Punch

For all intents and purposes, those trades were essentially draft picks. They had never played in the NFL and Eli was a Charger for what, all of 45 minutes? You're right though, drafting a franchise QB 1st is definitely not the only way to build a team, but if the right guy is there for the taking, then by all means a team should take him. If not, move on to the trenches. It's extremely difficult to find that kind of QB, not quite as difficult to find those type of linemen. This team has so many needs they almost couldn't go wrong either way, but they absolutely need the "right guy" under center.

I knew the poster was joking about Mallett and Locker being run stoppers because run stoppers is an obvious need for the Bills--- so I in turn replied with a joke. No need to roll your eyes, sir.

Tackling is just another category where Andrew Luck beats out Mallett and Locker! (I'm sure you've seen his hit from the USC game)

Bruce Smith had 71 career tackles behind the line of scrimmage and 46 career sacks, including 22 as a junior, en route to winning the Outland Trophy as the nation's best D-lineman as well as a consensus All-American as a senior. Bruce was considered a "sure thing" and near consensus top 3 pick as he had done it over the course of his entire college career--- and at this point anyway, Bowers is unproven. He very well may be a great pro, but for now the two are simply incomparable. How can you realistically compare the two?

He had 13.5 in 1986 (down from the "record" 22 in '85), the first year the Jets employed the 3-4, but his numbers dropped off the face of the earth after that (he did have a string of injury problems, though). It's pretty difficult to figure out exactly what effect the 3-4 had on these guys because without the benefit of gamefilm it's virtually unknowable what defensive set they were in when they accrued sacks. We know, without a doubt, however, that Bruce Smith spent the vast majority of his career in a base 3-4 D. Certainly, some of his sacks came in 4 man fronts in Nickel, Dime, and Quarter packages--- but to spend 15 seasons primarily as a base 3-4 DE it's absolutely amazing that he was able to consistently beat double and triple teams and penetrate into the backfield, not only to sack the QB but also chase down RBs behind the line of scrimmage. I think a strong argument can be made that Bruce is the most dominant defensive player in the history of pro football. Thurman#1---- if you're as interested in sacks and statistics as I am then maybe you've read about the work of John Turney, a fan who has spent countless hours studying play by play sheets and gamefilm in an attempt to (as accurately as possible) determine the correct pre-1982 NFL sack figures. His work is widely quoted by sports writers, although he himself admits that the numbers he came up with cannot truly be considered official due to the inconsistent nature of record keeping over the years--- though it's a good gauge for what might have been. His revamped "All-Time Sack" list still has Bruce at #1, though guys like Deacon Jones (who famously asked: "Since when does 'all-time' begin in 1982?") played most or all of their career in 14 game schedules. TURNEY SACK LIST Rk. Player Sacks 1. Bruce Smith 200 2. Reggie White 198 3. Deacon Jones 173½ 4. Kevin Greene 160 5. Jack Youngblood 151½ 6. Chris Doleman 150½ 7. Alan Page 148½ 8. Lawrence Taylor 142 9. Michael Strahan 141½ 10. Richard Dent 137½ 10. John Randle 137½ 12. Rickey Jackson 136 13. Carl Eller 133 14. Leslie O'Neal 132½ 15. Coy Bacon 130 http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/columnists/rgosselin/stories/083009dnspogoosecenter.2ff71d7.html It's interesting that names like Coy Bacon and "Bubba" Baker are all but forgotten because sacks were not kept as official statistics during the 1970s. The great 1964 Buffalo Bills' defense, for instance (incidentally the 1st pro team to employ a 3-4) are unofficially credited with 50 QB sacks (in only 14 games). http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=weinreb/081006 Turney's season by season breakdown of sack leaders from 1961-81: 1961 Gene Lipscomb 17.5 or 18 (not 100% sure, still checking it out, it's either one or the other) 1962 Jim Katcacage 16 1963 Jim katcavage 20 1964 Deacon Jones 22 1965 Deacon Jones 18 1966 George Andrie 18.5 1967 Deacon Jones 21 1968 Deacon Jones 22 1969 Steve Delong 15.5 1970 Tony Cline 17.5 1971 Cedric Hardman 18 1972 Jack Gregory 18.5 1973 Bill Stanfill 18.5 1974 Jack Youngblood 15, Dryer 15 1975 John Dutton 17 1976 Coy Bacon 21.5 (small issue of scoring may be 22) 1977 Harvery Martin 20 1978 Bubba Baker 23 1979 Jack Youngbood 18 1980 Gary Johnson 17.5 (Baker had 17, there was a game where a could half-sacks went as full sacks) 1981 Joe Klecko 20.5

That makes more sense. I had misremembered that it was his temperament that drove him out of the league rather than his back problems. I'm sure Martz spun it into something more egregious in order to make the Rams appear more favorable, as well. I miss the "old days" when players had the freedom to be characters rather than doing RoboInterviews where everyone spouts the same cliches. As a kid, I absolutely loved the "Fric and Frac Show" with Smerlas and Haslett and I was heartbroken when Haslett broke his leg against Chicago in the preseason in 1986 during Kelly's first appearance in a Bills uniform. He knew the team was going to turn around with Jimbo and was devastated that he couldn't be a part of it. Oddly enough, Turley was shipped out of New Orleans while Haslett was the HC there. Things have changed.

A moment here or there doesn't seem to help the aggravation in missing out on Haloti Ngata. There was a point late in the game yesterday when Ngata tossed aside the center and just swallowed up Brady--- Brady was so frustrated that he slammed the ball down and hit his hands on the ground like a little kid throwing a tantrum. In my wildest dreams I wish the Bills had a disruptive force in the middle of our D-line (or anywhere) that could cause Brady to nearly lose it.

And you feel this way because he gave you an interview? For what it's worth, I was thinking about the professional mock drafts not the fannish sites. This is the first year Bowers has shown any consistency which means he flies directly in the face of what Nix has preached in regards to how he approaches a potential draft pick. I know things change over the course of the year, and he very well may go somewhere in the 1st round--- but not the 1st overall pick whilst ignoring Andrew Luck. That's legitimately crazy.

We definitely need some bad ass mother!@#$ers, no doubt--- but didn't Turley threaten to kill Mike Martz? Not that I have any love for Martz, but Turley was a little bit more of a loose cannon than necessary. Conrad Dobler, Jim Haslett, Smerlas, et al---- we definitely need some nasty dudes but not basket cases. Your entire post is terrific and spot on--- it appears to be the problem not only with the Bills but also with the Sabres.

Interesting note on the 1st overall pick, from: http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d80fa1d95/article/who-wants-the-no-1-pick-in-the-nfl-draft-nobody "Is it possible for the Detroit Lions, or any team with the top overall choice of the NFL draft, to simply pass on making the pick? Yes. The Lions could pass, and the team choosing second -- currently the St. Louis Rams -- would subsequently be on the clock. The Lions then would fall back into the No. 2 spot. As onerous as having the No. 1 choice might be, don't expect the Lions, or any team that has it, to simply refuse to execute it. The NFL would not approve. "There's an unwritten rule discouraging teams from passing (for the sake of avoiding paying exorbitant money to a rookie)," said a general manager, who requested anonymity. "No matter how much you don't want that pick, it just wouldn't be good for the integrity of the draft." -- Vic Carucci"

Amazing that no other mock draft puts Da'Quan Bowers in the 1st round... yet the Bills will take him at #1. It certainly sounds like Marv, I guess, although Bowers may not fit the Tampa 2. If the Bills have the 1st pick and pass on both Luck and Mallett (heck, even Locker) for Da'Quan Bowers--- come on man, why even play like that.

After watching some highlight videos on the UFL site... I can't believe how awful the uniforms are... I kind of thought they'd improve them once they started generating revenue, but good god, man. The football on the field would be much more entertaining if they didn't look like a junior high school kid designed them for his custom Madden league.

The Toddler was talking about Franchise mode in Madden--- although even then it took 4 years to increase his ratings high enough.

It's possible that Kevin Kolb could turn out to be Matt Schaub but why fight over him with 5-7 other teams and thus likely need to send a 1st round pick PLUS to Philly in order to successfully land him? We can use a 1st round pick much more wisely than taking the chance that he's another Rob Johnson rather than Schaub. Not to mention, if he's really worth a first rounder then why would Philly deal him? They need a franchise QB of the future just as much as the Bills. I don't think they're staking their future on Michael Vick--- Vick was only drafted 2 years after McNabb, FWIW.

From 2002-05, Buffalo was an attractive place for relatively big name FAs. I think there was probably a feeling that the Bills were a steadily improving team with competent management in place and a willingness to do what it takes to win. It might take another year or two (assuming that Nix, Whaley, and Moody are doing a competent job) of reBILLding, but I suspect it won't always be this bad. I get the sense, though, that players aren't just laughing at the team on the field as Donte attests--- Karlos Dansby probably thought it was pretty funny that the Bills tried to talk him into coming here, too.

Unfortunately, it seems like this is what it will take to bring in any high caliber free agents this coming off-season.

I felt that way watching Ngata giving Tom Brady and his O-line fits all day in the Pats-Ravens game.

Honestly, even when I'm not exactly pleased as punch with the team on the field, I always prefer Sundays with Buffalo Bills football. Stress doesn't really factor into it one way or the other. (Although, back in 2003, I took it to heart when Ruben Brown literally jumped over a table in an effort to go after Kevin Gilbride. That was the single most frustrating year for me as Bills fan, much more so than 2010.)

FWIW, when the Bills had an above average to "dominant" LT in Jason Peters and a stable of average at best QBs the results were pretty mediocre. A legitimate franchise QB certainly would have elevated those teams (roughly 2005-08*) despite other obvious flaws. *yes, I realize Peters was moved from RT to LT at some point early on and he struggled mightily in parts of 2007 and most of 2008, but he more or less fits the bill for the type of production that could reasonably be expected from a top draft pick at OT in his first few years. Then there's this part... if the right QB isn't there then I absolutely wouldn't want the Bills to take one of the wrong ones just for the sake of drafting a QB. We've already had more than our share of the wrong ones at QB and would rather see us fortify other positions of need until the right passer comes along.

I'm still waiting for him to provide documented evidence as to which specific picks Tom Modrak is responsible for grading highly. He asserted Modrak graded Poz higher than Willis, McCargo higher than Ngata, and Maybin the highest of any pass rusher in the 2009 draft. The fact that the Bills made these selections is not proof that the Director of College Scouting graded them all highly nor does it exhibit how much influence or sway he has in the group of talent evaluators making the actual draft day decisions. It's entirely possible, but I cannot find any evidence that Marv made these comments about Poz and McCargo (I know they felt McCargo fit Jauron's Tampa-2 scheme better than Ngata, which is unfortunate) nor any hard (hell, even soft) proof of what specifically Modrak is responsible.

Not for nothing, but I can't seem to find any reference made to Marv grading Poz higher than Willis or McCargo higher than Ngata. If it's "on record" can you show it? Also, why specifically are the Bills' overall player grades being accredited to Modrak? I understand he's the Director of college scouting but he's only one component of a team of evaluators, and I don't see how anyone can pinpoint exactly what Modrak's influence has been in regards to specific players or why his would be the overruling influence in which players are picked. I'm not exactly doubting it to be true (I absolutely detest, then and now, the front office moves and draft picks made during the 2005-09 Levy/Brandon regime), but the only references I see through google searches are to message boards (including this one), oddly enough.

That's despicable and utterly inexcusable. I want to vomit.

This is one of my favorite points in regards to how great Bruce truly was--- Leonard Marshall had some terrific sack totals for the Giants after they converted to a primarily 3-4 front (including 15.5 in 1985 and 12 in 1986), but he was surrounded by Hall of Fame linebackers. When Lawrence Taylor is lining up to your immediate right you're bound to benefit from the lack of available blockers get to the QB. But that was an all-time great defense in the era where the every down 3-4 was just coming into it's own and certainly a rarity nonetheless. Bruce did it for 15 years, regardless of the changing personnel accompanying him. (Although, after thinking it over for a few minutes more, Neil Smith of the Kansas City Chiefs comes to mind, who had a dominant stretch in the early to mid '90s, although he also benefited from lining up next to a Hall of Fame ROLB in Derrick Thomas and the Chiefs sort of ran a hybrid 3-4/4-3 at times.)

What makes you think Modrak had Poz rated higher than Willis? Willis was picked 11th by San Fran when we had the 12th pick, and by all accounts, the Bills were hoping to take Willis.

Whoa whoa whoa--- where did you hear that about the Bills liking Ponder? That's disheartening