BarleyNY
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Posts posted by BarleyNY
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Am I the only one who still believes in him? I believe that next year he will take a huge step forward and we will be in playoff contention. He has the body, leadership, mind, legs and arm to be a great QB. Somewhere along the line at FSU, someone seriously messed up his throwing mechanics. It affects his accuracy, and everyone can see it. But WHEN, not IF, he figures it out, this Bills team is going to be good. Its hard to see now but bright things are ahead, put trust into Marrone, Manuel and Whaley.
No. EJ is the Bills QB and we HOPE he turns into the Bills franchise QB. But saying he is that now is not reality. EJ really, really, really needed to sit this year and work hard at his craft. He didn't get the chance and that's on the FO much more than it is on bad luck. Kolb being the only thing between EJ having to start was rediculious. He'll get time to see how much he can improve, but if the FO decides to do its job this offseason there will be some degree of competition.
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He'll be at worst the 2nd rated QB coming out. His play from last year to this year was different. Last year he ran around more, this year he stayed in the pocket more. His arm strength is fine, he'd be the top rated QB if he were an inch taller.
We are going to just have to disagree about where Manzel rates. He is a playmaker in college for sure. A special one. But I don't see him translating to the NFL at all. I see a weak arm. I see a QB who is far too inaccurate and with a very small build. I see a QB who isn't up to NFL throws and NFL windows.
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Nothing, but that's new thinking which people can't accept in the NFL. Manuel is a ~$2M cap hit for the next 3 seasons. That's cheap even by backup standards. There is no reason to avoid having a QB competition, even if Manuel was good.
If you can draft a QB that you feel great about, you do it. Period. They're that valuable today.
Of course, there's a 1% chance this Bills staff does so, so this is pedantic. But, one can hope. I always do. I'm a Billiever.
I couldn't agree more on all counts. If a team isn't sure they have a franchise QB (or the one they do have is old) they need to be focused on getting one. This offseason I think our only shot is getting lucky with a mid-round QB though. I don't see this FO pulling the trigger in the first or second though.
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Ya he's probably going to be gone before the Bills pick unless they lose out.
Some team will pull the trigger way too soon on him, but that will be later in the 1st round or in the 2nd I'd expect. Ask yourself how many of the plays he made in college he can make in the pros. I don't see the translation.
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If he came on the market I'd have to ask myself why a team like the Texans, which is trying to win now, would trade a WR who has been so very, very good over his career. I'd need a good answer before I'd considered trading for him because the only reasons I can think that Houston would be willing to trade him are that he is overpaid for current production or that his skills are declining so fast that they are trying to unload him before he's not tradeable anymore. In short, if Houston is willing to let him go the Bills probably don't want him.
The only valid reason to look to trade for him is if he's so unhappy there that he forces a trade. In that case he'd probably be looking to go to a playoff team with a proven QB so the Bills would be out of the running anyway.
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I'm glad that the people saying the Bills should have taken Geno instead of Manuel got to see this game. I don't even like to compare them. There is no "every draft must yield at least one good QB" rule. I'm not sold on Manuel, but I'm not writing him off yet either. I never wanted any part of Smith though. The Jest almost had to take him where they did due to their need at QB so I don't blame them too much for it, but he's not the guy I'd want. He is a pretty classic example of a highly gifted bust. Physical talent to spare, but he's yet to prove the mental side. I'm not saying he's dumb or anything. It's just that there are only a handful of people in the world that have both the physical and mental ability to play QB in the NFL well. That is an incredibly high bar. The odds of any player developing that mental side are very, very, very long. It's easy to get caught up in the "he's so physically gifted that if/when the mental side comes together for him he'll be a top 5 QB in this league" line of thinking. But it so rarely happens I think those are the kinds of players that teams should use day 3 picks on and allow to sit and learn. Smith got shoved out on the field right away and that is only going to hurt him. He's got some very bad habits developing. Pressure up the middle equals throwing a floater off his back foot almost every time. That's a tough habit to break.
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Thank you for the correction on Montana, my mistake...
Geez. It's like no one has ever seen There's Something About Mary.
I'm of the opinion that if a team isn't reasonably sure that they have a franchise QB (who isn't at the end of his career) then they'd better be looking for one and taking reasonable measures to acquire one. EJ is a sunk cost as of now. If another QB is available, then let them compete. That doesn't mean the Bills have to give up on Manuel. It just means he's got more competition.
I was listening to a Freakenomics podcast about failure and they discussed both common and effective practices regarding it. People typically look highly upon those that persevere at something, even in the face of certain failure. They also look down on those that fail. But it turns out that neither corresponds to people who succeed. Those people aren't afraid to fail. They often do. Repeatedly. But they keep trying new things (a different type of perseverance and resilience) until they do succeed at something. They also realize their failures early in the process and give them up quickly. That is key as it gives them the time and energy to pursue their other options. They don't get bogged down with things that aren't going to pay off and they can usually tell the difference between what will and what won't.
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I would suggest that every draft pick made by every team is an example of "we know something everyone else doesn't." Nothing is guaranteed -- particularly not at the QB position. It is simply too soon to make an assessment on EJ.
This kid -- and yes, EJ is still a kid -- has played 6 games of football against NFL pros. He had a bad day against one of the greatest defensive coaches in history. Time to throw that baby out with the bathwater all right.
The Pop-Tart mentality of so many on this board is frustrating.
There is truth here, but I'm not optimistic. Here's why:
Lebeau has had incredible success against rookie QBs. Did anyone catch the stats put up about that during the game? It just shows how good he is at his job. (And why I can't wait for him to retire.) But I digress. Lebeau is so good, in part, because he figures out weaknesses in teams and players. His plan against the Bills seemed to be to load up and bring heat to stop the run and move the QB. Then take away deep and intermediate routes leaving the short game. Contain the run, make the QB move and dink and dunk. Wow, did that work. The Steelers with their 5-3 alignment are well suited for that game plan, but I'd expect to see other DCs doing similar things. Watch how much Manuel gets moved now. He's going to have to learn how to throw on the move or it's going to be a long couple of months for him and the Bills.
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This is nice.... but I guarantee he has no idea TBD exists and is working on preparing for the Jets.
Pretty sure he wouldn't spend time on message boards...
You'd be surprised how many NFL players do check boards like this one out. Some do. Some don't. There are different reasons for it, but NFL locker rooms know what fans are saying. Teams monitor them, too.
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I'm sorry, but if EJ doesn't have the character to weather the opinions of a bunch of fans on a message board then he should hang it up now. Heck, he shouldn't have even made it this far.
Actually I've been impressed that the vast majority of fans have held to discussing his play or just venting in generalities. I don't think I've seen anyone get personal. That would be over the line.
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They hedged which was smart. And they took reasonable chances. Looks like one of they certainly hit on Kiko, but unfortunately missed on Manuel. Franchise QBs are very difficult to find and that draft might not yield a single good one in the end.
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There is little intangible that cannot be weighed or measured.....and I think EJ has it.....
And I think he bounces back next week.
"It" certainly isn't the ability to throw accurately while moving. Manuel was abysmal at that today.
You keep drafting and otherwise acquiring QBs until you hit on a franchise QB. You keep doing that unless you are sure you've got one. And you start to do it again when that franchise QB you do have gets older.
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The point isn't whether or not Manuel is better than Lewis or Tuel, it's whether or not he's a franchise QB. It is fair to note that he is a rookie. Fine But the early returns are not promising. If I was in the Bills FO I would not be giving up on Manuel already, but I would still looking for a QB.
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This game is the Bills' to lose. Play tough, play smart and don't give it away.
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Who's making that argument? Pittsburgh has been god awful in all except a few games
Delusional Steeler fans. When a team has sustained success like theirs they tend to pick up a lot of uninformed bandwagoners. They all haven't bailed yet.
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I like Cotchery too. Both him and Brown are tough smart receivers who picked up some characteristics from Hines Ward before he retired. Neither one is the world's greatest athlete but they have great instincts and can really get their hands dirty. This will be a great matchup to watch Gilmore scrapping with them.
As for Ben, yeah he can still play. But I don't think he's the same guy when he doesn't have the horses around him. He has a tendency to press too much and gets himself in trouble because of it. His habit of holding the ball is likely to create real problems for him against this defensive front. Right now he's creating almost as many problems as he's resolving. I hope this is the week he finally walks over to the sidelines after a series and punches Todd Haley in the face.
And good point about their STs. Thoise units have had gremlins in them for the lat 15 years.
I can't argue with much (any) of that. Especially the Todd Haley comment. He's been an abysmal OC IMO. His WCO version is a lot of dink and dunk which really hurts their run game and does not play to Roethlisberger's strengths. Still, I think Roethlisberger has been keeping them in a lot of games. They do still have solid WRs, but no special one or viable deep threat - not that Haley would take advantage of it if they did.
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Interesting read from Steelers fans about our players.
Which Bills player would you take on the Steelers roster?
Complimentary if a wee bit short of a list.
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I live in Columbus and work for a company HQ in Pitt... so odds are good I will be able to hit one of them! Thanks for the tip!
Great! Hope you like it. I heard Cbus was getting a Melt Bar and Grilled, too. Short North on High I believe. My favorite sandwich is The Popper with turkey added. I can't imagine the calorie/fat content, but it's awesome. The wife loves The Godfather.
And I miss the Nachos at Barley's.
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Guys in that profession aren't usually known for not having ambition, or for taking the job with which they will be most "comfortable." They want challenges and they want to make a name for themselves. There is NO way a guy chooses to stay at Stanford rather than becoming an NFL head coach.
You may counter with someone like Nick Saban, but he's a different cat altogether. Saban took the bait and went to the NFL, but then realized he couldn't mold professional players the same way he could college kids.
I am not saying he wouldn't jump to the NFL, but I am saying that he might be better off not going. I'd counter beyond Saban as well. Some coaches (Joe Paterno, for example) have a great enough situation that they don't make the jump - especially for the kinds of NFL jobs that usually open up. The man is clearly an intellectual. Few football programs in college (none besides Stanford, probably) and zero teams in the pros offer him the chance to surround himself with similar people AND still be competitive at the top of the sport. Plus he will have job security not available in the NFL and he gets to live in a wonderful part of the country. Even for a bigger annual salary and the challenge and prestige of being an NFL coach he'd have to think long and hard before becoming Jerry Jones' head coach or rebuilding a Jacksonville team. There's a lot to hate about those situations. I'm not sure that it applies in this case, but some coaches are just better suited to the college game. They can recruit and lead kids, but don't do as well with the NFL due to parity, egos, etc. I think David Shaw is smart enough to know if he is that kind of coach or not. A secure job at $2.5M a year (and growing) isn't that far from most NFL HC salaries anyway.
Edited to add: I checked NFL HC salaries after I posted. He'd be at the bottom with his current salary. If he got a top 5 NFL salary in the $7.5M per year range I'd think he'd jump. If it was in the middle it might come down to what Stanford would go up to.
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Caveat emptor. Buyer beware. That applies to a team paying signing bonuses the same as it applies to a fan buying season tickets or PSLs.
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I would agree that it is his right to do it. But my point is that it's really selfish and I think he shouldn't be praised as some hero. Instead, he should be viewed as a guy who is a quitter, and who basically would rather look out for himself at the potentially great expense of his team.
It would be the equivalent of quitting your job without giving any notice; you probably could do it, but it's really bad form.
Is it like a team cutting a player with no notice because they picked up someone else who might be better or cheaper or plays a position of more dire need?
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While it would have been better for him to have done this in an offseason at least he didn't pull a Bob Hallen. He was the backup center on the Browns and was content to pick up his check as long as he didn't have to play. As soon as their starting center went down with injury he retired and said it was because he didn't want to start. That left the Browns hurting big time.
He did it on the bye and when he wasn't really being relied on except as depth so he softened it as much as possible. Teams have to look at a lot of facets in regards to their players - desire to play in the NFL is obviously a big one. It is what it is as they say.
As for the outrage for him quitting on his team, I disagree. Teams cut players and pick up replacements during the season regularly. Just check the transaction wire. If the Broncos thought they could replace him with someone better or cheaper next week they'd do it and it would be looked at as "business". If he got injured in week 17 of next season just as his contract ran out he'd never be given another thought. I'll give him the same regard.
I hope he really is happy with his decision, though. Because there is no going back.
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LOL they are not my style either - never been to Fatheads but sounds like a good place!
They are a mini chain of microbreweries that started in Pittsburgh. Their award winning Headhunter IPA is great and they have several other very good beers. And they usually have beer on cask/firkin which I love. They put a brewpub in Cleveland before I moved away and now also have a production brewery there. I'm heading back in a couple of weeks for a homebrew beer judging event hosted at the production site. That should be a lot of fun. I'm hoping they put one out this way to Buffalo soon, too.
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Winston is a beast. I can see great things for him at the next level, because he's a passer first and foremost, not a runner.
Normally i root for oregon, but tonight Lets go Cardinal! And Geaux Tigers! (i could be a bit biased however)
Agreed. I'm biased too, though. Ohio State alum. Thanks, Cardinal! That was a hell of a game. And Geaux Tigers!
Winston is an incredible prospect. Mariota is probably going 1st overall with 2nd or 3rd as his floor (barring serious injury of course). And he isn't in Winston's class. He is likely to be in the Luck, Elway Peyton Manning territory.
The Stanford coach is on a fast track to an NFL HC gig.
Stanford is one of those college jobs that I think I'd keep over any NFL gig. He won't get the annual salary that NFL coaches get, but he will have longevity and a work environment that he won't ever see in the pros. His quality of life will be much better at Stanford.
EJ Manuel IS our franchise QB
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
This arguement seems to be devolving into a "You're with us or you're against us!" format. That isn't what I believe. Manuel should get is chance to develop and to try and prove himself - and I think he'll get that opportunity. But it shouldn't be without competition, whether that is from free agency, the draft or even a trade. He may prove himself, but he hasn't yet and putting all of the team's eggs into that one basket looks very unwise at the moment. Besides, a starting NFL QB should be able to handle some competition. If they can't, then that tells you all you need to know about them.