PDaDdy

I hear ya. It's not like he's getting an extra half of the field. Top to bottom probably isn't an enormous difference. I am curios though to know if that stat DOES include turnovers and 4th down stops. Stops on fourth probably happen so infrequently they are almost negligible but turn overs can help if they are in the opponents territory. That being said. I really don't believe that that is as much a contributing factor to Flacco's success and to a much lesser extent Matt Ryan. Those guys were first round QB picks with huge arms. I think that and their poise and pocket presence are MUCH larger factors.

uuuuuhhhh...unless I'm missing something doesn't average drive start INCLUDE stops on 4th down, turnovers etc? Or were those stats PURELY based on kicks and punts? Even if they were, aren't you kind of reaching a bit to make another excuse for Trent? You're taking the spotlight off of the fact that HE WAS benefited by the best drive start in the league whether it includes turn overs and stops on 4th or not. Don't shift the focus.

San Diego not only wasn't a top defense last year they were not good without Shawn Merriman. They were terrible the first few weeks, Gates and LT were nicked up if memory serves. Again not impressed with another Edwards win over a .500 or lower team. I really attribute the Jacksonville win to 3 of their starting o-line guys not playing. I'm not going to bother looking it up but didn't we get some special teams help in the way of field position and or scoring?

Ah, I gotcha. Yes, Flacco does tend to exhibit great poise and pocket presence for a young guy.

Bad comparison with Joe Flacco. He has a big time NFL arm. Trent can't model his game after him. He needs to look at a guy like Pennington who was an effective if not big armed QB.

Don't sleep on Stuparman! Right now I think he is our best and most complete TE. He's the ONLY guy I see working the middle of the field 7 - 17 yds out not to mention I think is potentially our best blocker. SOOOO not impressed with Shouman! Maybin is a project and we should set our expectations accordingly. In my opinion he was drafted because he has more "upside" than Orakpo who at this point is probably maxed out physically and won't get any faster.

Man I would love for you to be right. I just get the feeling though that if Harris doesn't get any first team defensive reps this week or next week it won't happen until later in the season at best. To me the week after the bye week is the week to do it because you have 2 weeks to coach the guy up and prep for the upcoming opponent. Excelling in practice is one thing, excelling in preseason with the second team defense is another but when the games count for real is a completely different thing. I hope he continues to impress and look good.

Lol. I kind of agree. The kid looks great imho. Where I will say that it looks like his game is lacking is understanding the complete defense. I only recall him missing one assignment on defense on a long pass to a Green Bay TE. The "listed" weights don't seem to support it but this guy already looks bigger than Ellison. I heard that supposedly Harris didn't lift weights for size in college because he was already a huge safety. With a little work from a professional weight and conditioning staff his guy could easily play in the 240's if not low 250's like POZ. He's a rook so he will naturally gain weight anyway. He also seems to play faster and more aggressively than Ellison does and he seems to always somehow be around the ball often making a play. I was almost pissed off when Ellison made that great 4 and 1 play against Green Bay because that will be fuel for the coaches to delay the emergence of Harris.

Ellison isn't quite as bad as some people say but I definitely want to see an upgrade at the position. I was hoping for opening day but we know the coaching staff has veteran man love. I'm realistically hoping that they give him the start after the bye week. We probably have to many young guys on defense to screw with them but I would like us to show a few 3 - 4 looks. If not for anything else it's good for the offense to see some basic 3 - 4 looks.

Details please? I don't recall his RT contract being renegotiated.

That is just incredibly uninformed and a terrible comparison. JP sack hangers. LOL. Are you really trying to compare a 2 time probowl LT to a rookie WR who has never played an NFL game? For shame!

For the record they Bills always maintained that there was no guarantee that they would redo his contract. They only said they would talk about it. We all know that "talk is cheap". They weren't going to "redo" a damn thing. Great real world example. Perhaps they wouldn't/shouldn't have given the guy a raise and continue to underpay him. However in the real world an employee can flip off their underpaying employer and get fair market value for their skills with another employer. Exactly what happened in my eyes.

I agree. Talent is the agents fuel. If teams want talented prospects they have to talk to the agents that they signed with. I know the guy is doing his job but I'm still annoyed by him. If anything I think he will get more talent signing with him because of the money he got Peters regardless of how Peters performs.

Man. Somehow I never get tired of this discussion. JohnC is right assuming Peters gets through his injury and maintains his probowl form. I don't know if you have ever been promoted in your life but I have been and it comes with a pay raise. Peters was promoted from RT to LT. He not only played great he played at a 2 time probowl level. He's gone. We have to move on.

I can assure you I am not he/she. I'm arrogant enough that I don't need an alias or multiple usernames. LOL. I was on realfootball365 for a while but there were a bunch of dunderheads over there. I have been reading the articles on this one for a while. I left a WHILE ago but, I think that forum and site ended up dying anyway. Those guys pissed in their own Wheaties every morning.

Not sure what you mean by "fishy"? Just a very long time Bills fan, reformed JP Losman supporter and Trent Edwards realist!

Danger! Danger! Biscuit! I used to throw out those types of figures when I was a Losman supporter. Not that he was the next coming of Jim Kelly but at the time he was replaced he was statistically better than Edwards and in spite of his bone head plays he put TDs on the board and Lee Evans, who some claim is not a #1, put up 1200+ yds and 8 TDs in 2006. And dare I say it? All with the same sh!tty coaching, offensive line, even worse coordinator, etc.

The Trent apologists hate this thread but I love it. Props to who ever coined the term "Trent apologists". LOVE IT. Maybe I am a rare fan that actually hopes that Trent does well but can still objectively say that he hasn't done much of anything against a team with a winning record and we know the issues with the 3 - 4 defense. All in good fun, let's summarize and add: 1) JP sucks - No longer on the team people. Give it up! 2) Trent has a winning record - But has never beat a team that ended the year with a winning record 3) Trent is god, everyone else sucks 4) If Trent sucks this year it's because the fans were objective and critical of his mistakes and down right mean 5) Trent has a great completion percentage - Not coincidentally our RB tandem lead the league in receptions. Can you say checkdown? 6) Comparing the TEAMS, not Trents, wins against sub .500 teams and holding it up against real QBs like Manning, Brady, Kelly, and Manning that have big time NFL arms 7) It's only preseason!!! - Pay no attention to the melt down after week 6 last year!!!! 8) It's the conucussion - Trent himself said this was not a factor

Who said anything about preseason? As I read in some article Edwards is about as ineffective as you can be for completing all of the passes he does. 11 TDs and 10 INTs last year I think it was. He needs to show some SERIOUS improvement specifically in getting the offense to put TDs on the board until we can say this guy will be our QB in 2010.

Completely valid! We are killing this one play to death. lol. I guess I look at order of operation to finally put it to rest for me. In order: 1) QB throws the ball late 2) WR attempts to position himself and shield the ball to make the catch but some think he's not aggressive enough 3) DB drives through the WR for a no call on pass interference tipping the ball for the INT What I see in all that is if the QB throws that ball on time....the other things never happen SOOOO back on topic. Trent looks lost because he can't read 3 - 4 defenses and not because Lee Evans is not a good WR. LOL

You can only see it that way if you aren't trying to make apologies for Trent. Some aren't capable of looking at the play as a whole and that Trent threw it late. Even the commentators said so. They also don't get the concept of timing in that a WR is supposed to be in a specific place at a specific time and so is the ball. I wish I could remember the guy that said it but basically the quote was "if you wait for a WR to be open before you throw him the ball, it's already too late." That and a less than stellar arm are Trent's biggest problems. One can be corrected, one we just have to live with. People are going to believe what they want.

Wow. Just WOW. Until WR start throwing the ball to themselves, that is just INCREDIBLY uninformed!

Again it is amazing how two people can watch the same thing and see to different things. What I saw at 12:34 - 12:33 on the clock in the first quarter is Trent make a little hesitation, hitch, jerk before finally releasing the ball late. I saw Lee get to the spot where the ball was supposed to be and position himself properly to shield the ball. I saw a DB run through his back on a no call pass interference. I also remember hearing former NFL player commentators say that Edwards threw the ball late. But I guess you see what you want to see.

I assume everyone on this board is a similar fanatic and has already read this article. Usually I don't recall liking this guys articles but sadly I think he is 100% right on with his assessment of where we are right now. T.O. could change things and it could be night and day but I'll have to see him play more than one drive in the hall of fame game. http://www.buffalonews.com/opinion/columns...ory/773794.html

A WR is only as good as the QB throwing to him. Every example you mention those are better QBs than Edwards. Welker has to be accounted for every play because he plays opposite Randy Moss and even more importantly catches balls thrown by Tom Brady. Chad Johnson another great example you use. He has a real QB in Palmer and his 3year stats are 1117 and 6 TDs. Sounds like almost the exact same production as Lee Evans again making my point he is a true #1 just like Coles, just like Ochocinco. All without a premier QB. This isn't rocket science. You can throw out all of your what routes he runs, unquantifiable ability to "bail out" his QB, superlatives like "hard nosed" and all the other stuff but you can't ague with production. He produces exactly like other guys you call #1. Again my assessment of a #1 is based on production and who the other team game plans to take away. That, my friend, is Lee Evans. To the point of his short and over the middle route running. Since Edwards can't or doesn't throw over 20, MAYBE 25, yards in the air, defenses don't have to truly respect the supposed only 1/3 of the field Lee can function in and his speed. This makes it easier to blanket him for all of Edward's short throws. I hope you get that concept. Speed is what Lee does and with a QB that can take advantage of it properly is what opponents fear. We can put it in other terms like basketball. If your team can't hit the 3 point shot the defense will pack it in an plug up the middle and clamp down on the short stuff. If the defense doesn't respect the outside shot it is extremely difficult to drive the lane and get lay ups or uncontested shots in the paint. You can't blame the ills of the QB on the WR. Time to put the blame where is should lay. Edwards has a lot of improving to do.