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RocCityRoller

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    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted · Edited by RocCityRoller

    34 minutes ago, arcane said:

    Doesn't either guy effectively have one year left anyway? I don't really care about age, we aren't giving Gabe another contract the way he's been playing

    Gabe is top 35 of all WR in yards/ TDs/ yard per reception and 1st downs per reception

     

    You don't let those guys go easily unless you are TSW.

    1 minute ago, ScottLaw said:

    I prefer Jeudy… younger with more upside and better contract…. But not sure how anyone can really hate a Hopkins trade. He’s still elite. Just gotta cross fingers he doesn’t fall off a cliff and can maintain health. 

    Hopkins is falling off the cliff. You get 1/2 a season of him like Manny sanders.

     

    Davis has clearly out performed Jeudy by any metric.

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    14 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

    It goes beyond that.  You dont have to give up one to get the other.  Would you rather have Diggs/Hopkins/Davis or Diggs/Davis/McKenzie.  Thats the real question.

    There are so many options between those options. How about Diggs/Davis/ Ritchie-Barrios.

     

    Or Diggs/ Renfrow/ Davis? or Diggs/ Davis/ Davis? So many options.

     

    I'm open minded to a lot of possibilities. I just don't see D Hop or OBJ in those plans.

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    20 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:


    what? I’m a troll because I like Hopkins???

    Nothing personal my friend, but I am looking at recent production.

     

    Hopkins had 717 yards and 3 TD on 96 targets.

    Davis had 836 yards and 7 TD on 93 targets.

     

    Oh and Davis is much cheaper.

     

    And Dhop didn't exceed 60% catch stats until year 5.

    Davis is entering year 4.

     

    I'll give Davis the room to improve.

    25 minutes ago, arcane said:

    Davis is severely limited in the routes he runs, and the ones he's good at take forever to develop, which is part of why Allen's stats are so bad/throws to Davis are so off compared to other WRs. Hopkins is exponentially more well-rounded than Gabe, even if he hasn't stayed on the field for various reasons and is older etc. 

    He had those numbers in half the games played of Gabe, on a dreadful offense with a dreadful qb who was hurt anyway


    I don't even want to trade for Hopkins but this is a misleading comparison at absolute best

    And yet Davis had more Yards and TDs than Hopkins on almost the same number of targets,,,,

     

    How did that happen?

    • Dislike 1

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    14 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

    Just stop, you are talking about a first ballot HOF player, one of the very best in the game for the last decade vs a below average #2.

    And it took him 6 years to be an above 50% catch WR

     

    Think about that.

    14 minutes ago, Southern_Bills said:

     

    Sub 60% with Skelton and the rest of the scrubs throwing him the ball? 

     

    I get it he's older, but disrespecting his game is ridiculous. 

     

    Davis is no where near his level, even with Davis being 7 years younger he probably isn't as good as Dhop. 

    DHOP took 6 years to exceed 59% catch rate.

     

    Perhaps you minimize what Davis is doing.

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted · Edited by RocCityRoller

    5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:


    You can’t be serious with this post.  Come on lol.  
     

    PS:  You immediately lost credibility of your post out the gate when you talked about games played since 2020 to imply he has injury issues.  He has had ONE injury in his whole career were heisted more than 1 game, and that was 2021.  His suspension to cost him games this year was related to his recovery the for that injury.  He does NOT have reliability issues.  
     

    And the funniest part is that you compared a whole season for Davis to half a season to Hopkins, yet Hopkins put up nearly the same totals in half the time despite Davis playing on the most pass happy offense in the league with a top 2 QB.  Hopkins played with a lesser Murray and scrub backups.

     

    And you calling Hopkins ancient is hilarious when I guess that makes Diggs ancient too since he is only 6 months older than Diggs.

     

    No disrespect, but man this is white honestly just an all around terrible assessment and comparison.  
     

    Hopkins is a top 5 WR in the NFL, Davis isn’t even a top 5 WR in his 4 team division.  

    Bills need a contingency plan for Diggs.

     

    Diggs is angry because he joined the Bills to make a championship run.

     

    Since his first year here he went from AFC Championshiop game, to 13 second loss to KC in the divisional round, to a blow out loss in the divisional round to Cincy. Going backwards, not forwards.

     

    Now he is angry as retirement approaches. I don't blame him.

     

    I would be concerned too as I reach 30 as an NFL player.

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    8 minutes ago, Southern_Bills said:

    Are we really comparing Gabe Davis to Dhop? 

     

    That's laughable. Don't forget to list the list of 3rd string QBs he had throwing to him before Watson got there in year 5 btw.

     

    Dhop is the one WR who has produced regardless of QB for a decade straight. 

     

    Comparing him to Davis is such disrespect. 

    I don't care about the past.

     

    S Hop was a sub 60% receiver for 5 years. Two of those were with Andre Johnson as WR #1.

     

    Davis had better yards/ TDs and YPC than Hopkins last year.

     

    He is younger and cheaper.

     

    Period.

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

    Now go back and normalize Hopkins' stats by games played and see the difference between he and Davis.

     

    The only stat that is worth speaking about when it comes to Gabe Davis is 51% catch ratio- almost a 50/50 chance he catches the ball.  Not to mention his limited route tree.

     

    Throw all the stats you want but do you really think Gabriel Davis is better than Deandre Hopkins?

     

     

    Right now, today building a team, yes I do.

     

    Hopkins had 717 yards and 3 TD on 96 targets.

    Davis had 836 yards and 7 TD on 93 targets.

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    1 minute ago, thenorthremembers said:

    Now go back and normalize Hopkins' stats by games played and see the difference between he and Davis.

     

    The only stat that is worth speaking about when it comes to Gabe Davis is 51% catch ratio- almost a 50/50 chance he catches the ball.  Not to mention his limited route tree.

     

    Throw all the stats you want but do you really think Gabriel Davis is better than Deandre Hopkins?

     

     

    Hopkins was a sub 60% catch guy for 5 years. 3 of those were as WR #1.

     

    And yes, I'd rather have 24 yr old Davis to 31 yr old Hopkins.

    • Vomit 2
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    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    9 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

    Ugh I saw D Hopkins and got excited for a second.

    Typical TSW troll

     

    Hopkins had 717 yards and 3 TD on 96 targets.

    Davis had 836 yards and 7 TD on 93 targets.

     

    Hopkins is 30 turning 31 this season

    Davis is 23 turning 24 this season

     

    have fun with your AARP team

    • Dislike 4

    D Hopkins vs Gabe Davis

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    A lot of posters here want ancient D Hopkins signed to be WR2, and spend draft capital on this stiff to replace Gabe Davis.

    D Hop was a really good WR, but he has not played more than 10 games since 2020.

    He hasn't passed 720 yards since 2020. He hasn't passed 8 TD since 2018.

    It is 2023.

     

    Last Year:

    Hopkins had 717 yards and 3 TD on 96 targets.

    Davis had 836 yards and 7 TD on 93 targets.

     

    Davis had +119 yards, +4 TDs  on 3 fewer targets, on a rookie deal.

    Many here swear Hopkins should be signed at 10+ million a year and a draft pick though.

    How does that make any sense???

     

    It doesn't.

     

    It has also become popular here to knock down Gabe Davis and blame him for the Bills offensive struggles.

     

    Nevermind the sub-par OL play, or that the slot WR position was a mess all season.

    Davis and Diggs looked better with a solid slot WR like Beasley.

     

    A lot of TSW wanted Beasley out, and you got your wish.

    How did that work out for you?

    It didn't.

     

    Beasley type slot WR are available (Berrios/ Ritchie/ draft), but don't point that out here.

    Beane missed on Crowder, so Ritchie and Berrios would suck too according to TSW.

     

    Ignore that the OC was new to the position or that the TE and RBs were forgotten for major stretches of the season.

    Forget developing Cook, or using Hines.

    Go get Ekeler and his 127 targets last year... that is the answer....

     

    Run game? What is that?, we have Allen, chuck it up where a guy looks open.

    That was often Davis downfield, as seen by yards per target.

    The catch % reflects it, but TSW won't admit it. Much like D Hopkins in his first 5 years.

     

    48/ 836/ 7 TD apparently is bad now for a WR #2.

    A lot of teams and fans would love that production from a #2 WR.

    That was top 35% WR production in the league for ALL WR.

     

    When looking at all WR with 50+ targets Davis scored top 1/3 in a lot of categories.

    But no: 52% catch rate last year = sucks.

    It was a bad stat for certain, but how many of those balls were actually catchable?

     

    TSW thinks Gabe Davis stinks. Then again I've recently seen TSW attack Tre White recently too.

     

    So replace Davis with D Hopkins huh?

    A WR that did less with more opportunities, costs more and is ancient?

    Smart team building there.

     

    Maybe we should chill out a bit as fans.

     

    Did you know Deandre Hopkins never had a catch % higher than 60% for his first 5 seasons?!

     

    Hopkins catch % was 57.1%/ 59.8%/ 57.8%/ 51.7%/ 55.2% over his first 5 seasons.

     

    Gabe Davis is 56.5%/ 55.6%/ 52.6% as a #2, but he 'stinks'.

     

    It took 4 seasons as WR #1 for Hopkins to exceed 60% catch %

    but WR don't improve their catch % per TSW.

     

    Many here think Buffalo should trade for an older version of the guy we already have, is less productive, and costs more

     

    Brilliant.

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    Edmunds to Bears

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted · Edited by RocCityRoller

    I've never been a big Edmunds fan. I've been rough on the guy, but I want to level set my opinion about Edmunds.

     

    Edmunds was picked #16 overall - it was not his fault for being over-drafted, this is why reaching for a position is bad.

    Edmunds was smart enough to learn the whole defense and start calling it as a rookie.

    He was very durable, and played through injuries.

    He kept his business and opinions to himself.

    He was not a (+) player, but was rarely a (-) player, he was very average on the whole in this scheme.

     

    If Edmunds was a mid round pick, I would think differently of him as a player. That was not his fault.

    He never developed into a game changer. How does a MLB have 2 FF and 0 FR in 5 years? That is almost impossible.

    He was a terrible pass rusher. 6.5 sacks on  over 300 blitzes....

    Despite his length and coverage skills he had 35 PD and 5 INT. 19 of those PD came in 2 seasons. Passing stats against him were bad.

    He took bad angles vs the run.

    He was often slow to react to the snap.

    The defense he called was good in the season, but often ***** the bed in playoff games and big games. (Frazier or Edmunds?)

     

    I think playing LB in a nickel scheme must be rough. Milano is successful, but was a former S.

    I think Edmunds realized this is not the right scheme fit for him.

    Playing in a traditional 4-3 under Eberfluss will get the most out of Edmunds.

    He was always professional and never threw his coaches or scheme under the bus in public.

     

    I don't hate the guy. Honestly the opposite, even as a detractor.

    I'm happy he got the bag in Chicago.

    He is in a 4-3 with a LB focused coach, and we will see the best Edmunds can give in that 4-3.

    For whatever reason Buffalo refused to play a 4-3 with him at SLB or traditional MLB.

     

    I think he will do well in Chicago, and I wish him well.

    He was not what this scheme needed, especially not at that price.

     

    I feel the way about Edmunds the way I felt about Gilmore when he left.

    Good, not great, will play better in another scheme.

    Will find accolades elsewhere.

    At least Edmunds did not go to a divisional rival.

     

    'Maine' is in the spotlight now, in one of the largest media markets in the country.

    I hope he succeeds, and I'm happy he got his big payday.

    I'm also happy Buffalo did not break the bank for him.

    • Thank you (+1) 1

    Bills free agency tracker - NFL free agency began 3/15 - post all NFL updates here

    in The Stadium Wall

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, BillMafia716ix said:

    It’s still early but I’m growing a lil impatient. Teams around us getting better and from the looks of it we seem to just be running it back with the same group. Loss Edmunds, Poyer, still don’t have a D Coordinator. 

     

    Nothing shocking here TBH.

     

    Edmunds got the bag in Chicago. I think he will do well with Eberfluss in a traditional 4-3 and he got the bag. Good for him.

    I say that as someone who was never an Edmunds fan. I really wish 'Maine' well. Solid guy, over-drafted, average player in this scheme.

     

    Poyer is older and banged up. Great player for the Bills, one of my favorites, but the market is not there, just like Beasley.

    Rachel may have wanted to stay quiet.

     

    DC is probably Al Holcumb: Senior Defensive Assistant. He was DC in Carolina. He was brought in a week before the Frazier announcement.

    If not, Eric Washington (internal), makes sense.

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