About 55 days until free agency and John Guy

[Guest chandler81]

is apparently working on who the Bills will sign. Additonally, apparently Tom Modrak is busily working on the draft, which will occur just a few weeks after free agency begins. One would think the Bills would want the new personnel team in place as soon as possible for the critical evaluation of the new talent the Bills must bring in this off season. How long does GM Nix need to evaluate their records? (I know he's interviewing coaches; I'd hope our GM could do two things at once.)

[NoSaint]

This would be like firing your coach mid-season, or putting Brohm in just a week after signing him..... you dont do it unless you believe the alternative is 100% hopelessly lost - some may argue that to be the case. Essentially the draft is the week 17 for the front office. From there is where you would clean house.

 

In reality it is hard for an outsider to know how much of this debacle lands on Guy, and Modrak and how much was Jauron without being in the room. Did Jauron pick Maybin or did Modrak? How about Whitner? Who made the push for FA's? Depending on what rumors you believe Modrak might be batting close to perfect on the first rounders he wanted, but was over ruled by others. John Guy could also be hard to tell.... without looking it up, how were his FA signing pre-Jauron vs post-Jauron. He was a holdover from Tommy D's days correct?

 

Regardless, it is hard to say we are better off throwing out a full year of scouting and giving someone 6 weeks to familiarize themselves with both our team, and what options fit well once FA starts, as well as what directions we may be leaning in the draft etc... Depending on the extent of the makeover (just the man at the top? all scouts?) it could be very difficult to do successfully before FA and the draft.

 

 

Personally, I would like these guys to finish out their years, and then regroup after the draft. Never know, they might surprise us. Sometimes even changing the chain of command, or chemistry in the room could alter results immensely.

[BillsGuyInMalta]

Didn't we find out that Guy's contract runs out in May? My best guess is that they'll let him run out his contract and then just "not retain his services and wish him well in the future"

[bills_red]

Modrak wanted LB Cushing over Maybin fyi.

[NoSaint]

Modrak wanted LB Cushing over Maybin fyi.

 

Thats kind of what I was saying. Its so hard to tell without being in the room. Even that bit is a little bit of guessing based on comments if i remember correctly.

 

Maybe John Guy was instructed to get a backup qb instead of a qb for competition. Would that make Fitz a failure on his part, or the part of whoever told him to make that call? Im not saying thats the case, but we really dont know what was going on behind closed doors.

[Guest chandler81]

The fact is, in the cold light of day out beyond closed doors, these gentlemen have presided over pro and college scouting which has lead to a decade without playoffs. It really strains credulity that these men have been overuled over and over again for a decade. But, then again, as Mr. Wilson said, maybe it's all been "bad luck."

[papazoid]

is apparently working on who the Bills will sign. Additonally, apparently Tom Modrak is busily working on the draft, which will occur just a few weeks after free agency begins. One would think the Bills would want the new personnel team in place as soon as possible for the critical evaluation of the new talent the Bills must bring in this off season. How long does GM Nix need to evaluate their records? (I know he's interviewing coaches; I'd hope our GM could do two things at once.)

 

just for discussion purposes, it appears that Dick Jauron had a very heavy hand in final decisions. that Marv and Russ let him have his way.

 

John Guys job is to put a rating or grade on every current NFL player. He presents his list to the GM or person with FINAL SAY. wether or not they followed his advice, we don't know. wether or not his advice was any good, we don't know. wether or not the bills over or under pay the FA is probably NOT John Guys job. his job was to evaluate talent.

[Guest chandler81]

just for discussion purposes, it appears that Dick Jauron had a very heavy hand in final decisions. that Marv and Russ let him have his way.

 

John Guys job is to put a rating or grade on every current NFL player. He presents his list to the GM or person with FINAL SAY. wether or not they followed his advice, we don't know. wether or not his advice was any good, we don't know. wether or not the bills over or under pay the FA is probably NOT John Guys job. his job was to evaluate talent.

Never doubted for a minute that Dick Jauron was calling some shots on personnel. My point is that there is no way that whoever you think was making the final choices was only picking players rated poorly by Guy and ignoring the one's he gave top marks to. Occasionally that must have happened, but Guy has been here too long for it to have been the rule.

[All_Pro_Bills]

Never doubted for a minute that Dick Jauron was calling some shots on personnel. My point is that there is no way that whoever you think was making the final choices was only picking players rated poorly by Guy and ignoring the one's he gave top marks to. Occasionally that must have happened, but Guy has been here too long for it to have been the rule.

 

I have no visibility into the decision making process at One Bills Drive. But if I was in the position of either Guy or Modrak, and my input was consistently ignored (whether its true or not, who knows for sure?), and as a result I acquired a reputation as a poor evaluator of talent it would not sit well with me. I'd either let it be known publicly through whatever means was available that the draft selections and free agent signings were not my recommendation or simply quit.

 

Because if my intent was to continue making a living in a football front office, somewhere, I'd do whatever would be necessary to protect my reputation and livelihood.

 

Since neither of the above has happened, IMO you've got to assume they've had a heavy hand in the selections and the decision making process.

[NoSaint]

I have no visibility into the decision making process at One Bills Drive. But if I was in the position of either Guy or Modrak, and my input was consistently ignored (whether its true or not, who knows for sure?), and as a result I acquired a reputation as a poor evaluator of talent it would not sit well with me. I'd either let it be known publicly through whatever means was available that the draft selections and free agent signings were not my recommendation or simply quit.

 

Because if my intent was to continue making a living in a football front office, somewhere, I'd do whatever would be necessary to protect my reputation and livelihood.

 

Since neither of the above has happened, IMO you've got to assume they've had a heavy hand in the selections and the decision making process.

 

 

Not EVERY decision has been wrong. Look at the draft last year, maybin is a question mark, but if modrak and nix weighed heavy in the rest, we might not be as bad off as we think.

 

not every free agent has been terrible either. a fletcher, spikes, sam adams, have all played there roll well -- if any of those are pre-Guy, I apologize, they were just examples that came to mind. florence, fitzy, and hangman were not terrible this year, depending on what the team was expecting from them. If they are looking for a backup qb, guy did well endorsing fitzy. hangman gave versatility that they needed with the entire line in question. and florence was a good db off the bench. If they were supposed to be key probowlers, poor choices, if they were supposed to be solid roleplayers, you cant complain tooooo much. if jauron was choosing the direction, and he was reccomending who fit the role, it might have been a solid year. could be too much benefit of the doubt though.

 

As terrible as it is to be picking guys up off the street, they have done an admirable job getting guys that dont kill us when they are asked to start a week after stocking shelves at the supermarket.

[San-O]

This would be like firing your coach mid-season, or putting Brohm in just a week after signing him..... you dont do it unless you believe the alternative is 100% hopelessly lost - some may argue that to be the case. Essentially the draft is the week 17 for the front office. From there is where you would clean house.

 

In reality it is hard for an outsider to know how much of this debacle lands on Guy, and Modrak and how much was Jauron without being in the room. Did Jauron pick Maybin or did Modrak? How about Whitner? Who made the push for FA's? Depending on what rumors you believe Modrak might be batting close to perfect on the first rounders he wanted, but was over ruled by others. John Guy could also be hard to tell.... without looking it up, how were his FA signing pre-Jauron vs post-Jauron. He was a holdover from Tommy D's days correct?

 

Regardless, it is hard to say we are better off throwing out a full year of scouting and giving someone 6 weeks to familiarize themselves with both our team, and what options fit well once FA starts, as well as what directions we may be leaning in the draft etc... Depending on the extent of the makeover (just the man at the top? all scouts?) it could be very difficult to do successfully before FA and the draft.

 

 

Personally, I would like these guys to finish out their years, and then regroup after the draft. Never know, they might surprise us. Sometimes even changing the chain of command, or chemistry in the room could alter results immensely.

 

Yes: more continuity, less change. That should work.

[timbuk3]

is apparently working on who the Bills will sign. Additonally, apparently Tom Modrak is busily working on the draft, which will occur just a few weeks after free agency begins. One would think the Bills would want the new personnel team in place as soon as possible for the critical evaluation of the new talent the Bills must bring in this off season. How long does GM Nix need to evaluate their records? (I know he's interviewing coaches; I'd hope our GM could do two things at once.)

 

I would like to throw these two points out about John Guy and see what others have to say:

 

1) I think that the "Guy" earns his money every year especially with having to dig up players to fill the roster after 15-20 people are placed on the IR.

 

2) Are the lack of free agents John Guy's fault or the dysfunctional Bills fault. It's nice to create a wish list of players that you would like to see come in, but how many of them would actually want to come to the Bills and how many of the really expensive ones would Ralph really be interested in paying for. Sure we picked up some duds (see Dockery and Langston Walker who probably would have been OK if left at RT), but many teams have the same issue.

[NoSaint]

Yes: more continuity, less change. That should work.

 

 

Im not saying dont change, im saying dont change 6 weeks before free agency, unless you can pin point someone that is an absolute failure. Even if you signed the best scouts in the league today, it would be hard to hit the ground running and do better then what we have this year. you have 6 weeks to come in and assess the team (talent, and money), and then figure out what players fit our holes, and how to get nix, brandon, and or ralph to sign off on those choices... all within weeks of hiring you. Are we expecting nix to evaluate potential coaches, potential scouts, and potential players at an elite level, without any staff under him? It seems logical to me to hold out, let the men finish their jobs, and decide who stays, and who goes... im guessing many will be let go, but that transition is better left until the "end of the season." I mean, what if what we are seeing in the coaching ranks happens via scouting too and we run into trouble landing "our guys" and dont have a front office staff for another week or two?

 

 

What do you propose? would you like to see all of the pro scouts gone? just guy? What about college? anybody you want to target today? change just for the sake of change is not always good, when this close to crunch time, you need a plan.