217014170 Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) IF the Bills are in a position to take Luck in the first round IF he comes out then I say they should channel John Butler and trade down and draft for need(s) later in the draft. In 2001 (the Mike Vick draft), Butler and the Chargers brain trust traded down and acquired Drew Brees and Ladanian Tomlinson. The player they were after was LT (#5 overall pick) and they addressed QB with Brees later in the first round with an acquired pick, a free pick...arguably the best QB of the past 5 years. Don't overlook the Nix/SEC/Southeast connection. It would not be a stretch for Nix to trade out of the Luck-y spot (sorry...could not resist) to target another position and pick up Mallett. Also, the Bills don't need the #1 pick to get Luck (if that is who they want). Most of the teams that are in contention for a top 5 pick (besides the Cowboys at this point) either don't need or don't want to spend the money it would take to sign a QB drafted #1 (Assuming no rookie cap in the new CBA). Jerry Richardson's Panthers? No. They have two young QBs and they blatantly went out of their way to protect Tony Pike by not starting him against Baltimore with no running game to protect him. Brian St. Pierre was a sacrifice, plain and simple. Mike Brown's Bengals? Really? The best, most threatening fit would be San Francisco...fire Singletary, hire Harbaugh, draft Luck...all stay in Northern California, too perfect. Except the ownership is more interested in profit than wins. The Bills need to keep trying to WIN!! Winning is a culture and makes everyone better. The draft will take care of itself and as the ghost of John Butler has taught us...it's OK to get creative on draft day. (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside_game/pat_kirwan/news/2001/04/23/kirwan_q_a_apr23/) The Chargers were 1-15 the previous year and had earned the top pick. Everyone was convinced Vick was the answer but the Chargers had too many questions. Sound familiar? Butler and AJ Smith brought in Doug Flutie (just as AJ did as Dir. of Pro Personnel in Buffalo) to LEAD at QB and knew he could avoid getting killed on a bad team while they rebuilt. Do you think Nix still has the draft plan from 2001? I do... He believes in building through the draft and that the free agency period is for catching up on sleep. No team has ever brought in a PLAYER to fix a broken team. It ALWAYS starts with a change in management and/or coaching and ensuing success in the draft. Especially for a team like Buffalo, on a budget and in a less than desirable destination by comparison. It's reality and once you can grasp that you are in a dominant position to make good decisions. Edited November 23, 2010 by 217014170 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Id be more liekly to trade UP to get Luck ala the Falcons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) Yea that would be a better story if it were true-- They received the 5th pick (LT), a third rounder (Tay Cody), the following years second (reche Caldwell) and tim Dwight. Drew was the first pick of the second round, their own pick. Edited November 23, 2010 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Funny enough, Donahoe did the same thin in the same draft: trading down from 14 to directly acquire Nate Clements, Travis Henry and Brandon Spoon. The Pats have been doing this for years, and it is a very sound strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
217014170 Posted November 23, 2010 Author Share Posted November 23, 2010 Yea that would be a better story if it were true-- They received the 5th pick (LT), a third rounder (Tay Cody), the following years second (reche Caldwell) and tim Dwight. Drew was the first pick of the second round, their own pick. Thanks for the correction...point is still valid and even further supported by the additional players that ended up contributing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 IF Fitz plays well over the rest of the season and you win another game or two (Which is more then possible) which would leave you at 3-13 or 4-12 good enough for a top 3-5 pick but short of getting a top 2 pick and likely not good enough for Luck but screw it I go with Fitz at this point and just pick either a LT or Impact front 7 player with the top 5 pick. All in all the more positives and wins you see coming from this team the more and more you don't need Luck and are fine with Fitz taking the reins with a better supporting cast that you can hopefully build around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) Thanks for the correction...point is still valid and even further supported by the additional players that ended up contributing. If they had believed in Vick as a franchise qb they wouldve taken him in a heartbeat. You don't pass on a franchise qb for a franchise rb, lb, cb, ol, dl or any other position plus marginal depth players. I think that the personality and work ethic red flags with Vick are very different then anything in lucks scouting report. If you believe in the qb staring at you at whatever pick they end up with you MUST take him. If you don't, then you talk alternatives, and possibly trades to someone that needs that qb. Also, I think this might be the only time anyone has argued that Dwight, Cody, and Caldwell instead of brees strengthened there argument for that trade down. Edited November 23, 2010 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBeane Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) IF Fitz plays well over the rest of the season and you win another game or two (Which is more then possible) which would leave you at 3-13 or 4-12 good enough for a top 3-5 pick but short of getting a top 2 pick and likely not good enough for Luck but screw it I go with Fitz at this point and just pick either a LT or Impact front 7 player with the top 5 pick. All in all the more positives and wins you see coming from this team the more and more you don't need Luck and are fine with Fitz taking the reins with a better supporting cast that you can hopefully build around him. Not this year, 4-12 will draft around the top 8 at the highest. There are currently 10 teams at 3 wins or fewer. Edited November 23, 2010 by SpillerTime21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
217014170 Posted November 23, 2010 Author Share Posted November 23, 2010 If they had believed in Vick as a franchise qb they wouldve taken him in a heartbeat. You don't pass on a franchise qb for a franchise rb, lb, cb, ol, dl or any other position plus marginal depth players. I think that the personality and work ethic red flags with Vick are very different then anything in lucks scouting report. If you believe in the qb staring at you at whatever pick they end up with you MUST take him. If you don't, then you talk alternatives, and possibly trades to someone that needs that qb. Also, I think this might be the only time anyone has argued that Dwight, Cody, and Caldwell instead of brees strengthened there argument for that trade down. I don't need to argue. I leave it to the rest of the geniuses on this board. Dwight, Cody, and Caldwell were not perennial All-Pro type players but they were better than what they had, all made the team, and were solid contributors. The point I was making had nothing to do with getting those role players instead of Brees...the primary point was getting the guy you want LT and targeting a position of need, QB, later in the draft and the only way to do that, lacking any roster assets, is trading picks. But what do I know, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 If we had a good scouting staff I would say trade down, but I am staying pat or moving up. Whats another 2nd or third if we add more hardy/Troupe/Carrington/Youboty/Ellis? Ill take my chance with a higher 1st being that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) I don't need to argue. I leave it to the rest of the geniuses on this board. Dwight, Cody, and Caldwell were not perennial All-Pro type players but they were better than what they had, all made the team, and were solid contributors. The point I was making had nothing to do with getting those role players instead of Brees...the primary point was getting the guy you want LT and targeting a position of need, QB, later in the draft and the only way to do that, lacking any roster assets, is trading picks. But what do I know, right? Sorryif it came off aggressive - just my opinion that the trade had more to do with their opinion on Vick then their holes at slot receiver, punt returner, and backup DT. Yes LT was a great prize, and they lucked out in drew as far as talent evaluation (even if it wasn't the long term answer for SD), but truly I think it was atleast 99% to do with whether or not they believed Michael Vick was their qb, and once the answer was no, the pick had to maximize value other ways. LT at 1 was not going to happen, so they traded down and got a guy they did believe in and some role players. And I only addressed those Guys vs brees because you said it strengthened your point. Not that you were wrong just a funny comparison of value. Long term in SD those guys prob helped more then brees since they drafted rivers.. Obviously in long term if they had drafted someone like Ocho with that pick, they'd be a better team today. Edited November 23, 2010 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmjoyce113 Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 The Vikings need a qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts