1billsfan

Reality check is that Kyle Orton is horrible, he's old, he can't hit the broad side of a barn, and he has no legs. It's time to give EJ Manuel the keys to the offense for the rest of the season.

1) A monkey could coach our defense to a top 10 in the league because we have great players there. 2) Our offense has an average unit talent-wise and they were given every advantage possible (which I've provided straight facts on) and they failed miserably by almost every measure. That's coaching. If the defense was performing below top 10 then Schwartz would be on the hook for that failure. Marrone and Hackett are on the hook for having a way under performing offense relative to their average talent level. I honestly think the Bills offense should be rated bottom 10 in the league. That's a failure of coaching. These two simply don't have the smarts to coach offense in the NFL.

Because it's a cheap, obnoxious, trendy gimmick that makes the team look bush league. You don't see classy teams like the Giants, Steelers, Packers...ect. doing this. They may wear throwbacks from time to time, but those are actual throwback uniforms. This blue on blue Bills uniform doesn't look like the Buffalo Bills uniform. I like their current uniforms, they finally look cool again. They didn't need to puke on what they have with 12 variations. This is an embarrassing "look at me" trick because what they do on the field clearly doesn't hold fans attention. Maybe one day this team can be looked at as a classy NFL team like they used to be.

Yes I did. I gave you the numbers and you chose to ignore them. The reason the Bills are only 17th in points scored given all the advantages of NFL rules changes favoring scoring, drive starts, numbers of drives, 28 takeaways, is because of bad coaching not bad players. High school offenses are more unpredictable than the Buffalo Bills offense.

Well, you're only right in the sense that Marrone should be added to a table for two. You're not right in blaming the Bills offensive players... Defense: 2nd in there NFL in takeaways Offense: 5th in average drive start (yardage marker they start at) 7th in number of drives 29th in average yards per drive 25th in number of plays per drive 17th in points per game Sorry, but these numbers are a total indictment on the offensive coordinator. The NFL is a league set up for you to score a lot of points even with even average talent on offense (which without a doubt the Bills have). Now you add in the 28 turnovers given to your offense by your defense, fifth best in drives starts, 7th best in number of drives and that nets you the only 17th best in points per game???? You think that the Bills players are responsible for being 29th in average yards per start? 25th in number of plays per drive? How anyone can still back Nate Hackett is beyond me. It should be crystal clear that the offense is being held way way down by two predictable and play it safe anchors named Hackett and Marrone. These arguments are reminding me when fans were blaming Bills players and covering for the coaches in the lead weight offense Dick Jauron era.

Hackett is lying. The only reason he's saying that NOW is because his "play it safe/check down at all costs/take what the defense gives you" offense was a total failure. If you want Hackett's true and wimpy offensive philosophy then just watch this august interview at (2:26)... http://www.buffalobills.com/video/videos/Nathaniel-Hackett-on-OLine-and-the-Red-Zone/32e57e61-a6bd-442d-b9f2-924b9fd287ce “we never want to force anything, cause all of a sudden we’re forcing the ball downfield and were forcing, forcing, forcing and causing turnovers…we just want to be able to take what the defense gives us” I would be ashamed to be an NFL offensive coordinator and have this as my philosophy. I know that you'll point out that they only have Manuel and Orton to work with, but I would protest that Hackett never even gave his QBs the opportunity to succeed or fail given that they were told to never force anything. This is the NFL, if you never force the issue you will never know if your QB can actually do it. How stupid was it of the Bills to take EJ Manuel and never let him force the issue down the field? This is the biggest job of a franchise QB and they NEVER let him try. Hackett's now telling you to believe him and not your lying eyes. I ask all Bills fans backing Marrone, why you would want him back as your head coach when his offensive coordinator has that as his pathetic offensive philosophy? This is 2014, the pass play has been made as easy as possible with rules changes, they used 2 first rd picks on a WR, and the Bills are acting like the 1950's era is the way to go offensively. Marrone and Hackett do not have the stomach for turnovers to a loser's fault and are basically cowards on offense. There is no way a smart man who paid over a billion dollars for the Bills will continue to employ Marrone or Hackett in 2015. The Bills have the worst head coach and offensive coordinator in the NFL. I'd like to see the list of who's worse.

Jay Cutler is a guy who has all the tools but doesn't have the heart. This fact has been proven time and time and time again. Look at QBs like Brady and Manning on the sideline when things aren't going right and then look at Cutler when things aren't going right. There is a 180% difference in temperament. They care deeply about winning the game, he doesn't. Cutler would be a disaster for a Bills fan base that cares deeply about winning. There is no disputing this claim unless you think that Cutler will magically transform himself into a QB who is passionate about winning and hates losing.

There are no excuses for Marrone at this point. If the QB is refusing to throw the ball downfield you yell at him and if he still doesn't do it you bench him for whoever is his back up. If the line can't protect then you max protract and keep Jackson and a tight end in for blocking. I get that we don't have good QBs, but that should not prevent you from actually trying to win a game that you know you have to score touchdowns. The Bills had no shot to win against the Pats and Broncos with the short pass/run the ball game plan because Brady and Manning are going to score 24 plus points on the best of defenses. Marrone played to keep it close which is a loser game plan against those QBs 99% of the time. He cares more about style points and interceptions than winning against the very best teams. He NEVER EVEN TRIED to win those games. He is a loser. I would have no problem with Marrone if he had at least tried to throw the ball downfield on at least 10 plays. Who cares if theres a few interceptions, at least you tried to win the game! With his game plans they were doomed from the start. He is a coward when it comes to being a head coach. That's what you want? The guy was given Sammy Watkins and the Bills burned two 1st round picks on him and he NEVER TRIED getting him the ball against our biggest rival for the division, the New England Patriots. That was insane. It was as if he saw Derrell Revis and said, "Wow, you're so smart Mr. Belichick, you got Revis and now I have to throw the ball to any receiver not named Sammy Watkins...gee wiz Mr. Belichick, I hope I can be as smart of a coach as you some day." Marrone's a loser and there's no changing it. He made his bed. It's time the Bills hired a coach with the balls to actually not care about turnovers and try to win the games against the good teams with great QBs.

Doug deserves no such thing. As a Bills fan, I'm infuriated at Marrone for not throwing the ball downfield in games when they KNOW they have to score a few touchdowns. He does not have the balls to be a head coach in the NFL because he is literally more afraid of interceptions than giving his team a legitimate chance to beat the good teams. There is no fixing a timid coach. The Bills did him a huge favor picking him as their head coach since he came from an average win team at a near invisible collegiate football program.

Coaches like Belichick and Fox must laugh at him knowing that the Bills have no shot in the game if they don't throw the ball deep to their WRs and Marrone doesn't throw the ball deep. It's McCarthy's turn to laugh at Marrone with the Packers and Aaron Rogers. It's embarrassing when your head coach doesn't try even to win the games against the best teams, but rather he tries to keep the score close enough for something weird to happen and they somehow win through defense and sheer luck. I feel like asking him 'why did you want to be an NFL head coach?'. Was it your dream to reach the top of your profession only to go into a turtle shell and not reach for the brass ring when you face the best of the best? The Bills will have no shot to win this game if they don't score at least 24 points. Just like in the Pats and Broncos games. That means they have throw the ball deep more than 3 times. They must throw it deep around 10-15 times so that there is the chance they will get multiple touchdowns from big plays. So let's see what the scaredy-cat, afraid of his own shadow Doug Marrone does. Even if they win this game I'm done with Marrone, the guy's game plans are so pathetic. The Bills desperately need a guy who knows how to work with QBs and NFL offenses. I've been thinking of what hiring <gasp>...Norv Turner might do for this team! LOL Crazy as that sounds, if anyone could solve the QB issue and develop Manuel or another rookie QB, it's him. Hire Norv, maybe even make a creative trade offer to the Niners for Kaepernick.

Marrone is the failure, not Whaley just yet. Marrone has neutered his young 2nd year 1st round QB pick Manuel and the veteran journeyman QB Orton with his short passing game plans. I am embarrassed at how timid and afraid the Bills look in taking the fight and taking their shots downfield against opposing defenses. Marrone is a “kitty”. He is a “big boned” Dick Jauron. Marrone is a total coward for not letting EJ and Orton throw the ball DOWN THE FIELD! Bill Parcells once yelled at Phil Simms for not taking enough chances… http://www.giants.co...17-b466a7f6f620 “His greatest line to me ever was during the opening game in 1984 and we’re walking out of the locker room. He said, ‘If you don’t throw two interceptions today, you’re not taking enough chances.’ If a coach said that now, they’d be struck by lightning. Coaches say, ‘Turnovers are the biggest cause of winning and losing in the NFL. I want our team to take a lot of chances and be very dynamic, but we can’t turn the ball over.’ It’s funny. That wasn’t part of the mantra with him then and God, did I make some of the most unbelievable turnovers in history. I’d come to the sidelines and he would be so mad he couldn’t even talk and he would just hold it in and go, ‘Okay, it’s alright. That’s what I’m telling you. Take some chances.’ He’d say it through clenched teeth. Hey, you’re the one who told me to take chances, big guy. It was unbelievable looking back to think how brazen and how it is just so not like anything we hear or see now. In practice sometimes I’d throw the ball and complete it for five or six yards and they’d literally stop practice and yell at me. ‘Why are you throwing it there?’ Well, because the guy down the field was covered. ‘Hell, give him a chance. What are you worried about? Your completion percentage? Your quarterback rating?’ It just was a different thought process back then. That in a nut shell is the biggest failure of the Bills attempt at developing EJ Manuel. They never told him it’s not only ok, but it's encouraged to take chances down the field. In fact, they told him the opposite. I watched an interview on BB.com where Hackett instructed the exact opposite of what Bill Parcells instructed to Simms. Hackett said that he told EJ to take the check down because the worst thing to do is throw interceptions. What did the Giants do when they drafted Eli Manning? They let him loose throwing the ball down field and he threw a ton of interceptions. He eventually learned what he could get away with and the Giants learned that they had a real NFL QB. The Bills will NEVER know if they have a real QB until they let EJ loose to throw the ball downfield interceptions be damned. This is not a league where you can handhold a QB. Every QB worth anything had been given their shot to throw the ball downfield and the ones who could became the good to greats. It’s a shame that so many fans here just parrot the “EJ sucks” mantra without even knowing that Manuel has not had a true NFL evaluation with a heavy does of real NFL throws. NFL defenses would eventually stop Brady and Rogers in their tracks if they had these short passing only game plans. Marrone has cut Manuel’s “you-know-what’s” off the entire time. It makes me angry that next year will be year three with Manuel and they will still have not let their 1st round pick of a QB sink or swim with a real game plan that attacks a defense down field. Marrone really does need to be fired if they lose to the Packers with yet another "grind the clock" loser of a game plan. Once he's gone I'd tell the new HC/OC to let EJ throw the ball 80 times with 40 down the field passes in the last two games. Let the real QB evaluation commence.

Because the Bills picked EJ Manuel 16th overall and he beats Tuel in almost every statistical category that judges QBs. Manuel's quarterback rating is double and his QBR is quadruple that of Tuel. I hope that there is an intelligent mind over at OBD that will fire Marrone and pull the plug on Orton (if they do lose) and play their former first rd QB pick EJ Manuel in the last two real NFL games. Because they will get no read on Manuel's progress in practices and pre season games. Manuel's biggest problem (above numerous problems) is staying clam and overcoming the pressure of real NFL games. The Bills would be STUPID not to play Manuel in the last two real games because they need as much information as possible regarding Manuel's progress going into the off season. QB is this team's number one issue after they fire Marrone.

Marrone is gone if he loses to the Packers and he knows it. He's just going to be a petulant child and take his ball and go home (starting Orton). That's why he needs to be fired if they lose to the Packers and Orton sucks again. The Bills can be honest and say that the organization and Marrone had come to a crossroads and there was no turning back. Kyle Orton's play has been abysmal, they used a very high pick on EJ Manuel and they want to see him start the last two games because this team has extremely crucial decisions to make at the QB position.

Within the last couple of weeks, the greatest question of all has become what can the Bills do to get a QB who can take them to the playoffs in 2015. This point is undisputed, right? The right move is to start EJ, throw out the conservative game plans and let EJ throw the ball downfield a LOT. They should also give him free reign to run with the ball when the field opens up. What if he throws 5, 6 or 7 interceptions? Well then, that is an answer solidifying the Bills need to bring in another QB not named Kyle Orton. No harm done because they are not making the playoffs anyway! What if he throws 6 TDs in his last two games?...as remote a possibility as many here feel that may be, they did pick him 14th overall. Doesn't the Bills organization, the team and their fans deserve to see if EJ Manuel can handle a franchise QB level game plan given that those last two games have no playoff ramifications? If they lose to the Packers, I hope that Marrone and Hackett are fired and Schwartz is made interim HC so that EJ Manuel is allowed too start and throw the ball 80 times (half of them deep balls) the last two games.

I did identify it. You think a short pass is taking a chance in the NFL, I don't. See how easy THAT was?

Look out "Greatest Show on Turf" the high flyin' Marrone/Hackett/Orton Buffalo Bills are breathing down your neck! LOL I can't even believe someone would seriously argue that the Bills are a team that takes chances on offense. Short passes are glorified handoffs in the NFL.

Please stop. Your premise that the Bills are not Jauronball by picking out the one game they threw the ball a lot is just plain silly. On top of that, in this one game which they passed the ball a lot, 80% were short passes. In a game in which scoring touchdowns was the only way they would be able to win it. The Bills have an offense that does not take chances. It's a fact and there's no denying it.

46 of those were short passes.

They take chances???? LOL You can't be serious with that statement. BTW, we aren't talking about defense Jauronball...just offense Jauronball.

It's unfortunate that some fans here don't realize how bad our offensive coaching is. We can only hope that the new head coach will run an attacking type of offense and we will get a real evaluation on Manuel. I really think that Marrone and Hackett are gone so this team will get a true read on Manuel before they jettison him to another team. EJ Manuel absolutely doesn't get a free pass since he did regress badly, but I would like to see what a competent coach can do with him.

I think that SD has had some major problems on their offensive line this year. I've watched a few recent interviews of Reich, and while he isn't a fire brand kind of coach, he strikes me as a deliberate and intelligent coach who looks ready to be a head coach. He has seen it all and he has proven to be a very good offensive coordinator reviving Phillip Rivers' career. So the obvious next step is head coach, and while he looks like he's a year away from serious consideration in the league, I have no problem with the Bills jumping the gun a year early because this job would fit like a glove for Frank. I think that the Bills' DC job is a stepping stone towards getting a head coaching job elsewhere, not the Bills. Since I think that Frank Reich would hopefully be our guy for the next 10 years.

Unfortunately we have had a second helping of Dick Jauron coaching our QBs the last two years. So trying to garner any useful information regarding EJ Manuel is futile. I truly believe that if Chip Kelly had EJ Manuel for the last two years he would have him as a top 10 QB in the league right now. Manuel is a QB that will do what you tell him to do. If you tell him to not make mistakes and it's better to check down than risk getting an interceptions then that is what you will get. If you tell him to run when he sees a clear field and to not worry about throwing the ball deep if he thinks he can get the ball to the WR because interceptions are acceptable in your offense since you're attacking the defense, then EJ will do this and you would get a true read on his prospects as a franchise QB. The only thing that anyone knows is that Manuel sucks in an extremely predictable vanilla run 1st/2nd/check down pass 3rd offense. I can't wait till Marrone and Hackett are gone. This feels just like it did under Jauron, there's no shaking it.

I think that Frank Reich should be our next head coach. It's such an obvious choice that not many fans here realize that the dude is right in front of our face. We need a guy who can fix a very bad offense and a guy who knows what an attacking and intimidating NFL offense looks like. He will always be a Buffalo Bill, he had all those years under Marv to learn from one of the best, and he knows what can happen in Buffalo if given the right pieces. I don't care if Schwartz leaves either. With the players we have anybody can coach our defense to a top 5 ranking. If Schwartz is gone maybe Rex Ryan would want to coach them for 2015 with an eye on a head coaching gig in 2016. He wouldn't get a better defense to work with, that's for sure. Once they hire Reich, I'd let him call the shots for who his QB will be.

Football is a game which rewards teams that challenge defenses. If you are hell bent on not doing that because you and your OC are ultra conservative on offense, then that head coach and OC have no business coaching at the NFL level. I get that from time to time a team would need to try to run the ball down an opponents throat because that's what a particular game calls for. But points are scored through throwing the ball down the field. To not even try to do that in a game which puts the final nail in your season is a dereliction of duty. I'm not trying to be mean, just honest. There's just no getting around it. Marrone and Hackett are not cut out for the NFL game. You don't get medals for keeping it close and hoping for a miracle play in the 4th that wins you the game. This was week 14 and our QB still is not challenging defenses with the deep ball? I told a friend that if the Bills don't throw the ball deep they will have no shot to win the game. The defense kept this game within reach, Manning had a bad game for him, and Marrone/Hackett refused to take advantage and attempt to score touchdowns. They instead chose the drain the clock approach which is a loser's game plan. Yes, it worked once against the Bills in a Superbowl, that was a thousand years ago. Yes, the Bills need to run the ball 50% of the time, but when they do pass the ball, they must throw a certain percentage of those passes down the field in an attempt to score touchdowns and challenge the opposing defense. If you don't want to do that, you should be a high school or college coach. The NFL is for the big boys who know that scoring touchdowns is the name of this game.

No mojo? LOL The guy is one of the very few QBs to have ever won 4 bowl games in college. Will Manuel ever be an elite QB? Probably not. Does he still have the reachable ceiling to get to a "Joe Flacco" level and win them a Superbowl with a great defense and running game? Yes. Bills fans need to stop pining away for an elite QB, because that's not going to happen. That's like hitting the lottery and the Bills already hit it once with Jim Kelly. Yet even with Kelly at his greatest, the Bills still lost the Superbowl against a Giant team with Jeff Hostetler as their starting QB. Heck, an above average QB Russell Wilson beat one of the greatest QBs of all time in Peyton Manning because the Seahawks were the better "team". Eli Manning beat Aaron Rodgers at Green Bay in the playoffs and he beat Tom Brady twice in the Superbowl. Football isn't always about the QB when it comes playoff/Superbowl time. It is about who is on a roll much more than the QB. I do favor bringing in competition for Orton and Manuel, but to write off a 2-3 year project like Manuel is just plain silly.