Alphadawg7
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Posts posted by Alphadawg7
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"when our current QB was ranked near the bottom in almost every important QB statistic is a bit of reach."
Seriously, please stop with that near the bottom bs you're trying desperately to propagate...
10th in TD%
10th in Sack%
15th in TDs (13 games)
16th Yards per game
17th Yards per catch
21st in Completions (13 games)
22nd in Yards (13 games)
Given that he only played in 13 games, he would have moved those last two "bottom stats" him to the middle of the pack if he had played in three extra games. Fitzpatrick managed these respectable stats on a team that ranked near last on defense, near last on getting turnovers and near last in having any semblance of a running game. He improved his QB rating by 12 points in 2010. We know you think he's our biggest problem, but at least be fair to him by not making <stuff> up and presenting it as fact.
LMAO...Like I said, the important categories to correctly analyze a QB's play and what coaches hold the highest...like comp %, YPA, 3rd %, Turnovers, QB Rating, and scores. Of course you left most of those off your list and only add the ones that are greatly enhanced by the sheer number of pass attempts he had and his TD total, which again, is all you ever focus on because its all you have.
Hell, if you give me enough attempts I could lead the league in completions.
Just stop trying to spin his total to look like he did better than he did...keep that in the other thread where you have tried to twist and spin everything you can.
And enough with the defense excuse to validate Fitz poor showings. The lousy D is not why Fitz struggles to accurately throw a screen pass...its not why he was 9th in the league in INTS (and he was very lucky it wasnt higher with so many dropped INTs), its not why he over throws or under throws recievers, its not why he fumbles, its not why he too often doesnt hit the reciever in stride so they can make a play...etc etc. Just like its not the D's fault SJ dropped the game winner and several other passes.
Sure, the D blew and that contributed to this teams record...but the offensive execution is not the D's fault, so quit blaming it in your excuses for Fitz struggles.
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I would be fine with Newton AD, but disagree with the premise of your post. If the Bills draft a QB at #3 It will be because Ralph wants to sell tickets, just like the Spiller selection.
To downplay the amount of say Mr. Wilson has in round 1 is a mistake imo. He seemed to have given Levy lots of room
, but not any more. Cash is king and Mr. Wilson wants to (and will imo) put fannies in the seats.I hear what you are saying, I think there is actually some truth in that, but not just to sell tickets. I think Wilson understands the fan base is highly dissatisfied with teams ability to stabilize the QB position and the team since Kelly left. I also dont think Spiller was chosen to sell tickets, Gailey was enamored with him and that type of player from early on and didnt really make a big secret about it.
I do agree that they may see one of the top QB's as a double bonus...a prospect who could both become a true franchise guy while at the same time and appealing to the fan base. But teams take QB's top 5 every single year, so to just say its only for ticket sales when our current QB was ranked near the bottom in almost every important QB statistic is a bit of reach.
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News flash. Trent Edwards isn't our QB anymore.
The one man QB crusade continues on. I was DEFINITELY NOT in that camp. I knew Edwards was a bum from day to. I never liked the guy because he didn't have an arm and threw the worst looking deep ball I have ever seen.
What are you even talking about dude? You are the one who brought up how I said we needed a QB last year, which we clearly did.
Anyway...I love how your response to a post that says we struggled to move the ball on offense all year is "News flash. Trent Edwards isn't our QB anymore" LMAO...what, you think just because Fitz moves the ball better than Trent that it somehow magically means we are effective and consistent at moving the ball? That logic is so ridiculous I dont even know why you waste time even posting this gibberish.
YES, Fitz is better than Trent...NO ONE ON THIS ENTIRE BOARD DISPUTES THAT ANY WHERE. That however does NOT mean Fitz is good enough just because he is better than one of the 10 worst QB's in the entire NFL.
There is no amount of illogical statements you can proivide that will change the fact that our offense struggled to move the ball this year a majority of the time. But I am sure you will try...
Fitz at times, was the only bright spot this team had last season. His toughness and leadership is an admirable quality. But let's be real here. He's not a guy that we can build this team around. Fitz is a stop gap starting QB and a great backup QB. We still need a guy that we can say is our franchise guy and someone that we can build this team around to become relevant again.
EXACTLY!
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Why were the Bills usually behind?
Because they couldn't stop the other team and get the ball back? Because they couldn't slow down, much less stop, the run?
Hold on...I see this all the time. This is such a convenient excuse and it gets to stop. There were many games where the D played good enough to win but the OFFENSE could not move the ball the bulk of the game. There were several games where Fitz had 50 yards or so at half time.
The run D is NOT why we were always behind...sure our run D is poor, just like many areas of this team. But we struggled to move the ball in the majority of our games, and that wasnt the fault of our run D. Dont get me wrong, our D does effect the offense in terms of field position, but field position is one thing...not converting first downs, turning the ball over, not running the ball, dropping passes, fumbling, incompletions, and missing wide open recievers is the fault of the offense.
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Unless that one category puts points on the board....you know...the things that win games
Win games? How many did he win? Maybe his win loss record was so poor because a THIRD of his TD's came in just TWO games, and multiple meaningless TD's at the end of bad losses where the game was all but over.
So, let me know when he is CONSISTENTLY putting points on the board, not just in garbage time or 2 abnormal games like the Cincy game where he blew until Cincy lost half its starting secondary for the game.
Week to Week his TD total is no where near an accurate barometer on how he did as in the vast majority of his games he put up just 1 TD or less...but of course, that is literally the only response anyone ever gives while ignoring his terrible win loss record, being 9th in the league in INTS (and he had a lot of "gift" ints dropped too) in only 13 games, and being in the bottom end of the NFL in just about every other important stat for a QB.
Didn't we go through your one man tireless sleepless get a QB in the first campaign with you last year?
Uhhhh, wasnt I right? We needed a QB and so many on here were arguing how Trent is the guy and we dont need a QB...um, how did that work out?
PS: Funny thing is, I see so many of the posters who were arguing until they were blue in the face that we didnt need a QB becuase we had Trent now literally criticizing the coaching staff for giving the starting job to Trent even though they kept arguing how he earned it in preseason...classic TSW.
Many of those same people are now getting their panties in a wad if you think we still need a better QB than Fitz.
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The more I think about it I think that it is smokescreen to want to make another team jump ahead of them to get Newton or Gabbert. Cinci seems to want him, Arizona might want Gabbert.
Still, I do not put it past them to mean it. That Nix and Gailey want Newton. When it comes to Ralph - well, I think at this point he'll just listen.
This isnt just about the #3 pick...its possible they are trying to generate buzz for a trade down scenario and intend on grabbing a QB later in the first or in the 2nd like Locker, Ponder, Kaepernick, or Mallet. And no one around the league believes Buffalo is set at QB with Fitz, so the Bills wont even have to sell it hard they have interest and yet they have been talking about it since mid season.
So, I would not put it past them to try and create a advantageous trade down scenario, but I do believe their interest in a QB in the early rounds is genuine
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No, IMO they don't believe in Fitzpatrick as a franchise QB. And they have no reason to believe so. He had one decent season, has been a career backup and Gailey has a history of taking QB's of mediocre talent and turning them into productive starters.
I'm guessing Chan would like a chance to work with a real franchise QB for a change. The best he has had was a young Kordell and a spent Aikman. One who couldn't pass the ball and one who couldn't get out of his own way. I'm sure he looks at Newton and Gabbert and sees a combination of passing talent and athleticism he's never had the privilege to coach.
As for why a team with a 28 year old starting QB would use a high pick on a QB? Because the teams with franchise QB's own the league. That's all too obvious.
Said it before, the draft is a process, not an event. Too many fans are trying to fill holes "on paper" and ignoring the fact that it doesn't matter if you are good at a lot of other positions, if you don't have a franchise QB you are just kidding yourself if you think you are going to win consistently in the NFL.
I think you took my post as if I am wondering these things in my questions...you and I actually agree on everything. I was posing those questions to those who keep telling people not enamored with Fitz about how is a franchise guy and how the FO/coaches love him as there defense of him. This thread was more of a reality check to those that seem to think the FO is more enamored with Fitz than they really are.
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C'mon now, it's not cute or clever in any way. Fitzpatrick is a REAL starting QB for the next 5 or 6 years in the NFL. Don't believe me? Watch and see his career unfold. A smart, tough and talented 28 year old QB like Fitzpatrick who's finally mastered the NFL learning curve will not all of a sudden regress in his game.
Is Fitzpatrick the answer for our team sitting at #3 with the possibility to take a gamble on an elite talent like Newton? Even me, being a Fitzpatrick fan, can't even say that for sure. What I do think is that there's still the real possibility out there that he can become somewhere in between a Drew Brees and an Eli Manning and we'll no doubt get our answer in 2011 whether or not they do take Newton. Because he'll be our starting QB next year no matter what.
Well maybe you should talk to the coaches, becuase they and the FO dont seem to agree with your proclamations about Fitz. They have said on numerous occassions they need to find a 10 year franchise guy because Fitz is getting up there in age...but you just said it yourself, he is ONLY 28...I even started a thread on this very thing. Clearly he is young enough to build a team around IF they believed him to be they guy to build around.
But they clearly don't see him as you put it "a REAL starting QB for the next 5 to 6 years in the NFL" as teams dont go around trying replace "REAL starting QB's" who are JUST 28 years old if they are good enough to rebuild a franchise around, especially on a team so devoid of talent. But, I guess thats to be expected from some who arrogantly proclaimed with the absolute statement "there are no Bradys" in this draft...aka, no franchise QB's in this draft...before they have ever set foot on the field. The funniest part about that ridiculously stupid proclamation (as another poster already pointed out) is the stupid choice of saying "no Bradys" when Brady was a late round draft pick and was no where near seen as a future franchise QB or HOF...in other words, like the other poster said, Brady wasnt even a "Brady" in his draft.
I have lost count on how many times you have inserted your foot in your mouth now...time to move on.
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I keep seeing posters on this board use the comments and so called "endorsements" made about Fitz by our coaches and FO to defend Fitz as if to say the doubters are wrong because the people who matter (FO and coaches) believe in him. I find this puzzling, because a little common sense would tell you just the opposite is true in what they have publicly said many times.
1. FO/Coaches - They have said they love him as their QB, then follow it up with he is getting up there in age and they need to find a "10 year" guy who can be the man here for a decade.
2. Fitz is only 28 - When have you ever seen a franchise looking to replace a QB they believe in because he was too old at 28 years of age? He is young enough to be the man for 8 to 10 years in todays NFL if they really thought he was the guy they wanted to build this team around.
3. Why would a franchise so devoid of talent at so many key positions seriously consider using a high pick on a QB if the 28 year old QB on there roster was a guy they felt they could rebuild a team around?
In comparison, Aaron Rodgers is 27, does anyone actually think GB will be looking for a better long term solution after the 2011-2012 season is done because he is 28 years old? Do you think they would even consider for a second taking a QB in the first round if they had the #3 pick in the draft that year?
IMO, this might be the worst argument in any defense of Fitz...I am sure they see him as a great guy to run things until the prospect is ready to take his job, but clearly they are not ready to rebuild this team around him based on their comments and are not nearly as enamored with his season as some people around here.
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"first I, as well as anyone who doubted Trent, was flamed for pointing out everything wrong with Trent when everyone insisted on how great he was doing just because he wasnt JP. Now, everyone is making the same excuses for Fitz and over exaggerating his season just because he isnt Trent."
Hey, you made the comparison of Fitzpatrick supporters being just like the Trent supporters. Sorry, but that was a embarrassingly stupid comment on your part.
Fitzpatrick threw 23 TDs in 13 games last year. (5.9 TD%)
Edward's best year was when he threw 11 TDs in 14 games. (2.9 TD%)
Like I said, your views of Fitzpatrick are and continue to be warped.
Seriously, how do you write this stuff with a straight face? I did not "compare" Trent and Fitz...I compared the people on this boards reactions in the same situation. You just want this to mean something else because you literally have nothing factual to say what so ever to actually address any points being presented to you.
In terms a 5 year old can understand so you finally get it: Fitz > Trent...but that doesnt automatically equate to Fitz being the answer since just about every QB in the NFL is better than Trent.
Multiple times you have foolishly tried to twist something to look like I said something outlandish so you can focus on that, therfore avoiding all the factual stuff you cant find a way to dispute because you have ZERO to add to this other than "23 TD's" while ignoring every other thing presented to you.
I mean you dont have to agree, but the lame games of trying to twist statements so you can attack them in order to avoid all logical points you apparently have no defense for is stupid. So we will just agree to disagree on the quality of Fitz's season...
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You're have a very warped view of Fitzpatrick. He's a hundred times better than Trent. You seriously need to stop because you're making yourself look foolish now.
Are you high? I just said that he is better than Trent. But that doesnt make him good enough just because he is better than a QB (Trent) who is probably one of the 10 worst QB's in the NFL.
And you want to talk about foolish...LMAO...you have chosen to ignore all facts and are yet to add anything of value, successfully provide any logical or relevant counter points to anything other than to name call, and have made hilarious responses like this one that make no sense in regards to the post you are replying to.
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Only 2 of his 23 TDs were "waste" time TDs. And only a delusional person would fault him for torching the Cincy defense. Frankly, isn't that what any good QB would do? ...LOL
You have this very warped and unrealistic view that the Bills starting QB should be averaging 3 TDs per game. I hate to break it to you, but there are no Tom Bradys or Peyton Mannings in this draft.
Where did I say the Bills starting QB should be averaging 3 TD's? Never did I say that...what I said is that Fitz had games far above his norm inflating his TD totals which is what you and some others insist on hanging on. I said it is NOT the norm for him to throw 3+ TD's, yet more than a THIRD of his TD's came in just TWO games...there fore, FLUKEY...
So MORE THAN A THIRD of his total TD's occured in TWO games, one of which he was atrocious in until the opposing team lost HALF of their starting secondary for the game. Yet, all you want to do is focus on his total which because of the TWO abnormal games of TD production make his total look better than it is.
The fact remains, the MAJORITY of the season he was not even close to as productive as you want to claim based on his TD totals.
Sad thing is, I do like how Fitz plays with guts and heart, and I like the guy. But this board is so predictable...first I, as well as anyone who doubted Trent, was flamed for pointing out everything wrong with Trent when everyone insisted on how great he was doing just because he wasnt JP. Now, everyone is making the same excuses for Fitz and over exaggerating his season just because he isnt Trent.
If I punch you in the balls every day then stop and switch to punching you in the chest every day, you are going to love being punched in the chest because you were used to being punched in the balls...I can assure you getting punched in the chest is better than the balls, but it still sucks.
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Boy are you delusional. There were only a couple of games where Fitzpatrick started and him and Johnson compiled extra stats after the game's outcome was no longer in doubt.
Really? You need to go back and review the games...I am not going through every game again, did that in other threads already. However, there were several games where this occured, several others where neither was existent in the first 3 and a half quarters forcing us to try and play catchup at the very end, and ones both these guys literally lost for us when we were in position to win at the end...
For example: Balt - Fitz 2 INTs in the 3rd qtr gave away our lead for good, KC - Fitz regulation ending awful INT where we were about to be in FG range to win and his missed WIDE open would be TD pass to Spiller in endzone in OT, Chi - Fitzs game ending INT, and SJ with his drops in key moments of games and the infamous Pitt game, etc etc.
Stats were padded at the end in several games between these two, hell it happened in the first 3 games Fitz started alone with worthless garbage TD's at the end of each blow out loss (all to SJ). I said Cincy was a fluke game as Fitz was PWNED by the Cincy D except Cincy GAVE US BACK an INT thanks to an unrelated penalty which later resulted in a TD thanks to two additional penalties on that drive to save us from punting...then they lost their 2 starting safeties and our recievers were running uncovered on several broken plays like SJ's long second half TD.
Those are flukes...fluke means "not the norm" and it is without a shadow of a doubt that its not the norm for Fitzy to throw 3+ TD's based on his career...in fact in the majority of his games this year alone he threw 1 TD or less. He only threw for more than 1 TD twice in his last 9 games, and one was the fluke Cincy game where people were talking about how he should be benched at half time. HALF his TD's came in the first FOUR games...3 of which we were crushed in and he got waste time TD's. How anyone can not see this is beyond me.
I dont care about a TD that increases our score to 14 with 1 min left to go when the opponent has over 30 points (see Jets game)...I care about players who make plays when they count...and right now, these guys didnt do that enough, failed to do so when they could, or played so bad that it was too little too late when they found a groove.
Truth is, week to week, their performances were not good enough...and it wasnt just them, it was lots of our guys on this team, and I for one am tired of settling for this crap. There is not a single meaningful stat that Fitz was good in this year outside of TD's. It becomes clear that his TD total is not an accurate indicator of his season hen you consider that 15 of his 23 TD's came in just 5 games, 3 of which were blow out losses for the most part where his stats got padded in meaningless time, and another where he sucked until half the teams starting secondary was knocked out of the game. Not to mention that he was below average or worse in the majority of his games and in every important statisitc relevant to a QB.
But there I go using logic again and reason again, something lost on this board...
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Johnson = 87 receptions
Evans = 37 receptions
So you're saying that the problem is Fitzpatrick wasn't able to throw the ball accurately to Lee Evans when he clearly hit Johnson all season long?????...LMAO
First off, if anyone actually read the article, Gailey said that he has to be better at getting Evans to be a better underneath threat...he didnt exactly just throw Evans under the bus, I mean Gailey took responsibility in how he used Evans last year. I mean come on, its not like they call underneath routes for Evans in game and Evans just refuses to run them...dont get me wrong, Evans needs to get better in that area himself too, but Gailey took responsibility in this as well.
Second...You just throw up those stats as if its so black and white. First off, Evans was doubled the whole season, even after Johnson started getting targets. Teams were FAR less scared of SJ than Evans and let SJ run in single coverage a lot, even covered by LB's at times...when was the last time you say a LB cover Evans? Not to mention, SJ was often a big benefactor of meaningless stats at the end of games when the game was all but over. Often, he was literally invisible the whole game and then in the last drive or two of a bad loss he gets like 5 receptions and a TD making his stat line look decent for the game even though he was a complete non factor.
That brings up another point...I have never seen a fan base who value meaningless stats as much as this fan base does in any sport. When I say menaingless, I am referring stats accrued during meaningless points of a game, preseason, or fluke games that make the season look more productive as a whole rather than what it really was. Fitz and SJ are classic cases of this. I mean Half of Fitz TD's came in the first 4 games, 3 of which were bad losses and he got a junk TD at the end of each, and the fluke 4 TD game in Balt.
He only had 2 TD passes or more twice more the rest of the season, and one of those was the fluke Cincy game where he was atrocious until BOTH starting safeties got knocked out and Cincy handed us the game on a silver platter. He had far fewer good games than bad games, but all I keep hearing about is his mirage of a TD total while ignoring how bad he is ranked in every important QB statisical category, including throwing the 9th most INTs despite only playing 13 games (and about a dozen more thrown right into the chest of defenders who flat out dropped them...not tipped, just thrown right into their hands).
This reminds me of these fools who hype up players at the combine becuase of some great stats in some athletic drills while ignoring the actual game tapes where they are not nearly effective week in and week out (see players like Gholston). Fitz gets his TD totals high because of a few junk TD's and 2 fluke games and everyone ignores how poorly he did in the majority of the games and key QB statistical areas like accuracy, turnovers, YPA, first downs, 3rd down conversion, QB rating, etc...all of which together give you a better insight to a QB. Same thing is happening with SJ...another guy whos stats benefited by meaningless end of game pads in bad losses.
Am I the only one here who wants a QB and other players that are out there doing damage and making plays while the game matters and is winnable rather than racking up stats at the end of bad losses or guys throwing game ending INT's, dropping game winning TD's, dropping drive ending passes for first downs, etc etc. I love how Fitz plays, but he wasnt very good this year...I like SJ's potential, this was just his first breakout, but he was not nearly as effective when we needed him as the stats seem to indicate unless you are playing fantasy football.
You know what, thats it...Fantasy Football! I think I just solved my own riddle...Bills fans have had to turn to fantasy football for any hopes of football glory and its caused them to value stat totals more than in game performance. That has to be it...
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I think you misunderstood my post. I was not indicating that the rest were ALL average joes or bums. But there definitely are a lot.
Aikman: Average at best but very accurate. Micheal Irvin was allowed to push off for about 10 years, they had a stout defense and the best rusher in the league in Emmit Smith
Young: A freak who could scramble, played with Jerry Rice, TO and great coaching.
Farve: Great arm and QB but needed special teams to help win that game for him.
Elway: Legendary and AWESOME QB who didn't do a thing until he got the best rushing game in the league with Terrel Davis
Big Ben: Tough as nails scrambler but not setting the world on fire with his stats. Awesome runner in Jerome Bettis and arguably the best Defenses in the last 10 years.
Rodgers: Really stepped up and played his ass off. Might be early but a truly Elite QB. Let's not forget the #1 or #2 defense in the league.
Warner: For a time just amazing. We don't need no stinking defense.
Rypien: Didn't their defense do a number on us? Not at all a guy I consider the slightest bit elite.
So anyway. I almost agree that a dominant defense is not as good or better than a "Premiere" QB this day and age. I wasn't trying to make that point at all but I have seen Brady and Manning beaten by dominant defenses in the superbowl and conference finals. Food for thought friend.
The point I believe I expressly stated was that it is easier to stock up a dominant defense than it is to land an elite QBs. The only reason for this is that franchises commit so much time and resources to the darling QBs they draft that it usually sets the franchise back 3 years or more. As I pointed out, most of the guys up there were good QBs some great or elite but most all had something else going for them like the best rusher in the league, a dominant defense, exceptional WR(s) etc.
Do you suggest that we keep drafting a 1st round QB every 3 or 4 years until we finally hit and get a premiere QB? (See, that was a question. I didn't put words in your mouth). If so we might be dead before we get lucky OR maybe Newton or Gabbert is that guy. It is difficult to predict and outcome both positive and negative is by far greater than any other position. Defensive players drafted that high can be yanked on an off the field and nobody bat's an eye compared to a QB drafted that high. For some reason with QB it's damn the "torpedoes full speed ahead". This is our savior. This is our franchise. Then 5 years later and Trent Edwards released we have to take yet another high risk gamble? (Yes I know Trent was a 3rd round pick just throwing in another Edwards shot.)
As I said I wouldn't be pissed if we took a QB at #3 which you seemed to ignore but I think going the defensive route first is easier and incurs much less risk. Fitz was pretty good last year and he was 8th in TDs per game. He didn't have the benefit of being the starter going into last year and having the offense tailored to him but he still did a damn good job. I know we have a great pick this year but if Luck came out would anybody be excited at getting Newton or Gabbert at #3?????
Next year is the year to get the QB I think. Finish off building a defense that could be good for the next 5 years first.
There are so many things wrong in this post that I am not even going to address them...it would take too much time and fall on deaf ears anyway.
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Lets be honest. With that D it would have been hard to make .500 with Brady or Manning. Fitz obviously is not the future, but if there is not a Franchise QB available why panic? The only problem with making the D better fast is that we'll pick up a couple more wins next year and have little chance of finding that Franchise guy we truly need. This is kind of a catch 22. Biggest problem is that if we miss huge with the 3 overall pick on a Q.B we could literally regress 3 years.
So glad someone decided to start this thread because the other 90 threads on it havent covered it enough
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Also, I told you last year that you guys give Kelly way to much credit relative to the information he has access to.
Hmmm...this is exactly what I would expect you to say if you were Jim Kelly and trying to conceal it and throw everyone off the scent...hehehehe
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Did not see it posted anywhere...
Was to be expected with the season he had with Fitz, but still nice to see our top receiver fully backing up the QB.
http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/26685/steve-johnson-im-with-fitz-100-percent
The WR's backed Losman too...doesnt make Losman good...lol
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I agree with most of what you've written, and I think we have the same overall philosophical approach. But there are a couple points of difference:
How well a quarterback handles the mental aspects of the game is, to me, of vital importance. Before I'd even consider a QB at third overall, I'd need to see strong evidence that he's going to be very good at handling the mental aspects of the game. I just haven't seen that evidence with Newton.
Even if the Bills were to take a QB like Gabbert, or some other non-defensive front 7 player in the first round, they could easily justify taking a RT in the second. RT is as big a need on this team as any. Then I assume they'd go with an ILB in the third. That would give them a starting LB corps of Moats and Merriman on the outside, and Poz and the third rounder on the inside. I realize the defensive front-7 needs more than just that. But it's not like the Bills are going to eliminate all their holes in a single draft.
If Merriman proves a disappointment in 2011, then the Bills would go into the 2012 draft looking for an OLB, as well as at least one upgrade for their defensive line.
I actually pretty much agree with most of what you just said. The things you havent seen in Newton are the same things I worry about to, which is why I wouldnt love the pick, but I still wouldnt hate it just because of his upside. I totally agree that RT is as big of a need as any, but like you said, you cant fill all the holes in one draft. So, if they go QB at 3, then they probably BPA at another hole like DE or RT. If they go defensive front 7 at 3, then I think they grab a QB in the 2nd if there is still one available they like that high...if not then the lines on either side of the ball are probably where they go.
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Agreed about the QBs in this year's draft. Unless they see a genuine upgrade over Fitzpatrick (and IMHO there are only maybe 3-4 such guys) in this year's draft, it would be foolish to waste an early pick on the position. The only caveat that I would add is that the Bills do need to address the QB situation somewhat. Since they have wisely appeared to put an end to the Brohm experiment, that leaves just Fitz and the developmental Levi Brown. What happens if Fitz goes down? That's why, in the last couple of rounds, I wouldn't mind them picking up a Frank Reich type (someone like McElroy), who is probably never going to be a starter but is polished and savvy enough to be a quality backup from day one.
I would argue that the FO sees a need for a QB more than you and some posters think and view several guys as prospects with the potential to be an upgrade. They have publicly showed support for Fitz while still noting they need to find a franchise guy. They use the excuse that they love Fitz, but he is getting up there in age and want to find a guy who can be the man for the next 10 years. If anyone buys that I have some magic beans for sale you should look at.
1. Fitz is only 28...he is young enough to be the man for at least the next 8 to 10 years in todays NFL if they really thought he could play at that level.
2. In comparison, Rodgers is 27...does anyone believe for a second that the GB FO after next season is going to start saying they need to draft his heir apparent because Rodgers will be getting up there in age? I mean to say a 28 year old QB is not young enough to be a long term solution is ridiculous.
So, while they publicly praise Fitz, its pretty clear its to keep from rattling his cage too much because no HC of GM is going to be considering using a high draft pick on a team with so many holes on a QB if they believe in their 28 year old QB.
I am sure some Fitz die hard is going to flame this too, but a little common sense indicates the FO doesn't believe Fitz to be someone who can be the man for this franchise, otherwise QB would not be in play anywhere in the first 4 rounds of this draft.
Anything is possible, but I fully expect a QB to be chosen in the first 2 rounds. Cam, Gabbert, Mallet, Ponder, Locker, and Kaepernick are all prospects with high cielings and if they can reach their potential would be upgrades over Fitz (but like any prospect, there is no guarantee they will). Each come with their own amount risk, but I believe one of these guys will be on this roster come 2011 TC.
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I love this time of the year. My laptop took a dump so I'm doing this from my IPhone but I wanted some input from others on these draft selections for the Bills. Thanks.
1st rd #3-North Carolina DE/OLB Robert Quinn
2nd rd #34- Nevada QB Colin Kaepernick
3rd rd #68- Clemson S DeAndre McDaniel
4th rd #99- N.C. State ILB Nate Irving
4th rd #121- Stanford DT Sione Fua
5th rd #130- Citadel CB Cortez Allen
Thoughts?
Rounds 3 and beyond are pretty hard to predict as there are so many surprise slips and players taken surprisingly high once you get the first 2 rounds done. But as far as your first 2 picks go, I would be quite pleased with Quinn and Kaepernick 1 and 2.
Quinn, Bowers, Fairley, Dareus all will make me happy from a defensive stand point, and there are things I like and dislike about each, so neither one of them is really an over whelming favorite in my book. That being said Quinn is probably my least fav or the 4 because he comes with more risk, but not by an overwhelming amount. I would also be ok with Gabbert or Newton at 3, but since Ponder, Mallet, Locker, and Kaepernick could be available in the 2nd and I see as much potential and risk in them as I do Gabbert and Newton, I would prefer D first, QB second. If we go QB at 3, then would like to see D front 7 in the 2nd of course.
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Not "everyone" feels that Fitzpatrick had a bad season. In fact, very few here would agree with your assessment.
This just in, the NFL has just added "Meaningful TDs" to the official list of passing stats...LOL
I love watching the verbal gymnastics you two are doing to try and prove a point that's not even in the realm of being credible.
Come on...you are just being hilarious now. Not in the realm of credible? How can you even say that with a straight face? You dont have to agree by any means, but to say that having the opinnion that a QB who was in the bottom half to near the bottom of the league in every majore passing statistic but one didn't have quite the stellar season you want to make it out to be isnt within the realm of credible is just stupid.
So, you cling on to your one stat, an inflated total which does not reflect his typical outings none the less, as well as your proclamations. I choose to look at his overall performance week in and week out and am not satisfied as are many other Bills fans.
So again, since you continue to add no substance by any means to this conversation other than to declare you are right through various insults and rants that contain no substance on the topic what so ever, we will just have to agree to disagree.
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I was talking about this with my brother the other day. Fitz has never had a chance to be the guy until this year. He has never had a full offseason as the unquestioned starter and gotten every rep in mini camp, TC, and preseason. Last season he played well and the season before he played better than Trent (which isnt saying much but still) he played decently on a bad team in cinci too.
The point is this is his chance to prove he can be a viable starter for a number of years here. He enters this year as "the guy". Now he could walk out this year and flop, but based on what ive seen from Fitz and hearing whats said about him by his coaches and teammates, I doubt he will flop and think he will be a solid starter and suddenly QB isnt a need.
But I'm only Captain Hindsight so I wont know til after we win the super bowl
Well bad news on this then...Fitz is most likely not entering the season as "the guy". Chan and Nix have already said they want to find a franchise guy. They fluff it all up to not rattle Fitz too much by saying they are happy with him, but want to find a guy for the next 10 years because Fitz is getting up there in age. First off, Fitz is ONLY 28, he is by no means on the downside of his carer and if they really believed in him he could easily be the man for the next 8 to 10 years, especially in todays NFL.
Anyone who sees the Nix and Gaileys statements as some kind huge endorsement of their belief in him are just viewing them with rose colored glasses because it makes no sense. Its pretty clear the FO is looking for a franchise guy because they know they need one, not because of this stroy they spun that Fitz is getting up there in age.
I can pretty much gurantee that when a coach and FO believe in and are behind their 28 year old QB, they are not going out publicly and saying they need to use a high pick on a franchise guy when we have so many other needs. They are not looking for his heir apparent...I mean Aaron Rodgers is 27...does anyone really think that after next season is over and he is 28 the GB FO is going to be talking about drafting a QB to replace him because he is getting up there in age?
Truth is, they are comfortable with Fitz at the helm UNTIL they have groomed his inevitable replacement to take over. Sure its possible Fitz could take a huge leap forward next year, but if the FO thought that to be likley there would be no talk of a QB or need for a QB. If we draft a QB in round 1 or 2, Fitz isnt stupid, he knows that guy is there to be groomed to take his job in the next year or two and that he isnt "the guy" just a stop gap and mentor.
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You sir are first a gentleman and i am glad to read your well spoken retort.
I think i was jumping in the middle again. But i am quick to defend him
because he was the source of hope this past season.
To be honestly considered i do not think most of us know what he is capable of yet. I feel we need to give him a chance with a even somewhat stable offensive line. This would be a good year to see if he can throw. He may not be any better when he has all day and we have a solid running game. He may not.
But i think we will be a little better at protection and run this year. Well i hope so. i might differ in opinion a Bit on his passes but no too much. He will have to play better and cannot get by on just courage.
Same to you sir. I understand the defense of him, hell, I like the guy and how he plays and root for him too. I just don't see enough in him on a talent level to be consistent enough to feel he is the right answer long term. He very well could make big strides this year, and nothing would make me happier as I like him and we need a QB. I just don't think this will be the case, not for a lack of effort, just don't think his cieling is much higher then what we have seen. So hopefully he proves the doubters wrong, myself included, but until he does I am of the belief that the QB position needs to be addressed. Addressing it early in this draft is ideal if we can get the right prospect as he could sit a year or two behind Fitz.
Coahces and FO stance on Fitz
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted · Edited by Alphadawg7
Hahahaha...you are priceless. Nice try
We will just have to agree to disagree, because you either really dont know what people hold in high regard when evaluating a QB or you will just say anything to get people to support your man crush. Either way, we already had our discussion in another thread, no need to relive it here.