Orton's Arm Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'm as anti-Jauron as they come. I hated his hiring, liked the job he did his first year and still wanted him fired because I knew that was as far as he could take them. But to say it's doubtful that they would have made the playoffs is to ignore the fact that this team was totally undermined by one of the worst offensive lines in NFL history. Lots of playmakers on the offense, a truly crappy division....a Jets team with a rookie HC and rookie QB is about to make the playoffs, it was an ideal time for Jauron ball to yield one winning season by trying not to lose. It very well could have happened, IMO. Remember, even Jauron once went 13-3 with the Bears. But yeah, long term they still would have had Jauron and still would suck NEXT year. But at this point, any success would be better than none at all. The failure is officially feeding off of itself and it's time to stop the bleeding at the very least. Sometimes when you win at least you can recognize that you have some quality talent and build on it. This team? Hell, we can't even EVALUATE a lot of the positions because the OL and LB corps are so horrendous they skew everything. A good point about how our turnstile OL makes it virtually impossible for a QB to succeed or be evaluated. Take a guy like Brohm, who was basically thrust into one of the worst situations for a QB imaginable. No line, only a few practices with the starters, almost no time to learn the playbook . . . how can you evaluate whether he's the guy? However . . . had the Bills made the playoffs this year, Jauron would be the head coach going into next year. It's very doubtful we'd be looking for a new GM. The mentality throughout the organization would be, "What we're doing seems to be working, so let's keep doing it!" When the reality of the situation would be that the Bills' playoff appearance would have been based on an extremely soft schedule, and the division being the weakest it's been in quite some time. Plus, Edwards would still likely be the starting quarterback, so it's not like we'd be evaluating Brohm anyway. Long-term, I think we're better off with a 5-11 or 6-10 season than we would have been with a playoff appearance. The short-term pain we're undergoing gets us a new GM, HC, and starting QB. It also gets us a top ten draft pick. That stuff has got to be worth more than a one year mirage built on a soft schedule and guys like Dockery and Langston Walker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 New contract More money New team A team that could win the NFC East title A team that arguably is the hottest team in the NFC right now Peters first playoff appearance .... and all the while, his old team's O-line is a wreck D. Bell never panned out as an adequate replacement, despite the best hopes of Dick Jauron & Co. (and this after plugging Bell in for Langston Walker, who they initially thought would be an adequate replacement) Jason Peters = yet another ex-Bill that gets to go to the playoffs (joining Pat Williams, Willis McGahee, etc. etc. etc.) He probably is smiling but only because of your top two reasons, which are really just one reason. He is as far from a team player as you can get, and he got the money, which is all he wants. If he had to go to the Raiders or Lions to get the money he would be smiling just as big as he is now. He isn't as good as he thinks he is, and give him another season or two and he will be whining in Philly for more money, just like he was here, year after year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 A good point about how our turnstile OL makes it virtually impossible for a QB to succeed or be evaluated. Take a guy like Brohm, who was basically thrust into one of the worst situations for a QB imaginable. No line, only a few practices with the starters, almost no time to learn the playbook . . . how can you evaluate whether he's the guy? However . . . had the Bills made the playoffs this year, Jauron would be the head coach going into next year. It's very doubtful we'd be looking for a new GM. The mentality throughout the organization would be, "What we're doing seems to be working, so let's keep doing it!" When the reality of the situation would be that the Bills' playoff appearance would have been based on an extremely soft schedule, and the division being the weakest it's been in quite some time. Plus, Edwards would still likely be the starting quarterback, so it's not like we'd be evaluating Brohm anyway. Long-term, I think we're better off with a 5-11 or 6-10 season than we would have been with a playoff appearance. The short-term pain we're undergoing gets us a new GM, HC, and starting QB. It also gets us a top ten draft pick. That stuff has got to be worth more than a one year mirage built on a soft schedule and guys like Dockery and Langston Walker! So, you did not want the Bills to make the playoffs this year? Wow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flomoe Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 New contract More money New team A team that could win the NFC East title A team that arguably is the hottest team in the NFC right now Peters first playoff appearance .... and all the while, his old team's O-line is a wreck D. Bell never panned out as an adequate replacement, despite the best hopes of Dick Jauron & Co. (and this after plugging Bell in for Langston Walker, who they initially thought would be an adequate replacement) Jason Peters = yet another ex-Bill that gets to go to the playoffs (joining Pat Williams, Willis McGahee, etc. etc. etc.) Can we please just stop these threads right now? Peters is long gone, along with Williams, McGahee, Spikes, Fletcher, Winfield, Wire, etc. etc. etc............ There is absolutely no need to beat this horse any longer..............it is DEAD!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndZoneCrew Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 I totally think that Ray Combs was the best Family Feud host.....with Richard "The Kissing Bandit" Dawson a close second Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'm as anti-Jauron as they come. I hated his hiring, liked the job he did his first year and still wanted him fired because I knew that was as far as he could take them. But to say it's doubtful that they would have made the playoffs is to ignore the fact that this team was totally undermined by one of the worst offensive lines in NFL history. Lots of playmakers on the offense, a truly crappy division....a Jets team with a rookie HC and rookie QB is about to make the playoffs, it was an ideal time for Jauron ball to yield one winning season by trying not to lose. It very well could have happened, IMO. Remember, even Jauron once went 13-3 with the Bears. But yeah, long term they still would have had Jauron and still would suck NEXT year. But at this point, any success would be better than none at all. The failure is officially feeding off of itself and it's time to stop the bleeding at the very least. Sometimes when you win at least you can recognize that you have some quality talent and build on it. This team? Hell, we can't even EVALUATE a lot of the positions because the OL and LB corps are so horrendous they skew everything. You have more faith in Jauron than I do, and I supported him for the first few years. Had the Bills planned to keep Peters and Dockery (they planned on keeping Walker until the eve of the season), they probably wouldn't have gone after TO for sure, and possibly Florence and/or Hangartner. Without TO, the offense would have been as inept as it ever was. And even with Dockery, who has been bad in Washington, Peters (the Eagles went deep into the playoffs last year with a severely-declining Tra Thomas at LT, if that tells you how vital he is the their offense) and Walker, who has been poor in Oakland, there were no guarantees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 So, you did not want the Bills to make the playoffs this year? Wow! They say that a truly elite swordsman is not focused on winning matches so much as he is on perfecting his technique. As his technique improves and is perfected, victories in matches arrive as a side effect. Conversely, a swordsman who tries to win as many matches as he can over the short-term, without perfecting his fundamentals, will (all else being equal) achieve a lower skill and success level than the guy focused on technique. Running a football team is analogous to that. If your focus is on maximizing the number of wins over the short-term--as TD's was--you'll have a few flash in the pan type successes, but ultimately won't get very far. But if you're focused on building a first-rate front office, coaching staff, and group of core players, and if you have the organizational discipline to relentlessly improve on those three things year after year, then over the long run, you'll have a very strong chance of achieving excellence. To try to achieve some kind of success without first doing those things would be pointless, and doomed to long-term failure. To give a specific example, the 2004 Bills went 9-7, and came within one game of the playoffs. But that flirtation with success was not based on a core group of good players who were either young or in their primes. It was not based on a first-rate front office or a first-rate coaching staff. As exciting as that 9-7 season may have seemed at the time, it did absolutely nothing to advance this team to a Super Bowl win. The front office was retained, which led to the disaster of the 2005 draft. That draft consisted of Roscoe Parrish, Kevin Everett, Duke Preston, Eric King, Justin Geisinger, and Lionel Gates. You can make a case for including Losman in that group as well, because the Bills' first round pick for 2005 had been traded away to acquire him. Suppose the Bills had gone 1-15 or 3-13 in 2004. TD would likely have been fired, which would have created at least the possibility of a competent front office and a successful draft for 2005. My long-term goal for this franchise is to win the Super Bowl, and that isn't going to happen unless there's a core group of good to elite young players at key positions. We don't have that now, so step 1 is to do whatever it takes to build that core. Until and unless that core is created, anything this team achieves is going to be as illusory as it had been under TD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 The thread isn't that bad. Like him or not, Peters represents a lot of what went wrong this year: poor management decisions. JP was our best Olineman. They didn't want to pay him (or L Walker) and traded away an asset. Then compounding the problem , they did not draft a replacement for him with their first pick. We see how great that turned out. Keep JP, draft Wood and Levitre, keep LW at RT and this season may have been very different. Pointing out how terrible of a choice the whole JP fiasco is turning out for the Bills is merely keeping the focus where it belongs: on how this half a$$ed organization needs to change before we can really ever be good again. very good post. the others on this thread and simply rationalizing away yet another stupid move by the Bills, "hoping" for a better tomorrow. Bills should have at least forced peters to play out the last year of his contract (no way he walks away from the cash and no way he lays down with free agency ahead) and then franchised him, and then let him leave, all the while bringing in draft choices behind him. Bad decisions make for bad teams. the bills are bad. ( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 That's the right point. Peters is history. But, the decision making that led up to him being traded is the real question for the Bills. Other than Jauron, all the same people that have been making these decisions are still in place. There is absolutely no question that the decision making being done in the front office is an unmitigated disaster. That structure has gone a long way towards poisoning the well. It's becoming a faded memory that the Bills organization used to be considered one of the truly elite and best in the league. a faded memory? try ancient roman history. the bills of the SB years have been forgotten by all but a few die hards in South buffalo who, in general, still think it's 1994. The Bills are being run like a local rugby club, all fun and friends and long time buddies fooling around with "the club" and having a good time with it. what team has the owners daughter as a primary scout? come on... the bills are joke. the sooner they are sold the sooner people with brains take over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 He probably is smiling but only because of your top two reasons, which are really just one reason. He is as far from a team player as you can get, and he got the money, which is all he wants. If he had to go to the Raiders or Lions to get the money he would be smiling just as big as he is now. He isn't as good as he thinks he is, and give him another season or two and he will be whining in Philly for more money, just like he was here, year after year. Philly has one of the top scouting and coaching staffs in the NFL. They considered Peters worthy of a first rounder and a market value contract. The Bills (and you) considered him expendable. I'll go with their opinion over yours... after all, you're the same person who said Vince Young isn't a viable NFL starter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsWatch Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 Jason Peters = yet another ex-Bill that gets to go to the playoffs (joining Pat Williams, Willis McGahee, etc. etc. etc.) Sounds like someone who invested too much money on Jason Peters jerseys and is trying to justify it or is boy toy of his agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts