transplantbillsfan
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5 minutes ago, Ray Stonada said:
From NFL.com:
"The Ravens’ sixth-year quarterback is playing the way he did when he won the 2019 MVP award. That season, Jackson passed for 3,127 yards, rushed for 1,206 yards and totaled 43 touchdowns. This year, he has 3,357 passing yards, 787 rushing yards and 24 touchdowns. On Monday night, he led Baltimore to points on seven straight drives while leading the team in passing and rushing. He’s not only the MVP of the top team in these power rankings, but he may have captured the league award Monday night."
SMH... in what world is mediocre passing yards, 2/3 the rushing yards and just over HALF the touchdowns the same season as 2019??
Sometimes media groupthink is truly confusing.
Allen's stats dwarf Lamar's.
Not only all of this, but with 2 games still to go Lamar already has 1 more interception and 4 more lost fumbles than 2019.
Did you read that?
Lamar Jackson has 24 TDs and 13 turnovers.
I call total bull#### he wins it this year unless he goes ballistic the next 2 weeks.
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1 hour ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:
The case against Lamar for MVP:
Through 15 games Lamar has a 63.0 QBR and 24 Total TD's. He's on pace for 28 total TD's on the year in a 17 game season.
At least when Cam won with a 61 QBR in the 2015 season the Panthers were a ridiculous 15-1 and Cam had 45 total TD's in 16 games.
The Total QBR of the last 10 MVP winners and their total TD's below. Bold type indicates they led the league in that category for that year.
2013- Peyton Manning 79.0 (56 Total TD's)
2014- Aaron Rodgers 77.8 (40 Total TD's)
2015 - Cam Newton 61.4 (45 Total TD's)
2016 - Matt Ryan 79.6 (38 Total TD's)
2017 - Tom Brady 70.6 (32 Total TD's)
2018 - Patrick Mahomes 80.3 (52 Total TD's)
2019 - Lamar Jackson 83.0 (43 Total TD's)
2020 - Aaron Rodgers 79.8 (51 Total TD's)
2021 - Aaron Rodgers 69.1 (40 Total TD's)
2022 - Patrick Mahomes 79.0 (45 Total TD's)Josh Allen's QBR and Total TD's last 4 seasons:
2020- 76.6 (46 Total TD's)
2021- 60.7 (42 Total TD's)
2022- 73.4 (42 Total TD's in one less game)
2023- 71.6 (40 Total TD's and counting) Allen's QBR is second to Purdy's 71.7, yes only 0.1 behind Purdy.
The Ravens have been the top team in the AFC for a number of weeks now. But it's only now that Lamar has emerged as the MVP favorite. Why is that? Why wasn't he number 1 or even number 2 several weeks ago if he had the Ravens in the 1 seed position? The reason obviously is that his numbers are really bad by MVP standards. Prior to the last two games his QBR was 59 so he has "heated up" a little bit to a luke-warm 63. But more importantly, he hasn't absolutely wet the bed like Dak and Purdy have in consecutive weeks. He didn't suffer an ankle injury like Hill did forcing him to miss a game and possibly a 2,000 yard season. So it's not that Lamar himself is playing at a high level and "earning it". It's that everyone else around him is falling on their faces late in the season. But all those players; Dak, Purdy and Hill still have great stats on the season. And their teams are still in great playoff positioning.
Then there is Allen who actually has a legit chance to end the season as both the QBR leader and total TD leader. The last five MVP's have led the league in both categories. Not sure if there has ever been a QB to lead in both and not win the MVP.
Allen should absolutely win the MVP if the Bills win the division and given all of the above, not sure it should be a difficult decision at that point either.
But I guess it makes sense to fight against logic????
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4 hours ago, Dr Krentist said:
Doesn't matter to me. We win out, we get the #2 seed. Would be funny if the Chiefs lose out and Denver wins out to win the division though.
Miami needs to lose to Baltimore first. It's possible, probably even likely, but not a guarantee.
We need to win Sunday against the Pats, first and foremost.
But let's say Buffalo beats the Pats (likely), AND any combination of 2 of the following 3 where Jacksonville loses to the Panthers (possible and maybe very possible with Lawrence's injury), Pittsburgh loses to the Seahawks (very possible), Cincy loses to the Chiefs (I'm giving this just a very possible at this point) AND Miami beats the Ravens (possible)...
Do you treat week 18 like a preseason game and rest starters knowing you're likely to be back in Miami the following week, anyway???
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6 hours ago, paulmm3 said:
Love Josh but he single handedly lost us too many winnable games earlier in the season to be worthy of MVP. Not his best year.
What games?
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16 hours ago, folz said:
Come on man. You are trying way too hard to prove your point. You can't cherry pick stats by not including touchdowns and rushing yards. No one judges QBs on passing yards and INTs only, ignoring all other stats. Did the people who vote for the MVP ignore Lamar Jackson's rushing yards and rushing TDs the year he won the MVP? It's not about what YOU think your QB should be...it's about how the voters view the total stats/impact of the players. There is no way Lamar wins that award if it was based on passing yards alone. He was 22nd in passing yards in 2019, his MVP season (with 3,127 passing yards---Josh has 3,778 passing yards with two games to go this season---for comparison).
Plus, points win games, not yards. There are plenty of NFL games where the team with the most yards actually loses the game. And yes, I noted pretty clearly that Brock and CMC were still one game behind the rest of the players in my original post (I did use updated stats for Tua and Dak---they had played the same number of games as Josh). But, now that San Fran has played and week 16 is in the books, I have updated my list to be fully current (and included Lamar Jackson, Patrick Mahomes, and Jared Goff for further comparison---I only added Goff because he is one of the players with more passing yards than Josh, not because I think he is an MVP candidate).
Player Total Yards (Pass/Rush/Rec) Total TDs (Pass/Rush/Rec) INTs (for QBs)
Pat 4,325 26 14
Tua 4,267 26 10
Josh 4,191 40 15
Brock 4,190 31 11
Lamar 4,143 24 7
Dak 4,129 32 7
Jared 4,005 29 10
CMC 1,932 21
Tyreek 1,656 12
Mostert 1,187 21
vs. Mahomes: Would you trade 134 yards and one less interception across the season for the extra 14 TDs that Josh has?
vs. Tua: Are 14 touchdowns more for Josh not better than Tua's extra 76 yards and 5 less INTs?
None of the other QBs have more total yards than Josh. And no QB, including Mahomes and Tua has more TDs.
You told another poster to do the math, well, I ask you to do the same.
So, Josh has the third most total yards in the league and BY FAR the most TDs in the league. And after today, his # of INTs in comparison doesn't look quite as bad. Lamar obviously doesn't throw the ball as much as the other QBs, which accounts for his low INT number, and Dak seems to be an outlier (having a good season where INTs are concerned). The rest aren't that far from Josh's number of INTs to outweigh the number of TDs that Josh has. And we all know that there is also an element of luck when it comes to INTs.
Again, I'm not saying that Josh should be the MVP, but it is ridiculous for you to say that Josh isn't even worthy of being in the conversation.
Lamar's 2019 MVP season
4,333 total yards; 43 total TDs; 6 INTs
Josh needs 142 total yards and 3 TDs over the last two games to equal Lamar's MVP season. Yes. he has 9 more INTs than Lamar did that season, but if you take Josh's 2023 game averages (279.4 yards and 2.66 TDs) for the next two games, Josh would have 417 total yards and 2-3 TDs more than Lamar did in his MVP season...just sayin'.
You left out lost fumbles. He's only lost 3 this season. I really think we should be talking more about how Allen has cleaned up his fumbling problem. One of his credited lost fumbles was that weird end of game play against the Pats I think.
Meanwhile, Lamar has lost 6 and Tua, Mahomes and Hurts all have 5.
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1 hour ago, BullBuchanan said:
See that's just the thing. He's not anywhere remotely in consideration. Like there's a 1% chance or less that he wins the MVP. Several players above him would have to implode and he'd have to rack up back to back 500 yard/6TD games like Big Ben did.
Allen is having his worst statistical season since 2019 and has had way too many terrible games and way too few elite games. None of these things should be a debate because they're backed up directly with numbers. He also has the best o-line and skill position groups of his career.
He's been solid most of the time and has even had a handful of games where he's been elite, but saying he's "in consideration" for MVP is completely ludicrous especially considering we aren't even currently winning the division. The guy just had a 95 yard game where he threw a 47% rate. We steamrolled, so it didn't matter, but he was awful. It's a complete non-starter without a division championship and even - you're going to argue that Josh Allen is having a better season than Tyreek Hill? CMC? Stop it.
There are probably 4 players that would have to literally die before JA should be "in consideration". Will he get 1 vote? sure why not. He's not getting more than 3 out of 50. I don't call that a serious shot.
I'm sorry, but everything you've said in this thread is just ridiculous.
I think you should ban yourself from this very thread after you said you don't care about total TDs for QBs.
Here's what I'll say about this race. I don't really care about Vegas odds because Vegas doesn't vote on the MVP.
MVP voters vote when the season ends. After the last game. If they do that and Buffalo has won out, I think voters will look at the 4 or 5 main candidates at that point (CMC, Tyreek, Lamar, Tua?) and dismiss Tyreek and Tua because they lost head to head against Josh and potentially Lamar. They will dismiss Lamar because he's likely going to have 20 fewer TDs than Allen (TDs equal 6 points for posters like @BullBuchanan who don't actually understand football).
And then it's simply going to boil down to Allen vs CMC. And I think if Allen has 6+ TDs and 2 or fewer turnovers in the last 2 games, the voters are going to look at a QB who scored over 45 TDs leading his team to an almost improbable playoff berth based on mid-season record.
And Allen wins it.
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1 minute ago, Mikie2times said:
Not new, stil d-bagery.
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On 12/24/2023 at 8:16 PM, BullBuchanan said:
Here's another guy that doesn't understand the difference between betting odds and likely outcomes.
Oh really?
You said... and I quote:
"Allen still isn't anywhere near top 5 for MVP"
Now, please wiggle your way out of this trying to explain that you weren't 100% wrong.
Or just man up and admit you were wrong.
By the way, how did Brock Purdy do for his MVP case tonight?
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On 12/24/2023 at 11:42 AM, Mikie2times said:
Imagine if every poster bumped an accurate prediction? This place would be a disorganized mess. It's hilariously petty to go bumping your own thread and calling out other posters. As if the OP suffered some truma he deserves retribution for as a result of not being wrong. I wonder how many times other posters have called the OP out when he was wrong? Answers probably never because people don't go to that length of being scorned over a internet forum.
You must be new.
Happens here all the time.
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13 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:
Allen still isn't anywhere near top 5 for MVP and he probably went back even further after his performance today. This thread was silly when it was started but each week it goes on approaches lunacy.
https://www.foxsports.com/articles/nfl/2023-24-nfl-mvp-odds-and-favorites
https://www.vegasinsider.com/nfl/odds/mvp/
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4 hours ago, PayDaBill$ said:
You think he’d be posting had the crap storm with Dorsey continued?
Gmab, we’re still capable of regressing & not out of the woods yet. See last night. Game broke our way but dear lord that was vs a very mediocre team, a lifer no PT backup qb and an interim coach.
Nice we’re still in the picture but this team is still hard to figure at times.
Ohhh... I get it now. I just looked at the timing of your deleted post and it was during the game.
Lemme guess... you thought the Bills were going to lose so you preemptively started gloating that I was wrong and you were right and then we won so you had to delete it...
amiright???
I guess you're one of those fans.
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2 hours ago, PayDaBill$ said:
Lamo you’re are real Nostradamus with a take on 12/19. These statements or predictions aren’t static. What happened 11/14? The change over to Brady had a definite impact.
Love these posts made in hindsight.🥴Did you have to rethink this post and make it again 12 hours later for some reason?
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5 minutes ago, wppete said:
Hall of Fame??? To early to?
I think he's already in.
I know by the end of his career he's definitely in.
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Just now, HappyDays said:
I know he needs to be aggressive for us to have any chance. Our skill players are not going to make big plays happen all their own. Just in games against bad offenses he can afford to play more reserved, that's all. Still I recognize he was the only reason we scored points today and had to overcome a lot of bad play from the talent around him.
This team was in massive trouble without Allen today. We reversed course from last week as far as needing Allen to win.
Case in point: Allen had 1 turnover while OTHER had 2 turnovers.
Buffalo was on the road and lost the turnover margin 3 to 0. How often do teams win on the road when losing the turnover margin by that much?
I was worried about this game immediately after that debacle last week and then even more after the Chargers fired Staley.
Allen (and Oliver) carried us on his (their) shoulders and nothing else matters.
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He's already in the HOF
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22 minutes ago, HappyDays said:
It's just annoying because of how unnecessary it was. Allen has definitely crossed the line of reckless versus aggressive too many times this year. This is the kind of game where the last thing you want is to gift Easton Stick any kind of momentum... I don't mind the INT he had against the Eagles for example, it's a shootout against a Super Bowl caliber opponent and he had over 50 pass attempts. Having a dumb INT on 20 pass attempts against a bad opponent is just poor awareness of the game situation. There was just no need for a cross the body deep throw in this game against this opponent.
But then he totally redeemed himself by making several ridiculous throws on his clutch final drive to seal the game.
I mean... yeah... it sucked. I don't blame Allen for trying it, though. Diggs was open if Allen could've gotten it to him. Problem is he was throwing the ball probably 60 yards across the field while fading away.
I legitimately wonder if Allen put everything into that throw or not.
As it was, that play was a 2nd and 7. If it were a 3rd and 7 we'd just be viewing it as a 41 yard punt.
Problem was what the defense gave up much of the game.
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Funny how much that INT is going to hurt Allen. Really tough throw. Not necessarily a bad decision, just a bad throw.
Regardless, 1st QB in NFL history with 40+ TDs in 4 consecutive seasons.
That actually surprised me cause I thought Mahomes reached that.
Plus...
1st and only QB in NFL history to run and pass for a TD in 11 games in a season.
Survive and advance...
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6 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:
Current Odds as of this morning. Odd via Bovada.
Purdy -200
Jackson +450
Prescott +750
Allen +850
McCaffery +1000
Hurts +1800
Allen has had a meteoric rise two straight weeks from +5500 down to +2200 down to +850. Had the Eagles game gone the Bills way he would probably be right there with Jackson at +450.
With Purdy and Jackson going head-to-head this week it could really give one of them a boost while possibly dropping the other down to third behind Allen. Assuming both Bills and Cowboys win this week, I see Allen leapfrogging Dak. The number one thing Allen needs right now more than TD's, yards, less turnovers, is just wins. Just keep stacking wins. Any loss would be the nail in the coffin for his MVP chances.
As shocking as it sounds, I could see the loser of the Purdy/Jackson match up falling into a virtual tie with Allen. Yes, Purdy could stumble from -200 favorite to around +500 with Allen with a single loss. A Purdy loss would be huge in really opening the conversation up for all of the top 4 or 5. And because of Jackson's weak statistical output the door would remain open for guys like Dak, Allen and Purdy to capture the award before seasons end.
This Jackson MVP hype train is just so F*in confusing to me!
Am I the only one?
I get Purdy. I get Dak. Heck, I even understood Tua while it lasted.
But Lamar??????
Lamar Jackson
3846 total yards
66.3% comp %
22 total TDs
13 total TOs
1 4th Quarter Comeback
0 Game Winning Drives
Josh Allen
3939 total yards
66.3% comp %
37 total TDs
17 total TOs
1 4th Quarter Comeback
2 Game Winning Drives
Brock Purdy
3933 total yards
69.8% comp %
31 total TDs
9 total TOs
0 4th Quarter Comebacks
0 Game Winning Drives
Dak Prescott
3851 total yards
68.8% comp %
30 Total TDs
9 total TOs
1 4th Quarter Comeback
2 Game Winning Drives
I don't even know if Lamar Jackson ends up with 30 TDs. There is NO WAY Lamar is winning MVP.
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No clue if Peacock is still having the deal, but on Black Friday I got Peacock for $2 per month for a full year and can cancel at any time.
So I technically paid $2 to watch the game. But honestly, there are some movies and shows on there I'll watch, anyway.
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On 10/22/2023 at 12:32 PM, Dablitzkrieg said:
Give it up already. They are toast.
Still feel that way???
On 10/22/2023 at 3:15 PM, PayDaBill$ said:Given the upcoming schedule, injuries, & repeated poor play I highly doubt we break 500. It’s unfortunate but I haven’t seen growth over the 7 games all I’ve seen is regression.
Sooo... you don't think we win another game????
On 10/22/2023 at 3:51 PM, PayDaBill$ said:Wash LV 🙄? Come on. Did you see the last 3 performances? That’s a football team that is not improving.
Bookmark this and get back to me when the season ends.
Look hope I’m wrong & thing’s straighten out but this is currently a bad football team.
We now have as many losses after 7 as we did last season. Unfortunately now the meat of the schedule is coming.
Bookmarked
On 10/22/2023 at 4:11 PM, Generic_Bills_Fan said:Mahomes has it locked up…6 games against raiders chargers broncos is a cheat code. No idea what happened to those chargers and broncos defenses they have nosedived
Man... coming back to threads like this with all the concrete declarations is hilarious.
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On 10/22/2023 at 12:03 PM, PayDaBill$ said:
Not to be a Negative Nancy did you take a peak at the upcoming schedule?
Yep... and we beat KC and Dallas.
You take a look at our remaining schedule?
On 10/22/2023 at 12:05 PM, boyst said:Mack Jones just threw almost 300 yards on us and we should just be concerned?
I guess I do agree. I realized in London we are a pretender and 0-1 playoff year
Still think that???
On 10/22/2023 at 12:08 PM, Beast said:The Bills are also playing the “easy” half of their schedule. After Thursday night, look out.
For what??? The Buffalo Bills????
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6 hours ago, VW82 said:
I think Josh has basically zero chance. He's going to lead the league in turnovers and we're in all likelihood going to sneak in as a 7th seed.
But more to the point, Josh doesn't deserve MVP. Like it or not, his hand-picked OC got fired mid-season. Our signature win of the year (Dallas) happened because of our run game and defense. Meanwhile, Josh has had some high profile bad games/plays.
He might be a top 5 player in the league this year, but I don't think MVP is very realistic.
Nope.
At this point I would bet you money Allen won't lead the league in turnovers.
He's no longer alone at the top, anyway.
Allen has 17 turnovers.
Sam Howell has 17 turnovers.
Recent MVP frontrunner Jalen Hurts has 17 turnovers.
Allen has 11 TDs and 3 interceptions since Brady took over.
Mahomes will probably have more turnovers by the end of the year than Allen.
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2023 MVP: Lamar will win it with 15 fewer TDs than Josh Allen (end of season talk pg 75+)
in The Stadium Wall
Posted
Are you sure that's still the public perception?