Royale with Cheese Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) The data from the combine says he's a great athlete. Guys with his test scores routinely go to the NFL and become perennial All Pros. That's a fact. That's all I care about. Guys with his athleticism fit in any defense. He might not be an every down base defensive end (I think otherwise), so you play him at SLB in your 4-3 sets and DE when you go Nickel. Von Miller has been used the same way in Denver. Over the years, they've flipped back and forth between 3-4 and 4-3 schemes, and he's always been incredibly productive. Watt's test scores say he's the same player, and given the track record of success for guys with this level of athleticism, I want this guy on our team. His test scores are also very similar to Bruce Irvin who's a pretty decent pro. Is he undoubtedly more Von Miller or Bruce Irvin? The tape doesn't show Von Miller but seems like the combine numbers are more important than game film.... Edited March 15, 2017 by Teeflebees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) His test scores are also very similar to Bruce Irvin who's a pretty decent pro. Is he undoubtedly more Von Miller or Bruce Irvin? The tape doesn't show Von Miller but seems like the combine numbers are more important than game film.... I don't know, but if his floor is Bruce Irvin he's worth at least a mid first round pick. You can make a pretty strong case that his intangibles (Irvin had numerous off the field issues coming out of college) move his floor a little higher than Irvin. He's squeaky clean off the field and his motor is relentless. You know Watt is a guy who is going to put the time in off the field to get bigger and stronger. The Clay Matthews comparisons seem to make the most sense. Most of the guys who post his type of measurable numbers are phenomenal, game changing football players. I think we need more of those guys on our team. Edited March 15, 2017 by jrober38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KellyToughII Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I say pick the kid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I don't know, but if his floor is Bruce Irvin he's worth at least a mid first round pick. You can make a pretty strong case that his intangibles (Irvin had numerous off the field issues coming out of college) move his floor a little higher than Irvin. The Clay Matthews comparisons seem to make the most sense. Most of the guys who post his type of measurable numbers are phenomenal, game changing football players. I'm not saying you're completely in the wrong. I just find it a bit odd that with these numbers, more than one scouting report says he's not explosive off the ball. Zeirling a very well known scout says he lacks explosion out of stance, another report (don't know that scout) says he's very slow out of stance. That's Von Millers biggest positive...explosive first step that makes him a terror on the edge. Very fast twitch guy. Is Watt a good tester but doesn't apply that on the field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 Is Watt a good tester but doesn't apply that on the field? I'm not sure it matters. Guys who put up his test numbers are almost always really good pros. As I said earlier, this is a 22 year old guy who is just scratching his potential. Put him in an NFL calibre weight program for a year or two and you're going to have an elite pass rusher on your hands. Bruce Irvin is probably the least successful guy with these type of scores, and he's still a really good player. The floor for a guy with this type of athleticism is very high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Maiden Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I would be very pleased if we get that guy...looks like the real deal ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 What was his vertical jump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 What was his vertical jump? 37 inches at 252 lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I'm not sure it matters. Guys who put up his test numbers are almost always really good pros. As I said earlier, this is a 22 year old guy who is just scratching his potential. Put him in an NFL calibre weight program for a year or two and you're going to have an elite pass rusher on your hands. Bruce Irvin is probably the least successful guy with these type of scores, and he's still a really good player. The floor for a guy with this type of athleticism is very high. You're saying game film doesn't matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) You're saying game film doesn't matter? To some degree, but it doesn't seem to matter a ton. Guys with his type of measurables don't bust as DEs or 3-4 OLBs. Guys like Watt work out and become very good NFL players at an extremely high rate. JJ Watt's game film said his first step wasn't very good. Scouting reports are wrong all the time. And with that said, it's not like his scouting reports are describing a bad player. TJ Watt has been a late 1st round pick for a while now. His combine test scores will move him up into the top 15 picks. Edited March 15, 2017 by jrober38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 37 inches at 252 lbs. That's pretty impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 To some degree, but it doesn't seem to matter a ton. Guys with his type of measurables don't bust as DEs or 3-4 OLBs. Guys like Watt work out and become very good NFL players at an extremely high rate. JJ Watt's game film said his first step wasn't very good. Scouting reports are wrong all the time. And with that said, it's not like his scouting reports are describing a bad player. TJ Watt has been a late 1st round pick for a while now. His combine test scores will move him up into the top 15 picks. After reading through here, Great posting. Proper dialogue from all. Nice. and now i am interested in this Kid ! Scheme be damned !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) That's pretty impressive. Yeah, I read somewhere that he tested in the 94th percentile of all athletes at the combine. His combo of athleticism and intangibles is going to make him a stud in the NFL. Edited March 15, 2017 by jrober38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 To some degree, but it doesn't seem to matter a ton. Guys with his type of measurables don't bust as DEs or 3-4 OLBs. Guys like Watt work out and become very good NFL players at an extremely high rate. JJ Watt's game film said his first step wasn't very good. Scouting reports are wrong all the time. And with that said, it's not like his scouting reports are describing a bad player. TJ Watt has been a late 1st round pick for a while now. His combine test scores will move him up into the top 15 picks. Not all had him as a late 1st rounder....I was reading 2nd and 3rd a few weeks ago. After this combine, he'll probably be at least a late first rounder. He might sneak ahead into top 20. I think he will be a nice player but comparing him to Von Miller is very premature....Miller is a generational type player. There isn't a faster guy off the ball than him in a long time....that's why he went #2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) Not all had him as a late 1st rounder....I was reading 2nd and 3rd a few weeks ago. After this combine, he'll probably be at least a late first rounder. He might sneak ahead into top 20. I think he will be a nice player but comparing him to Von Miller is very premature....Miller is a generational type player. There isn't a faster guy off the ball than him in a long time....that's why he went #2. Fair enough. I think he's got a good chance to be an elite NFL pass rusher. Von Miller probably is premature as a comparison, but the Clay Matthews comparisons make a lot of sense. Matthews obviously has never been an every down DE, but you could still probably plug him in as a SLB in your base package in a 4-3 and kick him to the edge in your Nickel package. Elite athleticism, elite intangibles, prototypical size, scheme diverse, incredible blood lines. I think you can do a lot worse with a 1st round pick than roll the dice on a guy with all that going for him. Edited March 15, 2017 by jrober38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 Fair enough. I think he's got a good chance to be an elite NFL pass rusher. Von Miller probably is premature as a comparison, but the Clay Matthews comparisons make a lot of sense. Matthews obviously has never been an every down DE, but you could still probably plug him in as a SLB in your base package in a 4-3 and kick him to the edge in your Nickel package. Elite athleticism, elite intangibles, prototypical size, scheme diverse, incredible blood lines. I think you can do a lot worse with a 1st round pick than roll the dice on a guy with all that going for him. I think Clay Matthews is a better comparison yes. But we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 I think Clay Matthews is a better comparison yes. But we will see. Ideally we'd trade down a couple spots (someone wants to leapfrog Cleveland for a QB), but the likelihood of that happening is small. Right now my first three rounds is: 1. TJ Watt - DE, Wisconsin 2. Teez Tabor - CB, Florida 3. Nathan Peterman - QB, Pitt Then use rounds 5 and 6 adding WRs and OL help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 Ideally we'd trade down a couple spots (someone wants to leapfrog Cleveland for a QB), but the likelihood of that happening is small. Right now my first three rounds is: 1. TJ Watt - DE, Wisconsin 2. Teez Tabor - CB, Florida 3. Nathan Peterman - QB, Pitt Then use rounds 5 and 6 adding WRs and OL help. I like Peterman. Unless we sign another FA safety, I see is taking one in the first 3 rounds. McDermott plays a lot of Cover 3 I understand. WR probably up there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) I like Peterman. Unless we sign another FA safety, I see is taking one in the first 3 rounds. McDermott plays a lot of Cover 3 I understand. WR probably up there too. We have a ton of needs and we can't fill them all. Long terms, I think Watt becomes a special edge rusher, Tabor becomes a #1 CB and Peterman has the potential be something similar to Kirk Cousins (lots of analysts are moving him up their boards as they study him more). I don't think the Bills value the WR position beyond Sammy. They went dumpster diving in FA last year and they've done the same this year. Safety is a huge need but the draft is top heavy. Beyond the top 2 guys there's not much to get excited about IMO. Next year you go after a DT, S and WR. Possibly a linebacker as well. Edited March 15, 2017 by jrober38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Holmes Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 I don't know, but if his floor is Bruce Irvin he's worth at least a mid first round pick. You can make a pretty strong case that his intangibles (Irvin had numerous off the field issues coming out of college) move his floor a little higher than Irvin. He's squeaky clean off the field and his motor is relentless. You know Watt is a guy who is going to put the time in off the field to get bigger and stronger. The Clay Matthews comparisons seem to make the most sense. Most of the guys who post his type of measurable numbers are phenomenal, game changing football players. I think we need more of those guys on our team. Love Clay as well... I would want a Watt with our first pick why not? A lot of you guys want to tank anyways lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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