syhuang

Did you say something, VABills? Unfortunately, you're in my ignored user list and I don't want to waste my time to click the "View this opst" link or "Un-ignore VABills" link. ------------- You have chosen to ignore VABills. View this post · Un-ignore VABills -------------

What is your ranking based on? What kind of stats do you use? Do you compare the career stats or this year's numbers? I hope you don't just choose few stats that favor your arguments or base everything on your observations like VABILLS.

You just lost your remaining credibility here.

It seems like you always prefer personal attacks than being rational.

Another tip: Set ignored user list.

Do you mean 2nd worst?

Because four of the six NFC wins are against weak AFC teams, including two wins against Houston (1-3), one against Tennessee (0-4), and one against Cleveland (1-3). The combined record of these AFC teams is 7-16, 30.4% winning percentage. In other words, these AFC teams' combined conference record is only 7-10 (41%) Although AFC also beat some weak NFC teams, the combined record of the NFC teams losing to AFC is 6-11, or 35.3%. These NFC teams' combined conference record is 6-6 (50%).

or keep Rashad Baker

Good. Do you have other questions on the comparison method (assume QB rating is acceptable)?

The main reason not to look individual game is that there's no standard way to do it. Some may only look at certain stats and the other use others. This is when the aggregate QB rating comes in. It's like using VORP to compare baseball players. I never say I won't accept other measures. I even bring up DOVA and DPAR.

This is better, we're now on something. For your question, I mentioned earlier, counting a game when a quarterback comes in for one or two series to give the starting qb a breath is not a good measurement.

Making personal attacks doesn't make you right. The only tool I used is QB rating. If you want to discuss QB rating rationally, you're welcome. Please then explain where my comparison is wrong if QB rating is acceptable.

Do you study sabermetrics today?

It's not a surprise that this statement comes from a person who only uses observation and his observation is wrong.

If you want to use QB rating, you need to understand that it's use to summon performance over certain number of games. You need to summon all game in a period together instead of looking at individual games separately. Of course, you don't believe QB rating. BTW, I study more stats than QB rating, and you must have seen I used DVOA and DPAR in this thread. I want to bring up these stas, but I still can not help you to accept these advanced methods.

Since your problem is not agreeing on QB rating formula, I can not help you on this. As I already mentioned in my original post, QB rating is not perfect. However, it is widely used in NFL, media, and every sports website to compare quarterbacks.

You're really funny, you bring up fumble issues and then show stats which do not include fumble. You do realize DPAR and DVOA include fumbles in them, right?

Based on what? your observation? Based on DPAR and DVOA, McNabb is second best QB and Brees is 13th.

Yes, I know what's oberservation and I know your observation is wrong. You consistently said Losman had 4 fumbles, but he actually had only 3 in official score.

Again, it's actually funny. You still manipulate the numbers by only using pass yards and complete percentage to compare quarterbacks while neglecting other stats. As I mentioned before, QB rating includes more stats than pass yards and complete percentage. Speaking of QB rating, do you realize it is used commonly to summon quarterback performance over certain number of games? Just go to ESPN or NFL.COM, you'll find QB ratings of 3 games this year or QB rating of each quarterback last season. And what weight factors are you talking about? Not including the QBs who started in their season? I believe I have mentioned that including these QBs who mostly had bad games as a rookies will only make Losman look good. Or are you talking about "quality game" definition? I don't think you want to include the games when a young QB comes in to play a series or two when the starters need a breath.

It's fine. Just like baseball, some are sabermetrics supporters and some are not. When people are arguing on Jeter or Ortiz should be MVP, some can provide stats like VORP or win shares, others can only base on what they think. However, you still need stats to back up your argument. First, you need make the numbers you showed right, Losman only has 3 fumbles in official score. Second, before I show you the stats, do you realize that 15 out of 32 NFL quarterbacks have at least 4 turnovers, including non-lost fumble?

Again, please understand what DPAR and DVOA are and know what sabermetrics is. And Rivers only ranks 9th.

Please understand what DPAR and DVOA are before you make any arguments against these advanced stats. Based on DPAR and DVOA, David Carr ranks behind Brady, Manning, and McNabb.

First, please check the official box score. Losman only had 3 fumbles and lost 2. One fumble in week 1 was charged to Fowler. Second, even if we count non-lost fumble as a turnover, there're still 15 quarterbacks having at least 4 turnovers through week 3. Third, as I mentioned earlier, Losman ranks 18th on both DPAR and DVOA among all quarterbacks. "Fumble lost" and "Fumble kept" are included in DPAR and DVOA evaluation. Losman is not a top quarterback yet, but he certainly is not in the bottom.

Furthermore, on the 32 quarterbacks who at least attempt 30 passes this season, 19 of them have at least 3 turnovers. Also, Losman ranks 18th among the quarterbacks on both DPAR (Defense-adjusted Points Above Replacement) and DVOA (Defense-adjusted Value Over Average).