalty does not normally go both ways in sports. Guys like Brown, Law, Milloy, etc etc have helped the Patriots become a model franchise, both on and off the field. Once the players start wanting their piece of the pie, they are shown the exit! It almost seems that the Patriots will unravel internally, rather than on the field. As a Bills fan, I would like to see it sooner, rather than later.... 258765[/snapback] i think milloy was right, but pro athletes always end up sounding like jackasses when they use the "feed the family line," as if they're fighting for survival at the local homeless shelter. if i was an agent, i'd tell my client NEVER to use that sorry line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 If it is any consolation, they don't treat their fans good also (outside of winning). In the recent SI (3-7), "Who's Hot/Who's Not" page... It appears that "Patriots Faithful" is not doing so well and are "Who's Not"... Patriots Faithful Fan favorite Ty Law is out (released), and gouging is in. Ticket prices were hiked 20%, and while Pats announced they'll relax no-transfer policy on season tickets--team got bad press last year after a ticket holder died and Pats demanded the tickets back from his cancer-stricken son--it comes at a price. Transferring to family members costs $2,500-$5,000 a seat. I have always said that the Pats were all about money because Kraft is up to his neck with the "Razor"... Watch out for the nicks Bob! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fartacus Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 If it is any consolation, they don't treat their fans good also (outside of winning). In the recent SI (3-7), "Who's Hot/Who's Not" page... It appears that "Patriots Faithful" is not doing so well and are "Who's Not"... Patriots Faithful Fan favorite Ty Law is out (released), and gouging is in. Ticket prices were hiked 20%, and while Pats announced they'll relax no-transfer policy on season tickets--team got bad press last year after a ticket holder died and Pats demanded the tickets back from his cancer-stricken son--it comes at a price. Transferring to family members costs $2,500-$5,000 a seat. I have always said that the Pats were all about money because Kraft is up to his neck with the "Razor"... Watch out for the nicks Bob! 259989[/snapback] It would be quite gullible of anyone to believe that Most if not all NFL teams treat this like a business and cut players whom they feel arent living up to their contracts. Regarding the Pats ownership, IIRC, didnt Kraft finance that stadium with 100% of his own money and then elected not to charge PSL's? The guy has won 3 of the last 4 Super Bowls and demand is VERY high there. It would be stupid not to raise prices. Simple economics. The transfer thing is a bit dopey but again, no PSLs come with a price I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 It would be quite gullible of anyone to believe that Most if not all NFL teams treat this like a business and cut players whom they feel arent living up to their contracts. Regarding the Pats ownership, IIRC, didnt Kraft finance that stadium with 100% of his own money and then elected not to charge PSL's? The guy has won 3 of the last 4 Super Bowls and demand is VERY high there. It would be stupid not to raise prices. Simple economics. The transfer thing is a bit dopey but again, no PSLs come with a price I guess. 260173[/snapback] Ya... I was just whining. The demand will be in many ways... They gotta do everyhting to win or they die. The stakes are high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fartacus Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 Ya... I was just whining. The demand will be in many ways... They gotta do everyhting to win or they die. The stakes are high. 260190[/snapback] Thats SOP in the NFL. Any team that believes otherwise is usually left in the dust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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