ROCCEO Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Excellent analysis, Mark. A well thought-out post and a great analogy. Unfortunately, the topic was somewhat brought down by those that see the name "Bledsoe" and already have a response in mind, no matter what the point. Regardless, nicely done. 202620[/snapback] I agree that it was a solid post. Last night I was just thinking about how Drew is fine most of the time but he'll just never be able to consistently beat good defenses. They eat him up, and unfortunately for us, you have to face no less than 2 on the way to the super bowl usually. So, let the competition begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 I dunno Mark. I really liked that "Don't Pay the Ferryman" tune. Actually, Mark, Losman has shown us a lot. He has shown us he likes to run, which may be exciting and all but will much increase the likelihood that he's watching games rather than participating. He seems to be the raw, improvisational type which again makes for exciting ball but again can be for the wrong reasons. I see someone who needs to mature as a player, learn more poise on the field (the difference between Losman and Roth), which can be done off-field, and I hope it can be accomplished in one off-season. I have a lot more faith in this staff to get him there than the staff we had the last time we drafted a "QB of the future." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 "Players who can only take you so far." When referring to QBs, that sounds like another way of saying QBs who you design safe offensive game plans around. QBs who "don't lose" games for you, instead of QBs who can "win" games for you. I don't necessarily want a QB who we are dependent on to win, like a Marino. I just want a QB who creates opportunities (for us, that is)...someone who is more an asset than a liability... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 I think the issue (problem) in this discussion is that some folks seem to be motivated by being sick of Bledsoe rather than being motivated by what;s good for the Bills. These two motivations may both end up being solved by the same thing, namely JP proves to be the man. However, these are two different things and if JP proves for some reason not to be the man or even not to be the man right now, then the two motivations are at loggerheads. My view as a Bills fan is that I view JP as the man. When he is ready to play I think he should be play and I desperately hope that the future is soon and that he is ready to play soon. However, I am well aware that the football gods don't always listen to me. Believe it or not as much as I think JP looks pretty talented from the resume I have seen, and looks pretty talented from the brief game appearances I have seen, based on the assessment of a Bills braintrust I have grown to have more and more faith in he was not ready to play this past year. I trust the Bills' braintrust to play JP when he is ready to play and if not to play the QB who gives us the best chance of getting to the promised land. Whether you or I like it or not if JP ain't ready that is Drew Bledsoe. I really doubt its Shane Matthews. Last I checked Peyton Manning was not available to us. I think that if you root for the Bills it would be pretty reasonable to be locked in a mode now where you want JP to go as soon as he is ready to go and if not you want Bledsoe to play and do well. As fans we are all certainly entitled to our opinions as to whether JP is ready to play yet or not. However, from my perspective I have faith in MM and the gang making the correct judgment which was this past season to play Bledsoe and right now Bledsoe is the starter, but like all NFL players he will need to win this job in mini-camp and pre-season. That is fine with me. The real question now for Bills fans is whether you have faith in MM and co. to make the right judgment on QB. I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 I think the issue (problem) in this discussion is that some folks seem to be motivated by being sick of Bledsoe rather than being motivated by what;s good for the Bills. These two motivations may both end up being solved by the same thing, namely JP proves to be the man. However, these are two different things and if JP proves for some reason not to be the man or even not to be the man right now, then the two motivations are at loggerheads. My view as a Bills fan is that I view JP as the man. When he is ready to play I think he should be play and I desperately hope that the future is soon and that he is ready to play soon. However, I am well aware that the football gods don't always listen to me. Believe it or not as much as I think JP looks pretty talented from the resume I have seen, and looks pretty talented from the brief game appearances I have seen, based on the assessment of a Bills braintrust I have grown to have more and more faith in he was not ready to play this past year. I trust the Bills' braintrust to play JP when he is ready to play and if not to play the QB who gives us the best chance of getting to the promised land. Whether you or I like it or not if JP ain't ready that is Drew Bledsoe. I really doubt its Shane Matthews. Last I checked Peyton Manning was not available to us. I think that if you root for the Bills it would be pretty reasonable to be locked in a mode now where you want JP to go as soon as he is ready to go and if not you want Bledsoe to play and do well. As fans we are all certainly entitled to our opinions as to whether JP is ready to play yet or not. However, from my perspective I have faith in MM and the gang making the correct judgment which was this past season to play Bledsoe and right now Bledsoe is the starter, but like all NFL players he will need to win this job in mini-camp and pre-season. That is fine with me. The real question now for Bills fans is whether you have faith in MM and co. to make the right judgment on QB. I do. 202652[/snapback] I've read your comments the past few days on this topic, FFS, and I get what you're saying. I agree with you, in that I have faith in this staff to decide when and if JP is ready. But the reality, as I see it, is this: Can we win the Super Bowl with Drew at the helm next year? My opinion is no. Could we make the playoffs next year with Drew? I think there's a good chance of it. Some of this depends on what happens this offseason at other positions, but if we assume we start off next year where we left off this year, I think we'll have a good shot at a wild card. So the next question is: Is that good enough? That's a tough one. The way I see it, in my opinion, not quite. If the future is JP (and it is), and we are not likely to win the Super Bowl next year with Drew at the helm, then what are we doing? I think it's quite possible that we take a step backward with JP in his first year. It's impossible to tell. But that's what I have faith in the coaching staff to decide. This may be an ideal time to have JP start the learning process, with a strong defense returning mostly intact, an offensive line that is finally getting their act together and is returning mostly intact, and two emerging stars on offense that should only get better next year. You could use that same argument to say that the time is right to have Drew return next season as the starter, to show what he is ultimately capable of with an improving team around him. I just don't think he can take us to the promised land, and that's what it's all about after all, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark VI Posted January 12, 2005 Author Share Posted January 12, 2005 This may be an ideal time to have JP start the learning process, with a strong defense returning mostly intact, an offensive line that is finally getting their act together and is returning mostly intact, and two emerging stars on offense that should only get better next year.You could use that same argument to say that the time is right to have Drew return next season as the starter, to show what he is ultimately capable of with an improving team around him. I just don't think he can take us to the promised land, and that's what it's all about after all, isn't it? 202710[/snapback] The good Doctor is wise. My thinking exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 DeBerg never made half as many bone-headed plays as Drew has. He was a serviceable NFL QB with limitations, namely arm strength... IMO a 32-year-old DeBerg would've beat the Steelers in Week 17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRW Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 My opinion is no. Could we make the playoffs next year with Drew? I think there's a good chance of it. Some of this depends on what happens this offseason at other positions, but if we assume we start off next year where we left off this year, I think we'll have a good shot at a wild card. So the next question is: Is that good enough? 202710[/snapback] That's the basic divide on this issue, ain't it? At this point a playoff appearance would make me damn happy after the last few years. While I agree that the ultimate goal is a Super Bowl win, I won't be too disappointed if we don't win one as long as we're in the hunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 The good Doctor is wise. My thinking exactly. 202715[/snapback] Do you mean Doctor ICE? That is his exact viewpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 That's the basic divide on this issue, ain't it? At this point a playoff appearance would make me damn happy after the last few years. While I agree that the ultimate goal is a Super Bowl win, I won't be too disappointed if we don't win one as long as we're in the hunt. 202777[/snapback] I do agree completely with this. If we had made the playoffs this year, I would have been ecstatic just to have been there after all this time. Would we win the Super Bowl this year? No way. So why is it different for next year? Because we have a young, talented QB getting paid millions just sitting on the bench. Do we want to rush him in and possibly hurt his development? Not at all, but that's the kind of judgement I'll leave to the coaching staff. If Drew starts next year because JP isn't ready yet (in their minds), I can live with that. Will we win the Super Bowl? Nope. But if JP is even close to being ready, why put off his development another year? If we could, possibly, win the Super Bowl with JP somewhere down the line, why not get started down that road sooner rather than later, particularly if we don't think we can win the Super Bowl with our current QB? Mind you, I don't know if we can win the SB with JP or not. I'd sure like to find that out. I do have the opinion, however, that we won't win the SB with Drew. If we have a quality defense right now, and an offensive line that's improving right now, and some emerging stars on offense right now, then if JP is even close to being ready why not put all those pieces together right now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Do you mean Doctor ICE? That is his exact viewpoint. 202779[/snapback] Good God, I'm being compared to ICE? Now I've heard everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Good God, I'm being compared to ICE? Now I've heard everything. 202783[/snapback] Not you, but your quote. I do not know either of you. ICE however is the first that I have seen come out with the "anything less than a superbowl win is a failure" stance. This gives him a 31 out of 32 chance of being "right." Imo, once a team is in the playoffs, anything can happen. Look at the jests! The advanced, and now face a rookie qb. If ALL I cared about was winning a superbowl, I would have abandoned the Bills like a fair weather fan. This will never happen. I am hoping to see the qb on the field in 05 who will win the most games. I happen to think that is Drew. Btw, I also think that chances are, Drew will get hurt and JP will get his shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark VI Posted January 12, 2005 Author Share Posted January 12, 2005 Drew had his stage set at home against Pittsburgh and turned in a dreadful performance. How could we expect to go deep into the playoffs after viewing that effort. Others shared in the bad effort, I realize. Who's ICE ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRW Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 I do agree completely with this. If we had made the playoffs this year, I would have been ecstatic just to have been there after all this time. Would we win the Super Bowl this year? No way. So why is it different for next year? Because we have a young, talented QB getting paid millions just sitting on the bench. Do we want to rush him in and possibly hurt his development? Not at all, but that's the kind of judgement I'll leave to the coaching staff. If Drew starts next year because JP isn't ready yet (in their minds), I can live with that. Will we win the Super Bowl? Nope. But if JP is even close to being ready, why put off his development another year? If we could, possibly, win the Super Bowl with JP somewhere down the line, why not get started down that road sooner rather than later, particularly if we don't think we can win the Super Bowl with our current QB? 202782[/snapback] And I also agree with this. If JP makes strides over the offseason and is close even to Drew's current level I will be ready to see what he can do. My only objection is to those (not you or Mark VI based on these posts) who seem to think that we should put JP out there even if he does not show that he has settled down enough to play at the NFL level. To the posters who ask how much worse it could be than Drew, I think the answer is much, much worse. Look at QB play around the league. I don't think Drew is capable of carrying this team, but there are guys out there who are walking disasters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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