Bronc24 Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Anyone who runs their personal finances like your government runs their's would have been living under a bridge a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted December 22, 2012 Author Share Posted December 22, 2012 (edited) Interesting little graph: Edited December 22, 2012 by SameOldBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Face it. Both sides want to go over the cliff - sideways so they get the cuts in spending and the increases in taxes that they want. Get in tune with your "I'm paying my fair share" self. The sooner the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted December 22, 2012 Author Share Posted December 22, 2012 (edited) Face it. Both sides want to go over the cliff - sideways so they get the cuts in spending and the increases in taxes that they want. Get in tune with your "I'm paying my fair share" self. The sooner the better. Obviously neither side actually wants that. The Dems/WH want the taxes but not on everybody...they hate the tax that hits the "middle class." The Repubs want the spending cuts but likewise hate the defense cuts. Both sides hate the overall effect on the economy. And while people can debate the political cost of going over the cliff and for who it is worse...it's a net loss for both. The bottom line though is the longer Boehner negotiates the more ground he loses on the tax increases...could have had it at 800B last time, now can get it around 1.2T...and in a few months he'll be wishing he got it at 1.2 b/c it will go higher. At some point he's going to have to build a little pack of Repubs who will deal and just bargain with the Dems in the house with that group to get the best deal they can....Plan B suggests there's no other way b/c he isn't going to bring a majority of house GOP to a position where they would accept anything negotiated. Edited December 22, 2012 by SameOldBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Anyone who runs their personal finances like your government runs their's would have been living under a bridge a long time ago. Or should be renamed, "Quebec". Obviously neither side actually wants that. The Dems/WH want the taxes but not on everybody...they hate the tax that hits the "middle class." The Repubs want the spending cuts but likewise hate the defense cuts. Both sides hate the overall effect on the economy. And while people can debate the political cost of going over the cliff and for who it is worse...it's a net loss for both. The bottom line though is the longer Boehner negotiates the more ground he loses on the tax increases...could have had it at 800B last time, now can get it around 1.2T...and in a few months he'll be wishing he got it at 1.2 b/c it will go higher. The sad thing is, you are actually at a point where something productive could be done without complete austerity. Eventually, it won't be as pleasant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Interesting little graph: You need to provide a link to your source(s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomato can Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 At some point he's going to have to build a little pack of Repubs who will deal and just bargain with the Dems in the house with that group to get the best deal they can....Plan B suggests there's no other way b/c he isn't going to bring a majority of house GOP to a position where they would accept anything negotiated. Doesn't appear that the Repubs are to happy with Boehner! http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/12/21/House-Republican-members-circulate-plan-to-oust-Speaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Those who like to do "scorekeeping" on the congressional budget talks, really don't seem to understand how difficult things are going to get for Americans in January and over the next four years; Obama's Regulatory Cliff Is Bigger Problem Than Fiscal Cliff Obama announces new wave of proposed regulations The ObamaCare Fiscal Cliff Only 15 States Opt to Run Obamacare Exchanges . ..."theres nothing like visible turmoil to get our bickering politicians to work together"...this is how I see it playing out. they won't act responsibly til forced but ya never know, maybe they'll surprise us all. if not, which party's agendas have the most chance of passing at that moment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 ..."theres nothing like visible turmoil to get our bickering politicians to work together"...this is how I see it playing out. they won't act responsibly til forced but ya never know, maybe they'll surprise us all. if not, which party's agendas have the most chance of passing at that moment? Obama is restricted to getting his agenda by edict. Many Republicans in the House were voted in to keep Obama from passing his agenda. That is the lesson that certain Republicans haven't learned yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/12/22/cnbcs_maria_bartiromo_vs_sen_ben_cardin_are_you_guys_incompetent.html I would 100 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Obama is restricted to getting his agenda by edict. Many Republicans in the House were voted in to keep Obama from passing his agenda. That is the lesson that certain Republicans haven't learned yet. hopefully those many (minus a few defectors that see reason) won't be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 hopefully those many (minus a few defectors that see reason) won't be enough. Obama's agenda is a path to bankruptcy. What is "reason" about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 one of the few truth speakers around: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/12/21/howard_dean_belief_that_taxing_incomes_over_250000_more_will_solve_deficit_problem_just_not_so.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Obviously neither side actually wants that. The Dems/WH want the taxes but not on everybody...they hate the tax that hits the "middle class." The Repubs want the spending cuts but likewise hate the defense cuts. Both sides hate the overall effect on the economy. And while people can debate the political cost of going over the cliff and for who it is worse...it's a net loss for both. The bottom line though is the longer Boehner negotiates the more ground he loses on the tax increases...could have had it at 800B last time, now can get it around 1.2T...and in a few months he'll be wishing he got it at 1.2 b/c it will go higher. At some point he's going to have to build a little pack of Repubs who will deal and just bargain with the Dems in the house with that group to get the best deal they can....Plan B suggests there's no other way b/c he isn't going to bring a majority of house GOP to a position where they would accept anything negotiated. Horseshit. Everyone involved wants us over "The Fiscal Cliff", else the scheme never would have been devised in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinga Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 What no one has mentioned, is that if it failed, it also did so without enough Democrat votes to add to the Republican backers of the Boehner plan B Look, to me it seems the Rep leadership is trying at least, even though I think it's ill advised. But with Obama having the Dems in lockstep, we can forget about a compromise of any kind that PBO didn't write. Meaning, there is no way the conservative side of the Republican party will go along with the Obama plan, and no way Obama will compromise on his agenda... Mt own thought is, ANY compromise only puts off the inevitable. Kicks the can down the road once again.... Let's just hold hands as we jump, and get it over with... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 Horseshit. Everyone involved wants us over "The Fiscal Cliff", else the scheme never would have been devised in the first place. wow, that's quite a conspiracy theory. must admit the tea party dudes are really playing their roles amazingly. academy award stuff. howard dean is probably one of the few dems who might want this and even he has reservations. do some think going over is preferable to the status quo? yup. i'm sure some repubs do too. but most think a compromise would be the best solution with gradually increasing taxes and decreasing entitlements and defense spending. sudden will be very bad and won't likely last long despite the intransigents on both sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronc24 Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 Or should be renamed, "Quebec". Lol. Oh my God, yes. Line of the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 wow, that's quite a conspiracy theory. must admit the tea party dudes are really playing their roles amazingly. academy award stuff. howard dean is probably one of the few dems who might want this and even he has reservations. do some think going over is preferable to the status quo? yup. i'm sure some repubs do too. but most think a compromise would be the best solution with gradually increasing taxes and decreasing entitlements and defense spending. sudden will be very bad and won't likely last long despite the intransigents on both sides. Doc, let's say you make 500k a year. Is there any justification for you to spend in excess of 700k a year? Year after year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 You need to provide a link to your source(s). I clicked his graph and opened it in a new window. This is the url: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/files/2012/12/fiscaloffers31.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 (edited) Doc, let's say you make 500k a year. Is there any justification for you to spend in excess of 700k a year? Year after year? well first off i don't do either of those things but if i did, my spending would have little effect on the economy as a whole. and i would curb it immediately. the gov't does that and a couple whole generations are likely to be much poorer over night. this needs to be done gradually. starting with increased revenues on the richest makes the most sense. Edited December 23, 2012 by birdog1960 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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