BisonMan

Damn, LA teams! My mind can't start with L.A. and end with Chargers. I'm so old I still call them the "Baltimore Colts".

I watched several of the shows on both ESPN and NFL Network today and their coverage of the move to Peterman. For the most part, the commentary was inane. Very little in the way of player analysis (i.e. who does what better) from the talking heads. There was a lot of talk about dividing the locker room and general statements about how rookies fare. Not one discussed McD's admission in his presser that the move to Peterman was a "risk" that the team felt it had to take or how he downplayed the overall importance of a 2017 playoff appearance vs. competing for a championship in the long-run. Several commentators noted the salary hit from Taylor if he remains a Bill in 2018 as a factor and the desire to see what they have in Peterman before the draft. Only one (Heath Evans?) discussed how having a faster release was a factor in choosing Peterman over Taylor, especially against the Rams' pass rush. A couple of really good stats were shown on NFL Live (ESPN) but nobody really addressed them in their discussion. First, Tyrod is 3rd worst in the league in completion percentage on throws over 15 yards this year (52%). I think they were the ones that also showed that Peterman had the highest completion percentage in the Big 5 conferences on those throws last year. More telling, Tyrod has the second lowest completion rate (29%) in the league on throws into "tight windows" (which ESPN defined as receivers within 1 yard of the coverage defender) over the last two years after Geoff (who had a horrible rookie 2016). One show noted the time of possession in the Saints game (18 mins) as a demonstration of the team's offensive ineptitude. I was struck that not a single one of the shows analyzed game film of either QB (pointing out weaknesses and/or strengths). The only film was "B-roll" while a commentator discussed a players. Very disappointing. I'm hoping for more of this as Sunday rolls around. As TBD denizens note, the ability for Peterman to "throw receivers open" and Tyrod's inability to read defenses quickly was probably a key reason for the switch.

No, Marcel Darius wasn't injured.

<shrug> - Atlas

A fumble is a "live ball" too. That just means the play isn't dead (e.g. Incomplete pass).

Good pulling out the rules here. Thanks. Unfortunately, there is still some ambiguity in my mind. It never states that a backward pass that hits the ground ISN'T a fumble but the rule treats it exactly as if it were a fumble. It also mentions an "intentional fumble". How is that not exactly a backward pass that hit the ground? I think there is some "intent" inferred by refs on backward passes (I.e. Laterals) which hit the ground that they could use to differentiate the from intentional fumbles. I need Dean Blandino to explain this one.

I, for one, take no joy in hearing about layoffs from any company. I fail to see how hoping for ESPN's demise is much of a good thing. If you don't like the programming, don't watch it. Don't like your cable bill, unplug as many have. Having lived through the 70s in Buffalo, I have some idea of the devastating toll layoffs can have on people, big and small. My current employer is also going through a layoff process. Real people are being hurt and their lives are turned upside down. One of my colleagues killed himself after being laid off. Statistically, this happens everywhere. My thoughts are with those employees that are about to get laid off (if true) at ESPN. They likely won't find as well paying an employer even if they find continued employment in their field. Many of these folks are not going to be "on air", highly paid talent. They are just working schmoes like the rest of us.

Either team can normally advance fumbles as well. This does not account for the rule on advancing a fumble in the last 2 minutes, which is not allowed.

This was exactly my thinking as I screamed at the TV during the play for the refs to blow the whistle. It happened several times on that play (as noted) that I couldn't imagine the refs being that incompetent and that I must not understand the rules on laterals/fumbles. If the refs are that clueless on a type of play that happens at the end of a lot of one-score games, the NFL really needs to stage an intervention with the officiating crews. The risk of injury is just way too high on a disjointed play like this where players are coming at each other from all sorts of non-typical directions. This is the ultimate "head on a swivel" play for defenders. If the Bucs had scored, this play would have gone to review. If over-ruled (as I think it would have been), it would have been a total black eye for the league. Again, looking at the Bills/Packers game, the refs immediately blew the whistle when a Packer recovered the fumble. So, the refs are trained for traditional looking fumbles, just not for bounced laterals. EdW

This is my point. If a player attempts a lateral and it bounces and a defender gets it before an offensive player, it's a fumble recovery. How can you recover a fumble that wasn't a fumble? I still think a bounced lateral attempt is a fumble.

Yes, this was the first time I'd ever seen a team bounce laterals on the last play of the game. I've seen players being tackled try to lateral and the ball hitting the turf being ruled dead under the rule.

So, the player's intent is the key here? Imagine a QB being taken down at the end of a game and he throws the ball backward toward a teammate. It bounces off the turf and the lineman picks it up and scores. This would be legal based on the refs interpretation of the QBs intent, right? Strange rule. I can't think of other "intent" rules in the game aside from certain personal fouls.

The rule applies to any play within 2 minutes left in either half. It doesn't apply at other times. The Ravens scored a TD tonight on a ball fumbled forward into the end zone ("holy roller"). It just wasn't in the last 2 minutes of a half. It definitely applies to balls "fumbled" backward as happened in the Packer's game against the Bills. As soon as another Packer picked up the ball, the play was blown dead at the site of the recovery. Safety for the Bills! http://www.buffalobills.com/video/videos/30_Blitz_Bucs_vs_Bills/497360e6-6972-423e-8ae8-750ae7e43d55 So, I'm still unclear as to how a "lateral" that hits the ground is not a fumble. Could you not claim that any ball hitting the ground was a "lateral"? Clearly, there must be some language of "intent" in the rule to allow a ball hitting the ground behind the spot the player released to be ruled a lateral ("he meant to do that") vs. a fumble ("he didn't intent to do that"). I just don't know the rule well enough and need some clarification.

Gents, In watching the last multi-lateral play against the Bucs, I noticed during the play that a few of the lateral pitches/passes hit the turf before being picked up and advanced by Bucs' players. I thought that any time the ball hits the turf, it's technically a fumble (intentional or not). If that's true and the play happened within the last two minutes of the game, the refs should have blown the whistle as soon as another player besides the one that "fumbled" picked up the ball. This is similar to the safety the Bills got against Aaron Rodgers in the end zone a couple of years ago. Rodgers fumbled the ball and another Packer picked it up. The Refs immediately blew the whistle indicating a dead ball at the spot of the recovery (in the end zone) causing a safety. So, shouldn't the last play by the Bucs have been ruled down as soon as the ball skipped off the turf from one player to another. I don't see how "intent" to skip it could be in the rule and thereby this should be a fumble. Thoughts? I may be out to lunch on this one in not understanding the rule. The announcers never said a peep about this during the game. I haven't seen anything on this in the press/web either.

I'll go with 9-1 heading into the KC game. Next week worries me the most as Cincy seems erratic. We might kill them or they play like they have have most of the last few years and give us a hell of a time. I like playing Tampa at home. They've lost already to a lesser team than Buffalo. Carr is likely out with the broken back bone so, a sad homecoming for EJ. Jets are not tanking but the Bills still should beat them at home. The Saints are another worrisome game but their defense is weak and their offense didn't put up that many points by Saints standards against the dumpster fire that is the Patriots defense right now. The Chargers will be a Bills home game if last week is any indication. That should give us the advantage but the Chargers play everyone close...and lose. So, that's six straight games in my mind. Then two weeks of hell and then some more breathing room. 12-4 in the end. EdW

Bringing Down the Haushka! The dude is money. We need another turnover.

Falcon defense is likely tired after the last Bills drive. Time to stuff it down their throats.

If they jumped, the Bills could have had a free play. A-Aron tactic. Probably had a sneak or something called. If Woods sees them jump, he snaps it to Tyrod and they plow ahead. Two man play with a defense off-balance. Didn't work. Take the 3. I like the strategy. Trust the Defense. Trust the process....

Time for 4 consecutive naked boot legs!

How long before this laxative takes effect? I don't have all night...

Good point.

Culled from things I’ve read on this forum and others….along with my own twisted mind. It’s easy to see why fans can have completely different outlooks on 2017 or, like me, have no idea what we’re about to see starting at 1pm today. 10 Reasons the Bills will be better Better Coach/GM – Rex+Doug was a dumpster fire and it’s hard to imagine McBean being worse. New offensive scheme – The Bills were the top rushing team but one of the worst through the air. Dennison’s scheme will improve Tyrod’s play by making it simpler for him. New defensive scheme – It was hard to imagine a Rex coached defense would drop into the bottom half of the league from being top-5. That turns around under McDermott with largely the same/better personnel. The defensive line will excel. Basically, the Bills’ D-Line personnel are 4-3 guys, particularly Hughes. He’ll return to Pro-Bowl form. Darius will also be better because he needs tough love to grow up. Kyle's on his last tour and will leave it all on the field. Shaq will finally get to demonstrate his draft value. Bringing Down the Hauschka – The return of Schmidt and the addition of Hauschka should improve the team’s kicking game. Last year, lack of confidence in the FG kicker took points off the board along with his missed XPs. Points equals wins. The secondary will be better. OK, a lot of folks think they won’t but the safety play will definitely be better than last year’s post Aaron Williams group. I actually think the CBs will be better based on the scheme and fit. I’ll take White/Gaines over last year’s duo in a zone scheme. Discipline has returned to Buffalo. Some think this is overrated and that talent is all that matters. Bellicheat shows that’s not true. A reduction of the stupid penalties alone will help add to the win total in 2017. Aside from the penalties and the “our best ten are out there” defense, a ton of other “discipline” related mistakes cost the Bills plenty in 2016. Missed assignments, poor technique, etc. are all signs of a poorly disciplined team. That goes away in 2017…mostly. Charles Clay – Clay was mostly an afterthought in 2016. Dennison’s scheme has typically focused more attention on the TE’s and Clay will benefit. He is arguably the best receiving option on the team and this offense utilizes/schemes for the TE. Clay will have a monster year. We may even see the emergence of a future Pro-Bowler in Logan Thomas. That O-Line is still good. The Bills return their road-grading offensive line from 2016. A second year together typically helps a line get better. That’s something we haven’t seen from the Bills in many years. Dion Dawkins could improve that as the year goes on which should frighten other teams. The AFC East won’t be as good as 2016. The Jets are in full-tank. The Dolphins have “team killer” Jay Cutler at the help (someone no other team in the NFL thought could help them even with the lack of talent at the QB position we see on many teams). Even the SB Champs have looked ordinary at times. The Chiefs delivered the 2nd half that the Falcons didn’t in the SuperBowl. Tom Brady is still great but he’s going to have more days like last Thursday as the season rolls on. You can forestall Father Time only so far. Like Michael Jordan and many other past greats, age starts to show with uneven performances. One week, Brady will look great but with greater regularity we’ll see his performance drop off. Climate Change (yes I’m going there) – Climate change brings warmer and WETTER weather. The Bills’ are a run-first team which is what you want to be in the rain and snow. Add a couple of games in the pouring rain/snow in 2017 and the Bills will have the upper hand again the modern pass-first teams in the upper NFL echelon. Bengals, Bucs, Saints and 2 against the Pats could have weather related aid for the Bills. 10 Reasons the Bills will be Worse in 2017 New Coaching staff – it’s typically a down year for teams with staff turnover. This is especially true for “rookie” coaches. McDermott may not be immune to this ailment. New Offensive running scheme – The Bills were obviously the top rushing team in 2016 and a zone-blocking scheme may not fit this O-Line group. Shady may also not thrive in a “one-cut” running game. Talent loss – a lot has been written about the losses of Sammy, Darby and Gilleslee. In each case, the talent that replaced them was seen by the league as unequal. Hell, the Bills saw it that way too by demanding attritional picks with each trade or FA loss. It’s hard to argue that a drop-off in talent will improve a team. Tyrod doesn’t fit the new offense - The scheme typically has QBs rolling out to throw. While many think this will help Tyrod, he is not very good throwing from outside the pocket on the run. An unstable “platform” is not a recipe for success for a QB with accuracy issues. Also, Tyrod’s scrambling has come from the center of the field. Rollouts limit the field to one-side for this type of improvisation/panic. That could further limit his effectiveness. Shady is older – There is no doubt that with each carry, more of the tread comes off the tires on RBs. Shady, while immensely talented is no exception. We could see the beginning of the inevitable decline as it’s rare that RBs hitting 30 get better or stay as effective. The “Process” – at some point, this type of leadership turns to autocracy. By that I mean that underlings start to see that the process is the only thing that matters instead of victory. If you’ve ever seen Clint Eastwood’s Heartbreak Ridge, you know the type of leader I’m talking about. They are more concerned with doing things in an “orderly and efficient manner” than they are in killing the enemy. I’ve worked for people like this and they tend to get the least out of people because they lose sight of the goal…winning. The schedule – Yes, the Bills had an easier schedule in 2016. This year they face loaded divisions in the AFC West and NFC South. 7 of these 8 teams have true “franchise” QBs and we don’t. That is not a good ratio. The remaining non-division teams both have franchise QBs (provided Luck returns by the time we plan the Colts in December). The Pats – The schedule hits us again by having the Bills play the Pats late in the season when they typically have reached peak form. Catching them early (like the Chiefs) is better. Having to play the perennial SB contender twice each year doesn’t help you improve your record. Our WR group stinks – I doubt many teams are terrified of a second round rookie at the #1 slot and Jordan Matthews. Neither appears to be a down-field threat. That means the Bills will likely see more “8 in the box” defenses which will limit the effectiveness of the running scheme. Jones may end up being better than Bob Woods but a rookie year has its learning curve. The Bills could be out of the playoffs before Zay “gets it”. Rookie GM – As much as a rookie HC has trouble succeeding, a rookie GM can make mistakes that really damage a team long-term. There are a lot of questions still remaining about Beane and his ability to build a roster. He’s never done it and moves he’s made this year could hurt both in the short and long-term. Are we too thin at RB now? No WR to stretch the defense? An entire revamping of the secondary? A rookie QB for when Tyrod is inevitably injured? That’s all on the GM if it doesn’t work. Go Bills! EdW

Bob Chandler for me. Poor man's Fred Bilitnikoff. Deserved better teams and QBs. Glad he got a ring with the Raiders before he retired. Died too young. RIP.

Manzel looked poised and relaxed as well. Turns out, he was just drunk. Step away from the Kool-aid stand....

What's more amazing about these stats is that Shady turns more poor line play into positive yards than any back I've seen. Of course, he also turns 1-2 yard gainers into TFLs by trying to turn nothing into something. Watching the linked video shows me how good the Bills' blocking has been as a lot of those runs he goes untouched. Kudos to the line play and the receivers blocking down field. With Bob and Sam gone, I wonder how many downfield blocks Shady will get this year. Does Zay Jones scare anybody with his blocking ability? Boldin? Matthews? EdW