1billsfan Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 I think you really do miss the point. It is sad how Bills fans cannot recognize, and sometimes even condone stupid moves. I never said, nor do I believe that Spiller was the BPA. He was the BTSA (best ticket seller available). Mr. Wilson commented how Spiller would "add excitement" to the team. As for the Lynch situation, the fact that he didn't want to be here was his problem, whereas he was under contract. Besides, even if they wanted to dump him, did you ever wonder why he HAD to be replaced by a first round pick, let alone a #9? They do the same thing in the secondary and it's just as stupid, perhaps worse. If Florence walks, must we draft Peterson? What would Peterson be, the BPA or a "need" pick? He has been called both on this board, as has Spiller. Our corners would consist of a #3 and #11. That is WAY too much to allocate to the secondary. And before you point to the Jets, they built a strong team (both lines and lbs) before they addressed the secondary. In fact, their starting safety is a Bills castoff, hardly the reference, right? This is how to win in the elements, or perhaps anywhere. Strong lines and good quarterback play wins. Knowing the Bills history, I think they will draft Green, with visions of him making acrobatic catches. This will draw fans, but the team will lose because it is small and weak. I hope that I'm wrong, because this would be a dumb move, BPA or not. You act as if the Bills have only one pick in this draft. I totally understand your strong frustration regarding the prospect of the Bills picking either Green or Peterson, but if they are head and shoulders above in player rating than Dareus (or Bowers, or Quinn, or Miller) the Bills would be taking a huge risk picking one of the aforementioned at #3. I do hope that one of these top ten defensive players looks like another Suh with practically zero risk factor. I don't see that right now though. I do see Green and Peterson as can't miss superstar types. One of these defensive front seven guys in the top ten had better knock it out of the park at the combine and in interviews for me to let players like Green or Peterson pass on by. If the Bills select Green, I see them taking the Rams' "Greatest Show on Turf" road to the Superbowl. I think the Bills could be in the top three in scoring if they figure out the offensive line (maybe draft that nasty guard Watkins in the second?), then draft all defense with the last 6 draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Bowers is a physical specimen and was able to get to the QB last year. Bowers has a lot of red flags in my opinion. #1 He is the Top Recruit in the country and didn't jack until lately (Touching story about his Dad dying, and basically saying "Son you need to step it up.") #2 ACC is pretty weak #3 I watched 2 games and he seems to take some plays off. The Bills and Denver staff are going to need to grill him interviews, and grill all his college and high school coaches. The Cool thing is Elway is putting all the interviews out in the open and I'm sure there will be some good Bowers interviews. I'm not saying that I think Bowers is the right pick, but wasn't the ACC still weak when Julius Peppers, or BJ Raji, or Calvin Pace, or Chris Long, or Mario Williams came out? Hell, was the ACC any great shakes when Bruce Smith came out? It's always been a decent, middle-of-the-pack conference with a few standouts. It's always about the player. Where they come from is part of the analysis, but it doesn't end there. For example, the kind of QB I'd love to have is one like a guy drafted out of Alcorn State (without the personal issues and early demise). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 You act as if the Bills have only one pick in this draft. I totally understand your strong frustration regarding the prospect of the Bills picking either Green or Peterson, but if they are head and shoulders above in player rating than Dareus (or Bowers, or Quinn, or Miller) the Bills would be taking a huge risk picking one of the aforementioned at #3. I do hope that one of these top ten defensive players looks like another Suh with practically zero risk factor. I don't see that right now though. I do see Green and Peterson as can't miss superstar types. One of these defensive front seven guys in the top ten had better knock it out of the park at the combine and in interviews for me to let players like Green or Peterson pass on by. If the Bills select Green, I see them taking the Rams' "Greatest Show on Turf" road to the Superbowl. I think the Bills could be in the top three in scoring if they figure out the offensive line (maybe draft that nasty guard Watkins in the second?), then draft all defense with the last 6 draft picks. + What makes you, personally, think that Peterson is a "can't miss superstar"? Descibe how you came to that conclusion. And while you're at it, how has Asomugha improved the fate of the Raiders? Champ Bailey the Broncos? If Reevis himself was on the Bills, how would we be any better defensing the pass? A truly outstanding CB might shut down one opposing player half the game. It's not a high impact position, no matter who is playing it. Really? Green is going to form the second coming of the "greatest show on turf"?? Minus Warner Martz and Faulk? You're not going to be taken seriously if these are your arguments for taking a WR or a CB at #3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 + What makes you, personally, think that Peterson is a "can't miss superstar"? Descibe how you came to that conclusion. And while you're at it, how has Asomugha improved the fate of the Raiders? Champ Bailey the Broncos? If Reevis himself was on the Bills, how would we be any better defensing the pass? A truly outstanding CB might shut down one opposing player half the game. It's not a high impact position, no matter who is playing it. Really? Green is going to form the second coming of the "greatest show on turf"?? Minus Warner Martz and Faulk? You're not going to be taken seriously if these are your arguments for taking a WR or a CB at #3. While he's at it, let's ask him to please name all the superstar WRs and CBs - I mean your "once in a lifetime" guys - on the last 5 Super Bowl winners. 06 Colts 07 Giants 08 Steelers 09 Saints 10 Packers Be real. Note that despite being very good, Hines Ward, Greg Jennings, or Jabari Greer don't count as "once in a lifetime" players. Then, for the hell of it, name the guys we DO remember off of all of these teams. It'll be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 + What makes you, personally, think that Peterson is a "can't miss superstar"? Descibe how you came to that conclusion. And while you're at it, how has Asomugha improved the fate of the Raiders? Champ Bailey the Broncos? If Reevis himself was on the Bills, how would we be any better defensing the pass? A truly outstanding CB might shut down one opposing player half the game. It's not a high impact position, no matter who is playing it. Really? Green is going to form the second coming of the "greatest show on turf"?? Minus Warner Martz and Faulk? You're not going to be taken seriously if these are your arguments for taking a WR or a CB at #3. I absolutely do think that the Bills could become an offensive powerhouse next year, possibly even without AJ Green. Fitzpatrick made a huge jump from forgotten backup to a very solid performer. Who's to say that he won't progress even further and make another jump forward with the whole offseason and training camp as the number one guy? IMO, for this to happen, CJ Spiller does need to become the starting dynamo back he was drafted to be. If they get AJ Green, look out. I can see the Bills' offense be so good they're being compared to the glory days of Kelly and Co.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 (edited) While he's at it, let's ask him to please name all the superstar WRs and CBs - I mean your "once in a lifetime" guys - on the last 5 Super Bowl winners. 06 Colts 07 Giants 08 Steelers 09 Saints 10 Packers Be real. Note that despite being very good, Hines Ward, Greg Jennings, or Jabari Greer don't count as "once in a lifetime" players. Then, for the hell of it, name the guys we DO remember off of all of these teams. It'll be fun. OK I'll play 06 Colts (Marvin Harrison*, Reggie Wayne*, Dallas Clark*) 07 Giants (Plaxico Burress*, David Tyree, Armani Toomer) 08 Steelers (Santonio Holmes*, Hines Ward) 09 Saints (Colston, Henderson, Meachem*) 10 Packers (Jennings, Driver) * 1st Round Pick Good grief all these people trying to diminish the importance of WR position and dump on drafting them high continue to dig themselves a deeper hole. Edited February 8, 2011 by Joe_the_6_pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 the best cover corner in the league is a good pass rusher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Here are the first round top 10 WR picks since 2000: Heyward-bey Crabtree Calvin Johnson Santonio Holmes Braylon Edwards Troy Williamson LArry Fitzgerald Row Williams Reggie Williams Charles Rogers Andre Johnson Donte Stalworth David Terrell Koren Robinson Peter Warrick Plaxico Burress Travis Taylor Three (C. Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald and Andre Johnson may be described as franchise or ever "superstar" players. Braylon Edwards and Holmes are aboev average, but each was traded by the team that drafted them very early in their careers--completely expendable, in other words. The rest are average or pure junk. I'd rather draft Montana first, then go looking for Jerry Rice. Detroit, another chronically bad and poorly run team spent 3 first picks on WRs when they didn't have a very good QB to throw them the ball. What was the point?? We should spend a precious pick (#3) in a luxury like a WR? That's like Somalia buying a space shuttle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 OK I'll play 06 Colts (Marvin Harrison*, Reggie Wayne*, Dallas Clark*) 07 Giants (Plaxico Burress*, David Tyree, Armani Toomer) 08 Steelers (Santonio Holmes*, Hines Ward) 09 Saints (Colston, Henderson, Meachem*) 10 Packers (Jennings, Driver) * 1st Round Pick Good grief all these people trying to diminish the importance of WR position and dump on drafting them high continue to dig themselves a deeper. you need to recognize the difference between the 3rd overall pick in the draft and a regular "1st round pick," b/c there is a difference. drafting a WR at 25, when you have other pieces in place is one thing, and drafting a WR at 3 when you have 10 other holes is a completely different animal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 OK I'll play 06 Colts (Marvin Harrison*, Reggie Wayne*, Dallas Clark*) 07 Giants (Plaxico Burress*, David Tyree, Armani Toomer) 08 Steelers (Santonio Holmes*, Hines Ward) 09 Saints (Colston, Henderson, Meachem*) 10 Packers (Jennings, Driver) * 1st Round Pick Good grief all these people trying to diminish the importance of WR position and dump on drafting them high continue to dig themselves a deeper. Your analysis fails to acknowledge one obvious point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I absolutely do think that the Bills could become an offensive powerhouse next year, possibly even without AJ Green. Fitzpatrick made a huge jump from forgotten backup to a very solid performer. Who's to say that he won't progress even further and make another jump forward with the whole offseason and training camp as the number one guy? IMO, for this to happen, CJ Spiller does need to become the starting dynamo back he was drafted to be. If they get AJ Green, look out. I can see the Bills' offense be so good they're being compared to the glory days of Kelly and Co.. I am just not sold on that improving the offense too much. While I appreciate the idea that big-time talent will strengthen the offense, I think that Fitz's big plus is his ability to distribute the ball and that the weapons they have could be good enough for improvement, so long as Bell adds strength, they solve the RT issue, add depth on the OL, and get the man a TIGHT END. Right now you have an improving Stevie Johnson, Lee Evans (who I believe will rebound), Parrish (who was having a great start prior to the injury), Spiller (an underutilized and underperforming speed threat), Fred Jackson (a better all-purpose back than we were able to discover last year), David Nelson (an emerging end zone threat with height), and any of Marcus Easley, Naaman Roosevelt, Donald Jones and other decent 5th/6th WR candidates. Unless they're moving Evans for less value than he holds for the Bills (an idea I can't stand), or not re-signing Parrish (in which case, who plays slot?), I don't understand why they'd prioritize adding to this pool when its potential is yet unexploited. Couple this with the dearth of talent in the Front 7 and it just doesn't make sense. Not at #3 where you should have some pretty great options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 you need to recognize the difference between the 3rd overall pick in the draft and a regular "1st round pick," b/c there is a difference. drafting a WR at 25, when you have other pieces in place is one thing, and drafting a WR at 3 when you have 10 other holes is a completely different animal. Completely bogus argument you keep trying to make that's been demolished several times in this thread. Your analysis fails to acknowledge one obvious point. Never said we don't need a QB. With Luck out, just don't see one worth taking. Rather get a franchise WR, then make a franchise mistake on Leaf, Russell or Alex Smith etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Completely bogus argument you keep trying to make that's been demolished several times in this thread. Never said we don't need a QB. With Luck out, just don't see one worth taking. Rather get a franchise WR, then make a franchise mistake on Leaf, Russell or Alex Smith etc etc A team picking at 25 has different needs than a top 3 pick team, don't you agree? And who were the QBs on the past 5 SB winners? Past 10? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 OK I'll play 06 Colts (Marvin Harrison*, Reggie Wayne*, Dallas Clark*) 07 Giants (Plaxico Burress*, David Tyree, Armani Toomer) 08 Steelers (Santonio Holmes*, Hines Ward) 09 Saints (Colston, Henderson, Meachem*) 10 Packers (Jennings, Driver) * 1st Round Pick Good grief all these people trying to diminish the importance of WR position and dump on drafting them high continue to dig themselves a deeper hole. you need to recognize the difference between the 3rd overall pick in the draft and a regular "1st round pick," b/c there is a difference. drafting a WR at 25, when you have other pieces in place is one thing, and drafting a WR at 3 when you have 10 other holes is a completely different animal. Bingo. Also, he named a tight end (which I think the Bills need). Burress, Tyree, Toomer, Ward, Santonio Holmes, Meachem, these guys are all "once-in-a-lifetime," draft'em at #3 talents? That's !@#$ing laughable, man. And I like Harrison, Jennings, Driver, Colston (pick #252 of 255ish), Ward, and Wayne, but of those guys MAYBE only Reggie Wayne is a guy I would consider at #3. Also, I would probably only go there if my other options were total red flags, and I had Peyton Manning already. Ward is a great player and does many little things on the field very well, but I wouldn't be betting on getting that kind of veteran perspective on the game from a rookie WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 A team picking at 25 has different needs than a top 3 pick team, don't you agree? No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 (edited) Completely bogus argument you keep trying to make that's been demolished several times in this thread. Never said we don't need a QB. With Luck out, just don't see one worth taking. Rather get a franchise WR, then make a franchise mistake on Leaf, Russell or Alex Smith etc etc lol. keep telling yourself that. you keep stating "the importance" of 1st round WR's while failing to mention that with the exception of 2-3, all of these "1st round WR" were drafted in the middle to late first round. Why don't you highlight all of the WR's on the playoff teams over the past ten years that have been drafted after the 1st round compared to WR drafted in the first round and see what results you come up with. We won't even get into how many of them were drafted in the top 5. I already know the answer. Cheers. Edited February 8, 2011 by bobobonators Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 No Wow. That pretty much sums where you're coming from. Answer the other question. Oh, wait..."it doesn't matter", right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Right there with ya. This is insanity. BTW I think I like your mock draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 (edited) Wow. That pretty much sums where you're coming from. Answer the other question. Oh, wait..."it doesn't matter", right? BPA all the way baby! In fact the only place the Bills have had some success in the draft is later rounds when they were thinking BPA. Their high "need" picks have almost to a man been a waste. Your turn, why don't you prove your blanket statement that a team at 3 has different needs than one at 25? And that the draft is the appropriate place to address them? Edited February 8, 2011 by Joe_the_6_pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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