thewildrabbit Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 It takes one QB to make a line look quality. I agree, the line needs improvement, but as has been argued for years here, the QB position has been the root of the problem. And don't tell me the QB's sucked because of the line. None of them went to other teams and had success. I would argue exactly that, and that both JP & Edwards didn't start out as totally bad QB's, but were ruined by bad schemes, and lines. Gailey's scheme and Fitz's ability to get the ball out so quickly made that line look so much better then it actually was. This year the Bills were graded 28th in pass blocking, and #16 in run blocking. Yet were the #1 team in rushing attempts, #2 in yards. What does it tell you that the line can't make a first down by rushing when needed or can't control the clock or line of scrimmage. While I agree that a better QB would help that line. But how long would he last behind it as the Bills were 29th in the NFL with 48 sacks allowed, and were 29th in hits allowed with 106. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) Yeah Einstein and how many games did the Bills win last year when their offensive line played great, was top of the league in YPC and fewest sacks allowed and had 3 of 5 guys drafted in the 1st and/or 2nd round? Exactly. If it was as simple as you make it out to be, every team would just draft offensive line at the top of every draft. Look at the 49ers- they have emerged as the best team in football in the last handful of weeks because of three guys- Michael Crabtree, Anquan Boldin and Vernon Davis. They've had the same offensive line all season through their ups and downs. EDIT: And also, dude, Ryan Clady has been out all season. Look what happened when Welker went down, they were a completely different team without him. And I'm not saying it's black and white- WR > offensive line. I'm just saying it's a little more complex than you're making it out to be. Its not really IMO. Yea, last year Glenn was a rookie, tho he still played well. When I say a solid line I mean all 5 players The 2011, 2012 O lines had a poor RT (-7.2) & very average RG. These players would never be starters on playoff teams. While I agree the Bills currently have a top LT, and center, and the LG position improved somewhat after Brown (-30,1) was replaced. It still graded very poorly, and was weak spot on the line with Legursky (-8.1) in there. While the starting RT & RG had some decent games this year. They also had some absolutely horrible games, and quite frankly shouldn't be starters. The current RT was penciled in to be replaced but that replacement player (Hairston) suffered an injury, and ended on IR, and out for the year. Think back to what the Bills looked like against the Jets in that first game, the Steelers, the 4-12 Bucs. Now imagine this years Bills teams playing the Seahawks D, or 49ers D in the playoffs. They would get annihilated. While I'm not advocating 1st or 2nd rounders all across that line. They do need better talent now at 3 of 5 positions. Edited January 17, 2014 by FeartheLosing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) You didn't watch the Orange Bowl? No I didn't. I watched "official highlights", an "unofficial highlights", and all his plays against Georgia. Not one play in the red zone. It appears he made one play in the red zone in 2013...great. Thanks Flap. Edit: I just watched the highlights, and that was a 30 yard pass...outside the "red zone". Nice catch though. I would argue exactly that, and that both JP & Edwards didn't start out as totally bad QB's, but were ruined by bad schemes, and lines. Awesome! Knock yourself out, it's always good for a hoot, even after all these years. They both sucked, beginning to end. Trentative was ALWAYS tentative, WAAYYYY before "the hit". JP was "the Loss Man" right when he got off the plane. Edited January 17, 2014 by Marauder'sMicro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle flap Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 No I didn't. I watched "official highlights", an "unofficial highlights", and all his plays against Georgia. Not one play in the red zone. It appears he made one play in the red zone in 2013...great. Thanks Flap. Edit: I just watched the highlights, and that was a 30 yard pass...outside the "red zone". Nice catch though. I wasn't trying to be snarky. My point was that it isn't as if Watkins is unable to make the contested catches that are required in the red zone. Clemson struggled in the red zone all around, however 4 of his 12 TDs came from inside the 20. Might Evans or Benjamin or another taller target be better strictly in those red zone situations? Sure. But I'd say because Watkins is so much better all around he'd still be a better pick. It doesn't matter though, since he almost certainly won't be available at #9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26TrapDraw Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 We need to draft Ebron the big and fast TE. He is a playmaker and a difference maker on this offense. Bringing in Evans would almost be an end for Stevie I agree. Find a trade down partner take the TE . Then with the extra second take the best available run stuffing backer and best available road grater OG. We do that and we'd have a great draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Awesome! Knock yourself out, it's always good for a hoot, even after all these years. They both sucked, beginning to end. Trentative was ALWAYS tentative, WAAYYYY before "the hit". JP was "the Loss Man" right when he got off the plane. Apparently, you missed the fact that Edwards went 5-4 in his rookie year while subbing in for JP in 07. The next year the Bills started the 08 season by going 4-0, and winning two of those games on the road. This forum was already going crazy with playoff talk and how Edwards looked like a young Joe Montana, right up until that helmet to helmet devastating hit for a concussion that started his downward spiral. That play at this time would have not only gotten Wilson a huge fine but most likely a suspension too. So Edwards started his career with the Bills by going 9-4!! Any other QB's you know that start out that well? IMO It was HC Jauron and his loser of an OC in Turk Schonert that sucked. Let me ask, where is that OC now? What happened to him after his one year stint as OC for the Bills? You know, the guy Jauron fired two weeks before the start of the 09 season. The fact is, Jauron and staff of morons managed to ruin two young QB's in both JP & Edwards. In regards to the O line functioning as a solid, cohesive unit, allow me to make a comparison. Think of all the talent on that current Bills defense as 9 of 11 drafted in the first two rounds. Yet they still lack cohesiveness as a unit in several areas, as in mostly in stopping the run as they ranked 28th in 2013. They also were 20th in points allowed. Last season that Bills O line was pushed around in many games. They couldn't control the line of scrimmage despite being the #2 rushing team in the league, and #1 in rushing attempts. Plus, they also couldn't control the clock. That unit needs some serious upgrades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) If Evans is there at 9 I say it's a no brainer we take him? It's certainly looking that way early...We'll see how it all plays out...A lot can happen in 4 months...But when I see Evans on tape a see a kid that looks like he can be a monster in the right Offense...He's just looks like such an imposing guy physically for a WR...His arms look 8 feet long...And I like his aggression...He's definitely going to be a huge consideration for the Bills...No doubt about it... Edited January 17, 2014 by KOKBILLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) I wasn't trying to be snarky. My point was that it isn't as if Watkins is unable to make the contested catches that are required in the red zone. Clemson struggled in the red zone all around, however 4 of his 12 TDs came from inside the 20. Might Evans or Benjamin or another taller target be better strictly in those red zone situations? Sure. But I'd say because Watkins is so much better all around he'd still be a better pick. It doesn't matter though, since he almost certainly won't be available at #9. I had assumed he had a few plays in the red zone at some point, and I think he will be good. It's just that I don't think he will expand on what the offense can do. I think they can get a "specialist" type player without using the 9th pick on it. I think they can fix pretty much any of their problems that way. Mostly I want them to get the best player they can, at whatever position. Maybe that would be Watkins. Edited January 17, 2014 by Marauder'sMicro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 This thread makes me want them to trade down again and pick up a WR, TE, AND an OL in the first two rounds. I really think it should be possible. Apparently, you missed the fact that Edwards went 5-4 in his rookie year while subbing in for JP in 07. The next year the Bills started the 08 season by going 4-0, and winning two of those games on the road. This forum was already going crazy with playoff talk and how Edwards looked like a young Joe Montana, right up until that helmet to helmet devastating hit for a concussion that started his downward spiral. That play at this time would have not only gotten Wilson a huge fine but most likely a suspension too. So Edwards started his career with the Bills by going 9-4!! Any other QB's you know that start out that well? IMO It was HC Jauron and his loser of an OC in Turk Schonert that sucked. Let me ask, where is that OC now? What happened to him after his one year stint as OC for the Bills? You know, the guy Jauron fired two weeks before the start of the 09 season. The fact is, Jauron and staff of morons managed to ruin two young QB's in both JP & Edwards. Amen! Both Losman and Edwards showed plenty at first - Jauron was an idiot with offenses and hiring OC's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 This thread makes me want them to trade down again and pick up a WR, TE, AND an OL in the first two rounds. I really think it should be possible. Amen! Both Losman and Edwards showed plenty at first - Jauron was an idiot with offenses and hiring OC's. not to get into this, but Losman was not a NFL QB. If anything, making him look presentable for a year was amazing for Jauron. In fact, Fairchild got a head coaching job because of it. Losman lacked the intangibles. His first year as a starter was one of the worst QB performances in the history of football. As for Edwards, he was the better QB but he played scared. He got killed in college and took a big hit in the pros. He probably would have been a great backup QB for a lot of years if he didn't take that Wilson hit. That said, EJ was much better than both guys in their 1st year starting. hopefully, he progress better than they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReturnoftheBuffaloBeast23 Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I think they help EJ out by drafting Benjamin. EJ knows him already so why not I mean he's top 3 Watkins won't make it to 9 so its Evans or Benjamin. I just can't see them not going Benjamin I can't since EJ knows him. The curve would be so much faster... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts