OldTimer1960 Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) Solid job. But that's a reach for Jones, he's a 3rd rounder. Hunt won't last that long. Thomas likely goes earlier, as well. I like people talking about how Barkley doesn't have much upside, but he's probably got the most out of anybody in the draft... Some people are confusing better arm strength with better "up side" whatever that is. My understanding of "up side" is a player who is perceived to have the physical/mental talent and/or "want to" to improve with coaching and experience. Just because, say, Tyler Bray has a stronger arm than Barkley, it doesn't necessarily mean that he has more upside. Let's assume for the sake of this argument that Barkley has an adequate arm (middle of the road NFL arm) and Bray has an arm that puts him in the upper 25% of NFL QBs in terms of arm strength. Though very hard to assess, I believe that Barkley has far superior ability to read defenses and process what he sees more quickly than Bray. Look at the top NFL QBs today: Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees... They don't have canons for arms - but JP Losman did. I know which QBs I'd rather have out of that bunch. The reason that it is so hard to assess rookie QB talent is that the most important aspects of QB are very difficult to assess: leadership skills, ability to process what they see quickly, work ethic/study habits, toughness, how they react under a heavy pass rush, etc. As long as a prospect has "enough" arm strength and mobility, they can succeed if they are very good at the other less tangible skills. On the flip side, if scouts don't feel that Barkley has even adequate arm strength for the NFL, then he is likely no better than a career backup. All the intangibles in the world won't completely overcome not having enough arm strength to keep defenses honest. Edited March 31, 2013 by OldTimer1960 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marauderswr80 Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Whis to say we dont go WR first 2 picks! Patterson then woods! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Whis to say we dont go WR first 2 picks! Patterson then woods! I think that is certainly less crazy than QB with the 1st two picks. At least they can both play at the same time. As far as I am concerned the Bills have 1 WR and a TE coming off of major surgery. Someone has to catch the ball. I wouldn't be surprised if the Bills drafted 2 WR and a TE. I am guessing a WR early (1 or 2) and then a mid to late round guy but I wouldn't be shocked if 2 of their first 4 picks were on WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted April 1, 2013 Author Share Posted April 1, 2013 I hate posting from my phone so I had to wait to be at work... Does today's news make anyone want to take another stab at their mock drafts? I don't want to turn this into a kolb thread but it doesn't really. My feelings on the signing are that it makes them much less desperate. It doesn't change the fact that they still need a qb it just openee up some options depending on how the draft shakes out. I am concerned about Arizona "stealing" Barkley and believe the Bills might be too. If he is gone I can see them now waiting. Before the signing I think they would have been stuck taking a qb at 8 just to insure they got 1 of their guys. Agree on Barkley but Margus Hunt is a first rounder and Barrett Jones is a fourth rounder I keep asking and can't seem to get an answer. Is it really the injury? Is it that he played next to studs? Doing a bit more research and some rankings have him as a4th round prospect! If so my mock would have to be changed a bit. I'll have to ponder that. Is there any concerns about his ability that you are aware of though? I agree, i don't get the love for Barkley either. Not only in his arm strength but also with the recent failure of USC QB's, Sanchez / Leinart. Carson Palmer was allowed to sit and develop a bit and even so look at him now. Bills fans just don't realize how tough it is to throw in RWS at times. That stadium is particularly tricky for kickers and QB's when the winds kick up. I don't like Geno Smith or EJ Manuel either for various reasons, as both have the physical tools needed its just I'm very skeptical about their ability to fully develop into starting NFL QB's, reading defenses ECT. I've railed enough against this faulty logic to not crusade again but here I am.... Leinhart, Palmer, and Sanchez all had the same coach. Barkley didn't. All of them played on stacked teams with multiple first round picks. Barkley didn't. He was at USC when players went elsewhere due to recruiting/bowl restrictions. He didn't get the chance to play on the absolutely stacked teams that others did. Here's another big difference - he was the first 4 year starter in school history! He didn't start for 1 season (Sanchez), He didn't only have 1 season above 60% completion (Palmer), and he didn't play on what some considered to be one of the greatest college teams of all time (Leinhart - and they lost that championship to Texas). He owns the single game mark for yards and tds (different games), and is the first ever 3 time captain at USC. Long story short - he isn't those players! Whis to say we dont go WR first 2 picks! Patterson then woods! Does Patterson scare the crap out of anyone else? This guy has bust potential all over him imo (I guess every player does but still...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonbrigade Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Worst draft ever, if the Bills draft this way I will become a Phish fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted April 1, 2013 Author Share Posted April 1, 2013 Worst draft ever, if the Bills draft this way I will become a Phish fan. I appreciate your in depth analysis and what you would have done differently! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 I haven't done enough study to go as deep as you guys are going at this point. So I can only comment on Matt Barkley. I studied all his video from his outstanding 2011 season which consisted of watching 11 games. That means I watched 11 games of Matt Barkley's best season. I chose not to watch 2012 though I probably will at some point. Barkley IS by far the most pro-ready QB in the draft. He is extremely polished. He is smart and tough. He gets the ball out on time, throws to spots, has excellent accuracy and great ball placement for his receivers. He's almost the complete package. But I'm scared to death of his arm strength. Even in 2011 when he was healthy I would say that his arm strength was at best, below average for an NFL quarterback. There are QBs out there who put up a few good seasons but ultimately failed as NFL starters (ie-Matt Cassel) simply due to weak arms. Barkley's arm is weak. There's no sugar coating it. I've actually seen him get the ball 58 yards in the air on deep balls but his intermediate throws have zero velocity. There's another thing that really scares me about Barkley. It jumped out at me while watching these 11 games and I'll let the website describe it: The system itself is a bit of a paradox – as stated, he has autonomy to get himself into the best plays and situations based on what the defense is giving him. On the other hand, the offense gives him a lot of easy, unchallenging throws that pad his stats and keep the offense on schedule and in manageable situations (over 50% of his throws occur no further than 5 yards downfield, with almost a quarter being passes thrown behind the line of scrimmage). My words: He is a dink and dunk quarterback who consistently failed to stretch the defense. I believe this is what hurt his 2012 season. I don't put much stock in website scouting reports but if I notice something on video that I see discussed in a scouting report, well obviously it carries more weight for me. http://draftbreakdown.com/players/matt-barkley I guess I'll re-post this in the Barkley thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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