5 Points from the Bills Dolphins game

[OnTheRocks]

1. I strongly believe that it is a mistake to bench Losman,....however I also believe that had Losman been the starter of this game the Bills would have lost.

 

2. Either Chirs Villarial or Trey Teague will definately be gone next year. The "Duke of Preston" has played well, and I don't think he was penalized once yesterday.

 

3. I like the game the Bills defensive backfield played yesterday, but folks do need to remember they were playing against Gus Freotte. The same guy that headbutted the endzone wall while with the Redskins.

 

4. Thurman needs to lay off the cheeseburgers.

 

5. This was a very important win for the Bills. Had the Dolphins scored on that final drive, it would have been a demoralizing loss that I don't think they would have recovered from.

[BuffOrange]

I don't care if they were playing against Todd Collins....the secondary was awesome considering they had zero help from the pass-rush.

Whoever graded the DL an "A" in the Rochester D&C this morning is a baffoon. They should've been given a C or D as nobody outside of Sam Adams even showed up....give the secondary an A+.

[DeeRay]

1. I strongly believe that it is a mistake to bench Losman,....however I also believe that had Losman been the starter of this game the Bills would have lost.

 

You really mean we'd have lost the game and Mularkey lost the team

 

 

2. Either Chirs Villarial or Trey Teague will definately be gone next year. The "Duke of Preston" has played well, and I don't think he was penalized once yesterday.

 

How about dispatching both and moving fat Mike to RG

 

3. I like the game the Bills defensive backfield played yesterday, but folks do need to remember they were playing against Gus Freotte. The same guy that headbutted the endzone wall while with the Redskins.

 

I liked the 5 TOs, but not the 7.8 yds/play

 

4. Thurman needs to lay off the cheeseburgers.

If he did that, he could not be george Foreman's double

 

5. This was a very important win for the Bills. Had the Dolphins scored on that final drive, it would have been a demoralizing loss that I don't think they would have recovered from.

 

So, it wasn't a mistake to bench Losman? You said it was a mistake to do that and they would have lost the game if they hadn't. Had they lost then, they would have not recovered from it. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

[Kelly the Dog]

I don't care if they were playing against Todd Collins....the secondary was awesome considering they had zero help from the pass-rush.

Whoever graded the DL an "A" in the Rochester D&C this morning is a baffoon.  They should've been given a C or D as nobody outside of Sam Adams even showed up....give the secondary an A+.

471548[/snapback]

The secondary was repeatedly beat all day long, on plays that had zero to do with pass rush or scheme. Especially Clements. The Fins were open deep over and over and over. Even the pass Nate intercepted the guy was behind him but the pass was a little short ( a terrific recovery and catch by Nate though, who besides being toasted repeatedly made two game saving plays which must be mentioned with any criticism). The Fins dropped a bomb wide open, too, and Free-rot threw a couple of lousy passes when guys were open.

 

It was an up and down game for the secondary. The interception by Mcgee in the endzone was perhaps the biggest play of the game until the last fumble. The INT by Vincent was because Fat Sam I think, hit Free-rot's arm.

[Simon]

The secondary was repeatedly beat all day long..... Especially Clements.

Nate though, who besides being toasted repeatedly.....

You've got to be kidding me, K.

The Bills asked Nate to chase one of the league's best WR's almost every play all day, like they asked him to chase AJohnson in Week1, and he gave up a grand total of 4 catches. One of those was on a hitch behind the LOS, so Chambers caught 3 balls on him while Clements had a pick and at least one pass defended on a day when the Bills were playing a lot of Cover1 and Clements was often on an island with a stud like Chambers.

That is an absolutely outstanding day for a cornerback even before you factor in the forcedfumble that ended the game.

[Kelly the Dog]

You've got to be kidding me, K.

The Bills asked Nate to chase one of the league's best WR's almost every play all day, like they asked him to chase AJohnson in Week1, and he gave up a grand total of 4 catches. One of those was on a hitch behind the LOS, so Chambers caught 3 balls on him while Clements had a pick and at least one pass defended on a day when the Bills were playing a lot of Cover1 and Clements was often on an island with a stud like Chambers.

That is an absolutely outstanding day for a cornerback even before you factor in the forcedfumble that ended the game.

471751[/snapback]

I was at the game and watching him. he really was beaten badly quite often. I am not making that up. Chambers is good but certainly not one of the best in the game. The play Nate intercepted was thrown a few yards yards short. If I were grading Clements it would be a B+ for that game saving turnover. But a C at best for the whole game. The fact that Chambers only caught four passes and dropped a bomb was a little misleading. It could have easily been 5-100 or 6-140. He also didnt cover him man for man on every play, Booker caught a couple passes against him, too, for ten yards at a clip and Frerotte threw some bad passes.

[BuffOrange]

Meh, from the TV it looked like Clements was only badly beaten deep on 1 play, which was a hitch & go to Chambers down the left sideline (can't remember if they scored on that drive or not). On the int he was just playing the ball and I think he knew he had safety help over the top. Ferrotte missed 1 deep ball to Chambers down the right sideline in which Milloy was inexplicably covering him 1-on-1, but other than that I didn't see him miss that many throws. McMichael was shut out other than the TD, which granted was a big play in the game; but I just don't think you can ask for much more given how completely non-existent the pass-rush was.

[Simon]

I was at the game and watching him. he really was beaten badly quite often. I am not making that up. Chambers is good but certainly not one of the best in the game. The play Nate intercepted was thrown a few yards yards short. If I were grading Clements it would be a B+ for that game saving turnover. But a C at best for the whole game. The fact that Chambers only caught four passes and dropped a bomb was a little misleading. It could have easily been 5-100 or 6-140. He also didnt cover him man for man on every play, Booker caught a couple passes against him, too, for ten yards at a clip and Frerotte threw some bad passes.

471771[/snapback]

 

I think we just have a different definition of what constitutes being beaten. I did see Booker get him once on a chair route as the phish are aware of how (over)eager he is to jump rotues. But a lot of times when you see him showing separation from a WR he's baiting QB's into throwing at him.I also don't think Chambers "dropped" a bomb, I think Clements was there and broke it up. And another of Chambers' catches was against teh zone in the middle of the field late, so Clements actually only gave up 2 catches to the guy he spent most of the day chasing.

And I certainly do think Chambers is one of the best in the game (I'd say around 10th-13th); he's just been stuck in a terrible offense with no QB to get him the ball.

Cya

[Kelly the Dog]

I think we just have a different definition of what constitutes being beaten. I did see Booker get him once on a chair route as the phish are aware of how (over)eager he is to jump rotues. But a lot of times when you see him showing separation from a WR he's baiting QB's into throwing at him.I also don't think Chambers "dropped" a bomb, I think Clements was there and broke it up. And another of Chambers' catches was against teh zone in the middle of the field late, so Clements actually only gave up 2 catches to the guy he spent most of the day chasing.

And I certainly do think Chambers is one of the best in the game (I'd say around 10th-13th); he's just been stuck in a terrible offense with no QB to get him the ball.

Cya

471810[/snapback]

Fair enough. We saw a few things and plays differently. That's cool. Chambers disappears and drops far too many passes for my taste as a top tier receiver, and I always think his size, speed and often spectacular receptions that he does make blind people to his actual game to game play.

 

Put it this way, I had zero confidence, even in Nate and Terrence, who are both very good, to cover the Fin WRs in the two minute offense late in the game. Nate came up big on the forced fumble and he deserves all the credit in the world for that, it was a game saving play. So I may criticize his play as an overall outlook in retrospect but he was a hero in this game.

 

McGee, IMO, is quickly becoming a damn good CB on both the pass and the run, already closes as fast as Nate does (he accelerates to top speed faster than any player on the Bills in a long, long time) and is the best return man we've ever had.

[Mickey]

I think the problems in the secondary in large part are due to the weakness of the front four and the inability of our LB corps to generate pressure when they blitz. We are not able to get any kind of pressure rushing just four or even when we send a LB. To get pressure, we have to send DB's, usually Milloy or McGee. When you do that, you are down to one safety back who can't cover the deep route on both sidelines. That means someone is going to get caught in a one on one foot race on a deep ball with either no help or late help from the safety. The alternative is to rush just 4. When we do that, often enough the QB has so much time he is able to find someone open or wait until someone gets open. Another option is a delayed pass to a back who slips out after holding a block for a bit. Brown had 6 catches out of the backfield yesterday. We aren't getting coverage sacks when the coverage is there and when we blitz a DB or cheat up with Lawyer playing as an extra LB, we occasionally get beat deep.

[Dwight Drane]

Fair enough. We saw a few things and plays differently. That's cool. Chambers disappears and drops far too many passes for my taste as a top tier receiver, and I always think his size, speed and often spectacular receptions that he does make blind people to his actual game to game play.

 

Put it this way, I had zero confidence, even in Nate and Terrence, who are both very good, to cover the Fin WRs in the two minute offense late in the game. Nate came up big on the forced fumble and he deserves all the credit in the world for that, it was a game saving play. So I may criticize his play as an overall outlook in retrospect but he was a hero in this game.

 

McGee, IMO, is quickly becoming a damn good CB on both the pass and the run, already closes as fast as Nate does (he accelerates to top speed faster than any player on the Bills in a long, long time) and is the best return man we've ever had.

471833[/snapback]

 

Kelly, I am totally in agreement with you in this debate. Clements was repeatedly chasing Fins receivers all over the field. This guy is a good corner, but the way to beat him is on an out and go. He will look to play the ball, then he loses a step on the receiver. I saw 2 yards of separation on him 30 yards down the field at least 4 times yesterday on pass plays. McGee is really improving each week, and I think there is little chance we sign Nate to an extended deal. We may franchise him for one and keep or trade.

[Simon]

For what it's worth, one of the few NFL columnists worth reading, Len Pasquarelli who watches games with scouts and pro personell guys, singled out Nate Clements for his only game ball of the weekend.

It may not mean everything, but I think it's not insignificant that a guy who generally knows what he's talking about selected Clements as the one guy out of over a thousand people who played pro ball yesterday.

I really doubt he'd have done that for a guy who was repeatedly toasted and badly beaten all day.

 

"Game ball:

 

Nate Clements, Bills CB

In a game the Buffalo Bills desperately needed to win to stay in the AFC East race, standout cornerback Nate Clements made a ton of plays, registering seven tackles, one interception and two passes defensed, and then forcing a fumble to secure a 20-14 win over the pesky Miami Dolphins. A five-year veteran and former first-round draft pick, Clements is a superb two-way defender, aggressive in run support and very physical in coverage as well. The Bills may have to use the "franchise" marker on him to keep Clements off the unrestricted free agent market next spring."

[Kelly the Dog]

For what it's worth, one of the few NFL columnists worth reading, Len Pasquarelli who watches games with scouts and pro personell guys, singled out Nate Clements for his only game ball of the weekend.

It may not mean everything, but I think it's not insignificant that a guy who generally knows what he's talking about selected Clements as the one guy out of over a thousand people who played pro ball yesterday.

I really doubt he'd have done that for a guy who was repeatedly toasted and badly beaten all day.

 

"Game ball:

 

Nate Clements, Bills CB

In a game the Buffalo Bills desperately needed to win to stay in the AFC East race, standout cornerback Nate Clements made a ton of plays, registering seven tackles, one interception and two passes defensed, and then forcing a fumble to secure a 20-14 win over the pesky Miami Dolphins. A five-year veteran and former first-round draft pick, Clements is a superb two-way defender, aggressive in run support and very physical in coverage as well. The Bills may have to use the "franchise" marker on him to keep Clements off the unrestricted free agent market next spring."

472022[/snapback]

 

Sounds like a guy who read the stat sheet and saw the highlights. You think Passthepotatoes had a chance to watch 12 games in full yet? The last two lines are accurate. And he did make a ton of plays. He also was taken advantage of on a ton of plays, the things a stat sheet doesn't show. And again, he made THE play, the forced fumble, that secured the game.