MAGIC MAN

Catching up on the debate, a couple things I've noticed by reading the posts and NOT actually posting. 1- What's to say that JBJ's alleged departure from the Toronto group is anything more than a sign that he wants off a sinking ship ? That he wants to restore his image and that the MLSE/Tannebaum bid is in even more trouble now then before ? 2- I'm not sure why all of you are jumping down "jahbonas" ass for a simple question, which to be honest, hasn't been answered in the 50+ posts since he asked it or from what I can recall the 2 threads before this one. I believe the question is, "Is the lease preventing the move or is their indeed language contained within the actual trust that forbids the trust from selling to a group that intends to relocate the team ?" We all know the LEASE prohibits the move and has restrictive language, I believe the question was whether the trust does as well, and if it does, why hasn't that language been leaked ? Now, before all of you jump down my ass, I'm simply asking the same question that hasn't been answered, and saying the trust won't sell to a group that wants to move the team is NOT answering the question. Again, I think the question is, "is their wording in the trust that prohibits relocation or is it just in the lease"

It does make me feel better if the FO was indeed trying to sign Orton for several weeks.

The move for Orton was a good one, the issue is why did they wait until a week before the season ? Why not make that move 2 weeks ago when they knew their backup QB's were having an issue, or why not make it instead of adding Jordan Palmer and give Orton some snaps in the last preseason game ? Again, I like the move, but don't understand why they waited so long to make it. As for this FO, they've done some good things and some bad things, in the end they'll be judged on the team's record this year. That's the only truly objective measuring stick.

What do you make of the apparent lack of accountability that seems to be emerging with EJ this preseason ? Last year, I thought he was a lot more self-deprecating and humble, this year, he seems to be deflecting and being much more polyanna when it comes to his own play. Not a good sign. Comparing Palmer's and his quotes after the last game it was concerning.

I still find it astonishing that we are in this situation of having to comb through other people's garbage to find backups for the most critical position in football and we didn't even have an injury. YES, bring in Pryor.

Agree, but, historically speaking, trading that much for a WR is not a good idea and that trade was based as much on Sammy as it was on confidence in EJ, and right now, while Sammy looks good, EJ sure as hell doesn't. Time will tell, but it doesn't look good (unfortunately).

I see your logic, but, the NFL wouldn't characterize it that way, they would say Buffalo traded their 1st in 2014, their 1st and 4th in 2015 for Cleveland's 1st in 2014. So, in essence, it's a net loss of one 1st round pick and one 4th round pick -- But, as ScottLaw points out, still a crappy trade

We traded: 2014 1st 2015 1st 2015 4th So, the 2014 1st was already selected in May's draft

Terry please save us !

I think the new policy is fair. A stiff penalty the first time and lifetime ban the second. Folks that suggest that the victim might have "had it coming" fail to fully understand or appreciate just how serious an issue domestic abuse is in our society. I'm sure they've never faced it in their personal lives. I get that Ray Rice is remorseful and I get that his spouse has forgiven him, however, as close to a zero tolerance policy as you can get in this area the better for all involved.

At least for me it's not about giving EJ enough time or casting final judgment too early, it's about having a backup plan if things don't work out and seeing more tangible progress from EJ. Neither of those are throwing in the towel on EJ.

So you know, I'm not clamoring for Cousins, I think it would have been a better strategy to bring in legit competition for EJ either a younger vet (Cousins), decent vet (Vick) or rookie (mid-round pick) -- versus having 4 very inexperienced QB's in camp with only one with decent upside

Rumor was that they were shopping him in offseason, one specific rumor was Skins turning down a 4th from Cleveland and saying they'd have done it for a 2nd -- translation, you could have been had for a 3rd maybe. Again, this FO is all in on EJ, so it wasn't in the cards -- the veteran route was more likely

I think the time for Freeman has passed w/r/t the Bills. If they wanted to bring in someone to compete with EJ it should have been done earlier in camp. Vick, S Hill, McCowan, trade for Cousins, Freeman would have all been viable options in July, but right now, the Bills FO made their bed and need to do their best to maximize EJ's performance. To that point, Jordan Palmer is a decent option, a calm, knowledgeable voice in the QB room to help EJ develop. It sucks, we are in this situation with the most important position, but, as they say, you deal with the cards you've been dealt.

But, you agree, you don't want them to keep the Toronto game, right? As for naming rights, I guess it would be poor taste to try and change it now. You should also keep in mind that those other teams in the mid 20's will see their revenue grow year to year so, I think best case given your numbers is for the Bills to be in the mid-20's in 2014, but even that would be respectable.

OK, a joke it is, excuse the plagiarism: A Bills fan sits down in his seat and looks to his left and notices an empty seat next to him. He says to the guy next to the empty seat: "I can't believe someone would not come to the home opener" The guy replied "Oh, that was my wife's seat, she's a huge Bills fan, but unfortunately she passed away" The man says: "That's too bad, I'm sorry for your loss, but couldn't you have given her seat to someone in your family or one of your friends and have them come to the game with you" The guy: "No, they are all at her funeral"

No need to call me a hater, I'm trying to have a calm and civil discussion and get to the bottom of why you and so many others are so impressed with Brandon. Your data (that you linked) is a year old, so they were 22nd in the 8/2013 Forbes which would be based on 2012 season and now are 29th in the 8/2014 Forbes which is based on the 2013 season. So, I think my conclusion is still valid, they ranked 29th last year and would have ranked 32nd without selling that one game to Toronto. Again, keeping the discussion to Revenue only, that's not too impressive from my point of view. If they indeed go up to the middle of the pack, without having to sell a home game, I think that would be an accomplishment.

Kirby - Where are you getting your figures for 20th in Revenue ? The attached Forbes valuation (sort it by revenue) has the Bills ranked 29th out of the 32 teams. In addition, if you take out the incremental revenue they got from the Rogers-Toronto deal (which we ALL agree is bad for the team), they would rank dead last in Revenue. The way I see it, he kept the team profitable by using the shared revenues (just like other teams), selling a home game to Toronto and having a fairly loyal fan base that buys tickets. On the cost side, the Bills keep their expenses low (because they are in bad market, i.e. lower cost of living and have an older stadium, i.e.no debt) and they under spend the salary cap (I know it has nothing to do with winning Bandit)--- this way they remain profitable. So, respectfully, I'm not sure what he's doing that is so miraculous, what am I missing ? http://www.forbes.co...on:desc_search:

BTW, I sincerely hope I'm wrong and would glady eat crow on these boards, however, I fear I'm not.

I think this seemingly endless debate comes down to whether you trust and believe that Brandon is the right person to make the changes necessary organizationally to create a consistent winner on and off the field. I don't think he is for a variety of reasons that I've tried in numerous threads and in way too many posts, apparently unsuccessfully, to communicate to all of you. In the end, the on the field product will be the ultimate measurement and the new owner the definitive judge and jury.

Not sure why changing an organization's culture is so hard to follow ? Either way, I do agree with what May Day 10 posted. Glad to see others feel the same way.

Because if you want to stop the perpetual losing that has taken place, you need to change the culture that supports it. Having worked in several large corporations, I've seen first hand how easy it is for employees to become complacent or accept the status quo, I've seen how these same corporations have "turned it around" when a new CEO comes in. Often times it is impossible for an insider to change the culture.

Well that would suck if we had to wait until December or even March. I gotta think if the bids are a slam dunk for one bidder, they'd find a way to make it work for October.

Of course I can't prove it hasn't changed, no more than you can prove it has changed. A big part of this thread and a few other threads has been centered around the QB situation on this team and how dire it appears to be, both with a struggling starter and his backups. When I read through the posts, I found it odd that so many people are quick to try and blame Nix, or they want to get rid of Hackett or get rid of Marrone or even fire Whaley, yet, they are so adamantly defending Brandon as if he has nothing to do with what's happened. I'd be curious to see how many different OC's, DC's, HC's and GM's we've had in this organization during this playoff drought. But, I guess we can keep replacing OC's, DC's, HC's and GM's and hope for a different outcome over the next 14 years.