Joe Miner

I don't think it's that out of line to say it's a lack of good judgment for Hardy to be in the this mess. I'm sorry I don't need a doctor's report and character witnesses for the 73 year old woman before I put any stock into what she's saying. But based on her account, I think Hardy's actions were irresponsible. Irresponsible and unwise. Not heinous, thuggish, evil, dastardly, heathen, or terrible. Just irresponsible and unwise. Sorry that my opinion comes across to you as stupid and judgmental. Unfortunately, there probably won't be enough proof one way or another. Because there won't be any further investigation on this incident.

Just trying to go by what the article says: http://www.news-sentinel.com/apps/pbcs.dll.../NEWS/805130310

Do you need a license for your knife? A knife is a utility tool that can have many uses as compared to a handgun that you are licensed to use in life threatening situations only. If you pulled out your gun, and started shooting the tops off the packages, then yes, they should call the cops on you.

Holy crap, I never said that he intended to use his gun.

These what-ifs are things you should be thinking about before taking on the responsibility of carrying a firearm. What happens if I draw my gun in this situation... What happens if I draw my gun in that situation...

He's not going to get charged if there are conflicting stories about what happened. 73 year old woman says he was beating his dad, took out his gun, and drove off. Dad says the nothing happend. No charges are gonna happen, because the cops have conflicting stories. Not because Hardy didn't actually take out his gun (for whatever reason).

Sorry, perhaps, corroborate the woman's story would have been better. What if his dad had said that when Hardy pulled out the gun, he was really scared for his life? What if when his dad saw the gun, he got scared and charged in again thinking to defend himself, or even worse, pulled out his own gun? Hardy could very well be screwed even if his intentions were to check his gun for safety reasons. Pulling it out at or near the end of a fistfight isn't smart. That's my point about being responsible with his gun. Doesn't make Hardy a thug/bad person/wrong. It means at the very least he showed bad judgment, which is all I'm trying to say.

I'm saying pulling out your gun as someone is yelling at you to stop hitting your dad is not a wise move, no matter his intent. Had it not been his dad, it could have gotten him into a lot of trouble. Even if he was taking it out for precautionary reasons. It's not a right/wrong so much as a lack of good judgment. Be more responsible, especially when carrying a gun.

Then you already know the responsibility I'm talking about that comes with carrying a gun. That it's not just something that you're allowed to pull out whenever you feel like it. So do you think that it was a smart move on his part to take out his gun in the middle/or at the end of a fistfight with his dad?

Because according to the law, he was not allowed to pull it out. Had this been someone other than his father who would have pressed charges, he could have been charged with brandishing a weapon even if he was pulling it out for his own safety. If the other guy felt threatened when he saw the gun, that's likely enough to get Hardy in trouble. It's a bad situation that Hardy didn't show enough good judgment to keep himself out of.

Am I wrong in assuming that most of you that think I'm way out in left field on this don't have a concealed carry license? If so I apologize. If not, look into it. Look into the classes, and what they should be teaching you when you get a license. Being licensed to carry a weapon is one of the largest responsibilities you can be licensed for. Talk to a few lawyers or cops about what that license allows you to do, and what it doesn't. The license doesn't allow you to do whatever you want with a gun. It really puts more responsibility on you than someone who doesn't carry a gun.

Again, I'm not assuming he's a thug. I've never called him a thug, and in fact said I didn't think he was a thug. He pulled it after "beating" on his father. There was no threat of any type that would be a credible threat on Hardy's life. Hardy's life was not in danger. Again: That is not a situation where you are allowed to pull a gun. He wasn't in a life threatening situation. Plain and simple. I didn't say he threated his dad. I didn't say he pointed the gun at his dad, and was on the verge of shooting him. I said it's irresponsible to pull out the gun in this circumstance period. A loaded gun jammed into your waistband is also not a responsible way to carry a gun. Being licensed to carry a gun requires a person to be incredibly careful about their actions when they are carrying a gun. It is an incredibly large responsibility. Larger than most people realize. You don't carry a gun, and get into a situation that Hardy was in, and you certainly don't draw your gun after fighting with someone.

How is it nonsense? What about the situation from the eyewitness shows a need for Hardy to have pulled his gun?

I'm sorry, but he should know not to pull a gun unless there is a credible threat on his life. That's his responsibility. That's part of being a responsible gun owner/carrier. Pulling out a gun in anger which is what the story sounds like is not being responsible, plain and simple. It doesn't appear that his life was in danger. It also appears he was lucky there was a nosy neighbor that perhaps stopped him from doing something very regrettable.

No, but by the time the cops arrive, if no one is willing to talk to them (this is what they tell me happens) then there isn't much they can do. You have been assuming it's all a misunderstanding, and that since there was no arrest, there was no crime. I also have tried to make it clear I'm not out to "assassinate" his character. If the report is true, he showed a lack of good judgment. As I tried to say, showing a lack of good judgment doesn't make him a terrible person, but it should be something that concerns the Bills. Unfortunately, that's not the way a concealed carry license works. You don't just get to draw a gun, if someone threatens you. There has to be a credible threat on your life. If there was a credible threat on Hardy's life, I'm surprised he wasn't able to tell the cops about it, and have that threat arrested. If he honestly thinks that a threat like that is going to be at his mom's house, and he will need his gun, IMO, the best solution is to not put himself in that situation. That's good judgment. Willingly placing yourself in a life threatening situation is bad judgment.

I thought that's what I just tried to point out? That we were both assuming. I was just trying to point out the fallacy in the belief that since there was no arrest, there was no crime. Assuming that the initial call was correct (I've yet to see anything that shows that it wasn't), and that Hardy pulled a gun in confrontation with his father, then yes that shows him to be very irresponsible at the least.

So now we're assuming... And we're going to keep going in that direction... From all the cops I've ever talked to, that's pretty much the norm in domestic cases. Especially in cases that involve people who have had prior run ins with the cops. Is it an assumption? Yeah, but it's also an assumption to think that Hardy didn't do anything wrong. The lack of an arrest doesn't mean anything either way.

Agreed Disagreed. I'm not saying that Hardy was on the edge, and about to shoot his dad, or is a walking psychopath. I am saying that it is a serious lack of judgment to pull a gun (doesn't matter if he pointed it) when a situation gets a little heated. As a gun owner and a licensed concealed carry guy, Hardy should have known that. It was incredibly irresponsible. His irresponsibility is what the Bills need to address. Basically, IMO, he needs to grow up, and grow up fast, before something serious does happen.

Likely by the time the cops got there, they couldn't get any substantial info because the family knew Hardy would get Fckud. So when the cops arrive they hear that nothing happened, and everything is alright, and no one pulled a gun. What are they supposed to do? Tell everyone to chill out, and leave. Not much they can do. That doesn't mean there was no crime, and that it was a misunderstanding. It means no one really wanted to press the situation and get anyone into real trouble (especially the family's soon to be cash cow). It doesn't mean that Hardy didn't show a complete lack of good judgment. Why the hell does this remind me of arguing with the Senator last year about Hargrove?

C'mon. You are certainly a smart enough guy to know that every time the police are called out, even when a crime has technically been committed, that someone doesn't always get arrested. Just like everyone that gets pulled over for speeding doesn't always get a ticket. Domestic disturbances are messy situations, and often times, calming the situation down is more productive than arresting someone.

Don't have a clue. My first guess would be the police officer didn't want to arrest anyone. Such as a bar fight situation. Many times neither guy gets arrested, because they were both in the wrong, and neither was more wrong than the other. If the officer was able to deescalate the situation, and get everyone calmed down, then I could see there being no arrests. That doesn't mean that Hardy didn't show a lack of good judgment in his actions. Do I think Hardy is a stone cold killer, or lifetime thug, or PoS? No. Do I think this was a rather serious lack of judgment on his part? Yes. Do I think the Bills should be somewhat concerned about it? Yes. Do I think the Bills FO needs to have some words with him, and perhaps get him some of the help and guidance he probably needs? Yes.

That, I think would be the best case scenario. The neighbor saw him "showing" the gun to his father, and got scared and called the cops. Doubtful, but I guess we can be hopeful.

That's true, but in most cases you're not allowed to use more force than necessary to defend yourself (Bring a gun to a fistfight). Something that should have been taught to Hardy in his concealed carry class.

As people with CCW should know, you never pull out your gun unless you intend to use it. (otherwise it tends to be brandishing a firearm which is illegal) The goal should always be to deescalate the situation. Drawing a gun for the fear factor can have unwanted dire consequences. Also, you better be sure you are in the right to use it, or you can get into big trouble. Most of the time that means there needs to be a credible threat to your life. An example of a credible threat to your life, given around here, is that if I'm a 6'5" 250 lb guy, and a 6'0" 200lb average unarmed guy tells me he's gonna kill me, I don't have the right to pull a gun and shoot him, because he's likely not a credible threat to my life. If on the other hand, I'm a 5'2" 110lb woman, and a 6'5" 250lb unarmed guy is threatening my life, then it would likely be ok for me to shoot him to defend myself, because he would be seen as a credible threat to my life. At the very least, Hardy is showing an incredible lack of responsibility and sound judgment by drawing his gun in an uncalled for situation. If the situation actually called for him to defend himself with a firearm, then I'm very surprised no one was arrested at all. Although it's still up to the cop's judgment on the situation. At the worst, Hardy could have some serious mental issues, and not be completely stable. Either way, this is hardly something that should be swept under the rug and forgotten by Bills management.

5) Who brings a gun to a family get together on Mother's Day? If you need a gun for a situation like this, then I might suggest you call your mother, and go to see her another time without the rest of the family. 6) I don't know NYS law, but in some states you can get into trouble just for brandishing a firearm.