Bill from NYC Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 If I owned the Bengals, I would at this point seriously consider firing the coach. At some point, these arrests become less of a coincidence. Marvin Lewis is a great football man. This is proven fact, but one would have to at least wonder if he has lost control of his team. Have any of these guys been fired or suspended? I read his comments once and he stated things to the effect of "the players will have their day in court," etc. This is all well and good I suppose, but I wonder if he sets a tone of permissiveness, whether knowingly or not. stuckincincy, how do the fans feel about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I don't see how firing a coach will get grown adults to behave themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 If I owned the Bengals, I would at this point seriously consider firing the coach. At some point, these arrests become less of a coincidence. Marvin Lewis is a great football man. This is proven fact, but one would have to at least wonder if he has lost control of his team. Have any of these guys been fired or suspended? I read his comments once and he stated things to the effect of "the players will have their day in court," etc. This is all well and good I suppose, but I wonder if he sets a tone of permissiveness, whether knowingly or not. stuckincincy, how do the fans feel about this? 737896[/snapback] Fans are not pleased... Regarding Lewis, I believe that it's league rule, or part of the CBA, that team management has to keep its trap shut regarding legal matters. The B'gals policy of not tolerating things detrimental to the team or its image (instituted after former wr Carl Picken's antics) was tossed out with the new CBA. In some other thread, I posted what Lewis said about LB Odell Thurman. He was not complimentary, saying something like "I've no idea where he is...if you want to follow him around, be my guest". BTW, Thurman has been kicked out of camp - mutual agreement, appearently. I could see him being traded away. Popular theories are that Marvin has a messianic complex and thinks that he can help these folks. Another is that owner Brown is creeping back into the picture after a 4 year hiatus. Lewis sticks his neck out, and they have been stepping on it. In any event, things may get ugly - questions about Palmer, and the B'gals are tied with the Giants for the toughest strength of schedule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted August 8, 2006 Author Share Posted August 8, 2006 Lewis sticks his neck out, and they have been stepping on it. 737902[/snapback] Who s.i.c., the players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Who s.i.c., the players? 737904[/snapback] That's the thought, but certainly not the large majority. The B'gals are not a team suffering internal strife. The B'gals that have been in trouble (I don't include Steinbach - a 26 year-old drinking on a boat on the Ohio river is not a capital crime ) are new or recent draftees - Thurman, Rucker, Nicholson, Henry. And this Brooks they selected in the supplemental draft, with a spotty college record. The B'gals had a good number of "morally challenged" players in years past. The thing is, is that Brown sees football in terms of dollars and cents. If he thinks he can get an iffy player on the cheap, he does so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 The Bengals organization has been drafting thugs for years, long before Marvin Lewis got there. The most successful player who overcame his rap sheet was Corey Dillon, considered by many as the best RB the year the Bills drafted Antowain Smith. The Bills would have never drafted Dillon. When you draft thugs who are 1st round talents that slip to later rounds you are gambling they won't get arrested or worse. The Bengals are always looking for value without regard to background. Since its been going on so long, it is the ownership that not only condones it, but apparently encourages it. It basically comes down to the fact Brown is a cheapskate who thinks these guys who are rated higher on talent than where they are drafted are bargains. It's gotten worse since Lewis' arrival because he wants talent and has bought into the Bengals gamble on greatness philosophy. It also goes back to the days when the Bengals had the fewest scouts in the NFL and didn't bother with background checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted August 8, 2006 Author Share Posted August 8, 2006 That's the thought, but certainly not the large majority. The B'gals are not a team suffering internal strife. The B'gals that have been in trouble (I don't include Steinbach - a 26 year-old drinking on a boat on the Ohio river is not a capital crime ) are new or recent draftees - Thurman, Rucker, Nicholson, Henry. And this Brooks they selected in the supplemental draft, with a spotty college record. The B'gals had a good number of "morally challenged" players in years past. The thing is, is that Brown sees football in terms of dollars and cents. If he thinks he can get an iffy player on the cheap, he does so. 737906[/snapback] Thanks Bro! The thing is, one might think that a head coach would be inclined to "lay down the law" in a manner of speaking after such a long string of incidents. I am not judging Steinbach as a human being, but what he did was pretty dumb and bad for the organization; much worse because of the timing. I am likening the situation to a buch of rookie cops going out and fighting in a nightclub after a shift. If the Captain hears about something like this, believe me, these guys are in very serious trouble (far more serious than most would think). If you and I (2 veterans) go out a week later and do something similar, we would likely be in even more trouble, and it is understandable. Management has a responsibility to prevent actions such as these that serve to cast him and the department in an inferior light. I suppose my problem is that I am comparing a football situation to the real world which is what Alaska Darin would refer to as comparing "apples to footballs." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I am likening the situation to a buch of rookie cops going out and fighting in a nightclub after a shift. If the Captain hears about something like this, believe me, these guys are in very serious trouble (far more serious than most would think). If you and I (2 veterans) go out a week later and do something similar, we would likely be in even more trouble, and it is understandable. Management has a responsibility to prevent actions such as these that serve to cast him and the department in an inferior light. I suppose my problem is that I am comparing a football situation to the real world which is what Alaska Darin would refer to as comparing "apples to footballs." 737910[/snapback] It's just not the same. Cops are public servants who enforce the law. The standard for them to not break those same laws are obviously the highest they can be. Football players are equivalent to truck drivers. Unfortunately, too many parents don't teach their children this tidbit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted August 8, 2006 Author Share Posted August 8, 2006 Cops are public servants who enforce the law. The standard for them to not break those same laws are obviously the highest they can be. 737919[/snapback] And here is an example of just how right you are. Notice that the headline is for sexual assault. Then, it goes down to "misconduct," and by the end of the stroy, the sex was consensual. I am NOT saying what these guys seem to have done was smart, but they are being held on $75,000 bail for what I believe was probably consensual sex. Compare this to the Bengals, or even the Vikings on the boat. Strange world we live in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 If I owned the Bengals, I would at this point seriously consider firing the coach. At some point, these arrests become less of a coincidence. Marvin Lewis is a great football man. This is proven fact, but one would have to at least wonder if he has lost control of his team. Have any of these guys been fired or suspended? I read his comments once and he stated things to the effect of "the players will have their day in court," etc. This is all well and good I suppose, but I wonder if he sets a tone of permissiveness, whether knowingly or not. stuckincincy, how do the fans feel about this? 737896[/snapback] I actually lost a lot of respect for Lewis w/ his asinine comments after their playoff loss alluding to Roethlisberger "crying to the officials". It was uncalled for and showed a sour grapes mentality you don't want to see in a head coach who needs to turn around poor attitudes stemming from years of losing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 The Bengals organization has been drafting thugs for years, long before Marvin Lewis got there. The most successful player who overcame his rap sheet was Corey Dillon, considered by many as the best RB the year the Bills drafted Antowain Smith. The Bills would have never drafted Dillon. When you draft thugs who are 1st round talents that slip to later rounds you are gambling they won't get arrested or worse. The Bengals are always looking for value without regard to background. Since its been going on so long, it is the ownership that not only condones it, but apparently encourages it. It basically comes down to the fact Brown is a cheapskate who thinks these guys who are rated higher on talent than where they are drafted are bargains. It's gotten worse since Lewis' arrival because he wants talent and has bought into the Bengals gamble on greatness philosophy. It also goes back to the days when the Bengals had the fewest scouts in the NFL and didn't bother with background checks. 737907[/snapback] I'm not prepared to pin it on Lewis. The B'gals were squeaky clean in Marvin's first two years, and only Chris Henry was the '05 "sinner". As I said before, Brown stayed in his hole since the new stadium was built, but he seems to be re-asserting himself. In the 1999 draft, Ditka offered the B'gals that fistful of picks to get Ricky. The then- HC Bruce Coslet was all for it, but Brown overruled and insisted on Akili Smith. Justice prevailed...Akili left the club with $10 million of Mikie's money. Which pleased me. Smith was no NFL qb, but he was tough as nails and gave all he had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
true_blue_bill Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I don't see how firing a coach will get grown adults to behave themselves. 737900[/snapback] Maybe Bush should invade Cinncinati, that might get the players to grow up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Maybe Bush should invade Cinncinati, that might get the players to grow up 738017[/snapback] Relevance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Relevance? 738024[/snapback] I've been wondering that myself for about 6 years now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I've been wondering that myself for about 6 years now. 738029[/snapback] Do your part to help keep PPP things where they belong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Do your part to help keep PPP things where they belong. 738033[/snapback] You mean this ain't Rome? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 I actually lost a lot of respect for Lewis w/ his asinine comments after their playoff loss alluding to Roethlisberger "crying to the officials". It was uncalled for and showed a sour grapes mentality you don't want to see in a head coach who needs to turn around poor attitudes stemming from years of losing. A lot of stuff I've heard from Marvin Lewis leads me to believe he's pretty immature for a head coach. And that stupid/inappropriate smile he has. Maybe it's nervousness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 A lot of stuff I've heard from Marvin Lewis leads me to believe he's pretty immature for a head coach. And that stupid/inappropriate smile he has. Maybe it's nervousness. 738046[/snapback] Marvin has been a fine asset to the community. His charities and appearances have raised big $$$ for good purpose. What "lot of stuff" are you referring to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 It started with the things he said about Buffalo when he interviewed. Then watching his interviews and the things he's said, he just strikes me as more immature than you want your head coach to be. And I can see a player or two getting into trouble, but 5 players is ridiculous and more an indictment of the head coach. And I have no doubt that Marvin does charity work and been an asset to the community. That has little to do with his maturity level since there are certain things expected of certain people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 It started with the things he said about Buffalo when he interviewed. Then watching his interviews and the things he's said, he just strikes me as more immature than you want your head coach to be. And I can see a player or two getting into trouble, but 5 players is ridiculous and more an indictment of the head coach. And I have no doubt that Marvin does charity work and been an asset to the community. That has little to do with his maturity level since there are certain things expected of certain people. 738107[/snapback] What, then, do you recommend the B'gals organization do with him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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