Mango
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Posts posted by Mango
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10 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said:
It rough right now. My wife and were looking to buy a bigger house so we did a deep dive on our spending to see where its all going.
Daycare is by far the biggest cost. 2300 a month for 3 days a week 2 kids. I'm keeping them home with me for two days a week just to make sure I can feed them the rest of the month. I don't have some ***** job either.
If the PSLs come to me and are 5k, I'm not sure I can justify that when I'm struggling to pay for everything else each month. I hate that I have to make that decision, but its a reality so many people are dealing with. I've had seasons for 15 years on and off (took two years off for grad school and a job downstate) Would hurt to give them up, but priorities man.
The cost of having kids now is astronomical. Even without kids I feel like me and the Mrs. can't go to the grocery store for any reason and not spend $100 even if it is just filling in some gaps in ingredients we already have.
I think about being/having a teenager now and the cost of vehicles in a town like Buffalo. Say you have a fairly outgoing kid. Plays a couple of sports, maybe a club, and a part time job a few days per week. Gone are the days of getting a part time job, saving birthday money, mowing some lawns, etc. and saving for a jalopy to get yourself where you are supposed to be when you are supposed to be there. Are parents expected to drop $400-$600 per month (plus down payment) on a lease? $10-$15k on a "junker"? Or as money gets tighter and bosses start to clamp back down to "in person" for less money are parents supposed to leave work to take their kid everywhere? -
34 minutes ago, Gigs said:
Not to be an ass, but if you can't afford this and pay for it over 30 years, how do people afford vehicles, where you end up paying way more than the sticker? And the other ass part: if the people of Buffalo won't buy the tickets, others will. I could see myself getting a 4 pack when the locals drop from the list, if they even do.
I really don't see the Bills having an issue selling every PSL. In fact, the very people who can't afford the PSLs are the very same people who smash tables and get ***** faced before kickoff. They want a cleaner, family-friendly experience which generates more revenue; that's how you cash in.
I don't know if you have been paying attention lately, but a lot of people are really struggling with the cost of living all over the country. Buffalo included.
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Curious if the Dolphins are expecting some sort of punishment for Tyreek?
His kid burned down his house, he broke a women’s leg at a charity flag football event, and now has what feels like his 13th domestic abuse/disturbance.
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6 hours ago, Logic said:
I am genuinely curious as to why the Bills aren't a part of this. Has anyone asked Brandon Beane or whomever might yield an informed response?
My instinct tells me that the Bills, by virtue of their proximity to Canada, are considered to naturally/automatically have Canada as their "international" market. But that's completely an assumption, and admittedly not the most well-reasoned assumption at that.
Does anyone have any legitimate insight into why the Bills aren't a part of this? It seems like they could use all the help and extra attention and income they can get.
Piggy backing on the COO thread this is likely where the football side and business side part ways. You’d have to ask Terry. -
Im pro making the game safer. But I don’t get how this is even enforceable.
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15 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:
But they also made small gains every year, so they aren't getting fired. Pegula has rode the coach/GM carousel long enough to know that having a trigger firing finger doesn't work.
I am not the greatest advanced metrics guy on the hockey side, but people smarter than me have used them to point out that UPL is carrying the load of this team by himself, the defense hasn’t been any better, and they’ve been attempting to go all in on offense like last year since December.Certainly take that with a grain of salt. But the eye test says the team this year has been consistently worse at just about everything other than one goaltender.
Mitts commenting twice about how hard/fast Colorado practices, Maurice mentioning that they “do things differently” and can get some my physiology out of Okposo, with Tuch saying “if you watch the games we play hard” is a very bad and embarrassing look.
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52 minutes ago, ScotSHO said:
That is a bad xerox, please screenshot the original. And get me someone while I'm waiting.
I don't know why this is hard to believe. It was a huge story in the sports world. Outside of Buffalo and outside of the NHL.
Look at the Sabres, Terry Pegula is literally the worst owner the NHL has ever seen. EVER! There is not another franchise under any ownership that has been as dismal as a Terry Pegula lead hockey team for the last 10 years+. Not one.Terry saved the Bills from Toronto. But he also ruined the Sabres and has had 2 high level hires walk out on him in very short order. I know Lafontaine and Marrone or ash holes. But there are only a couple dozen HC/POH roles in the world, you almost never hear of anybody quitting, let alone 2. If Pegula ever moves on from Brandon Bean in the post Josh Allen era he will ruin the Bills too.
https://theathletic.com/1758235/2020/04/20/as-pegulas-face-business-challenges-employees-describe-a-toxic-culture-at-pse/-
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10 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:
Well Adams and Granato are going to extend their tenures next year.
What does this mean? They’ll make the playoffs, or miss a 5th year in a row?Also didn’t Adams already “extend their tenure” a season or two ago for no real reason?
9 hours ago, billsfanmiamioh said:
In all the times I’ve seen this referenced, I don’t think I’ve ever read a firsthand report from a PSE employee on how exactly it was presented. Sure from that graphic alone it seems “out of touch” but what was the context and tone? Was it in fact presented to the entire PSE organization? Was it something openly discussed in the meeting? Was it just a piece of information thrown on a slide that was stating the obvious but never even talked about? I think the answers to those questions would be important information to know before getting the pitchforks out.
Shouldn't exactly be shocking that billionaires expect an ROI that will allow them to maintain their lifestyle. I’m nowhere near a billionaire but any type of long term strategic planning that impacts finances (what doesn’t?), maintaining “quality of life” is certainly near the top of the list of considerations.
I’d really like to know if the tone of this whole thing was “get your act together so we can keep the yacht fueled up” or if it’s just the typical mob mentality demonizing.
They shared a building with Labatt for a while, I’d start kicking around there if you’re curious.Have you read the Athletic article? Tim Graham quoted a few people, albeit anonymously.
There is zero good context for that slide. It’s baffling.
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2 hours ago, Einstein said:
I missed this post. Who said this?
It was Kirby in the COO thread.
I don’t think he didn’t say they were bad. I believe it was something along the lines of “not known for being well run on the business side”. I am paraphrasing.
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1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:
Ah yes, it sounds like this new stadium experience and ticketing presentation is REALLY going over well. (But I hear there’s a free PowerPoint.)
This is a good reminder that the Pegulas shared a slide to all PSE employees that read “family lifestyle and taxes” as their expectations for their investments.
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2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:
Ofc he isn't a hero lol
He doesn't give two s**** about us or Buffalo at the end of the day
He was a hero for outbidding Bon Jovi/Trump on the Bills. In theory the only thing holding the Sabres back from an early 2000’s dynasty was Golisano’s willingness to spend on Briere and Drury and Pegula came in and said “Hockey Heaven”.That grace period has ended and he gets judged for the work he’s doing.
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2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:
You don't want to hear it but Terry is the only reason we aren't watching the Toronto Bon Jovi Bills now. I also don't think either of you watch the Sabres much, other than the scoreboard and standings. It just takes longer to develop a team in hockey. The Sabres are slowly getting there now that they have a goalie and defense.
I watch a lot of the Sabres. I have stayed up for this entire WC run.
If Detroit makes the post season Kevyn Adams will be the longest tenured GM without a playoff appearance. I’m not sure anybody who says “hockey rebuilds take a long time” in defense of Adams/Pegula is watching very much hockey across the league.
The problem with this version of the Sabres is their roster construction is flawed.
The problem with the Sabres the last 13 years is an owner who convinced he is a “hockey man”.
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42 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:
Yeah but you also forget that life is not fair
I learned that when I was a child... Buffalo and the state of New York either plays ball
Or we would have lost the Buffalo Bills
As somebody whose family has had season tickets since day one I know where I stand... I want the Buffalo Bills in Buffalo
Even if billionaires are playing greedy games... But they became billionaires because they are greedy at the end of the day
Do you get upset when a bee stings you? No it's a bee
I don't get upset when a greedy billionaire shows who he really is... I've expected this all along
Actually when I get stung by a bee I yell “ow, fork!” then swat it. If they make their home on my kids swing set I remove it.
“You die a hero or live long enough to be the villain” is likely more apt. I am fairly confident that Pegula is an Allen retirement and being tasked with hiring from being run out of town. The Sabres are begging for the Golisano years and if Pegula moves on from Bean we will be longing for the cash to cap era.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
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16 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:
I'm just calling it like I see it
It's billionaires who want more money at the end of the day...
But if you're playing hardball... And this is what it takes to keep the bills in Buffalo
I would rather do that than not have them
This isn't fair to anybody other than the owners. Fans should continue to complain about unfair practices and bad management without being beat over the head with "Well if you don't like it, maybe I will just move the team".
This seems to be a practice Terry has been pretty good at. it is a conversation in a lot of Sabres circles and was floated during stadium negotiations (Austin). If the teams response to anything critical is "well if you don't agree, maybe I will just move the team" then go ahead and move the team you (Terry) POS. What an abusive relationship to be in. "If you don't let me treat you poorly, I won't treat you like anything at all".
EDIT: This isn't Ralph's cash to cap or Toronto series to balance the books. This a pure profit line for one of the hottest tickets in the NFL in a city that can barely afford it.-
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15 hours ago, QCity said:
The PSLs are going to depreciate. If, in 10 years, Josh retires and the team goes back to the Doug Marrone / EJ Manuel 6-11 days they will sink like an absolute brick. You can't have half your STHs underwater and possibly defaulting on their loans. They want their money now.
I don't know who needs to hear this, but if you have to take out a 20-year loan to afford club tickets, you can't afford club tickets.
I am fairly confident the BIlls will tank post Allen if Pegula moves on from Bean. The Sabres are a disaster of an organization. Another poster who works in pro sports mentioned that even though the Bills are winning, they are known for being poorly or mediocrely run in pro sports business circles. If the Bills move on from Bean after Allen retires I think the franchise is screwed.
Look at the Sabres, their high water mark under Pegula (13 years) is last years 91 pt team that missed the playoffs. We might be begging for 7-9 at some point.
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20 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:
To be fair AT&t stadium only has four concerts booked through the end of the year right now
A few rodeos a few boxing matches and a bunch of soccer matches
Soccer has zero appeal in Buffalo basically.. neither does the rodeo
So they have four concerts and a few boxing
That's not mega cool huge events happening all the time to be fair... Like nobody cares about a rodeo in Buffalo
And every single stadium study showed it does nothing for the local economy big picture
To be clear if you have a PSL at AT&T you have access to dozens and dozens of events.There were 13 concerts at AT&T last year, including 3 Taylor Swift shows (No Mega Huge Events?). Plus Supercross, Monster Trucks, Rodeo's, WWE, big time college football, and soccer games. In concerts alone you get a star every month or so. They are also getting 9 World Cup Games in 2026. Maybe the biggest sporting event on the globe. Also not a Mega Cool Huge Event?
Which is the point @MikePJ76 is making. For $20k you get 8-11 NFL football games. And that is it. That is the list of events. Buffalo having the market or not having the market for those events really does not matter in this conversation. In fact I would say it is an argument against PSL's. -
On 3/20/2024 at 8:36 PM, Mr Info said:
This is something that surprised me. The Bills had the seventh highest average resale ticket price. Bills average resale tix were more expensive than the Giants, Packers, and Steelers.
https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/lists/nfl-ticket-prices-every-team/The last few years the Bills have had a bunch of weeks where they have the most expensive cheap seats in the league. As in other teams club, box, premium seats are more expensive, but the rockpile, last row of the furthest end of the 300 is more expensive than every other cheapest option in any other stadium.
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4 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:
One of the problems that people have when they look at sports business executives, is that they try to associate their success with on field / court success. I’m not saying that you are doing that here but others are in the thread.
I know a good bit about the Charlotte NBA situation. The Hornets left on TERRIBLE terms with lawsuits between the owners. They were an AMAZING franchise until the late ‘90’s. The Bobcats situation was pretty much a disaster. Jordan coming in was not really the savior that people thought. He was not a very good owner on the court or on the business side. That’s hard for me to say because he’s my favorite athlete ever. The franchise turned up under Guelli’s leadership and by engaging NBA best practices. As stated earlier, the NBA has always been the best at the business of sports.
When he was with the Bulls they were like middle of the league in sponsor revenue I think. That’s impossible with an old stadium and garbage teams. That’s a credit to the creativity and staff that he had built. This is a very good hire for the Bills & Sabres. His experience dwarfs that of the last few people “running the show.”
I have some familiarity with the whole Charlotte situation. But certainly not to your level. I know they left on terrible terms and Johnson was a disaster. However I don't look at those Johnson years as Jordan since he was only a minority owner. Just like the current era isn't a Jordan era, or that I don't have anything pointed at Serena Williams and the business side of the Dolphins. Worth noting that PG was hired a year before Jordan took majority ownership.
What I mean about Jordan is that just by existing he has the ability to brand an NBA team in his home state that is absolutely crazy about basketball and it isn't exactly an uphill climb. Selling a majority owned Jordan/Charlotte NBA team that previously dorked the city down twice (by leaving and then by Johnson) was basically like selling water in a drought.
I don't discount his the work with the Bills.
Ultimately fans don't care about sponsorships. The Sabres are trash. The Hornets are trash. I mean to be more harsh on Terry here than I am on PG. To release a statement that anybody has turned either franchise around in the last 10 years is silly and deserves to be laughed at. Imagine the Hornets hired somebody from the Sabres and Plotkin/Schnall released a statement that they "turned the Sabres around'. Even if we were still a top team attendance wise it would be a super silly statement to make to the fanbase. -
18 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:
Before someone asks, yes I know Pete Guelli. Yes, he is close with Russ Brandon. Yes, he’s a very smart and experienced sports business executive with local ties. He has years of sponsorship experience. It’s a shrewd hire prior to moving into the new stadium.
There are lots of examples. His role has ZERO to do with football or hockey. He is in charge of the business of sports. He sells tickets, advertising, etc…
You are certainly much more plugged in than everybody. So i will trust your judgement on the whole thing.
But I think some of the reflex is that historically terrible Buffalo Sabres owner said that the new guy "turned around""...checks notes...The Charlotte Hornet's. Another bad team. It is admitedly pedantic for me an others to take shots. But also Pegula has to read the room he is speaking to. What bad phrasing.
I don't doubt that Pete is well respected in multiple sports league circles. But saying anybody "turned around" a Jordan brand from the business side gives me pause. Especially one whose major revenue stream is the state of North Carolina. He is the states golden child; he has been heavily invested in that community for a very long time, and continues to invest in Charlotte even after the sale.
I don't think there is a comparable in the big 4 sports to Michael Jordan buying the Charlotte Bobcats/Hornet's. I don't believe that was a heavy lift. Working for adn being successful Michael Jordan as part of the larger Jordan and NBA brand is a major feather in anybodies cap. But turned around.....3 hours ago, JimS said:
It was much better in 1983. 🙂
Is it just me or does he look kind of like Bob Weir if Bobby had made a number of different decisions and started hitting those TRX bands 60 years earlier.
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I don't know. This feels like a boardroom hire that doesn't make much of a difference for any products on the field/ice.
This was a very weird quote:
Quote"His work in helping turn around the Charlotte Hornets franchise in the NBA was remarkable. He is a proven leader with tremendous skills and experience in the sports business landscape. With the upcoming changes on the way in both team's venues, we are happy to have Pete to help lead our teams."
He was there 10 years and only 3 winning years. My teenage niece could market Michael Jordan to basketball fans in his home state of North Carolina. He is one of if not the only player in the American big 4 sports to ever be bigger than the league itself.
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13 hours ago, BigDingus said:
Thought the colors were the Bears unis at first...
Then again, my vision is getting worse, so this could be on me.
I was thinking Broncos-esque. They have/had a curl by the shoulder too. I think if you want a "clean" jersey you go straight lines, kind of like the Bills. But if you want it to have curves and stuff you have to make the rest of the color scheme interesting.
Kind of like the Sabres jerseys. The blue and gold is great for what we have now. Straight lines, standard circle crest. But the goat head has a ton of color with a lot more shapes. -
I like Jason. He would be perfect for Buffalo.
But he has a couple of kids with another on the way. His wife is Philly born and raised. Their family is there and he has no need for another pay check. There is no way he takes off to Buffalo for -6-8 months and either leaves his wife home alone pregnant/with a new born or pulls her away from her family so that he can play for a year or two in Buffalo.
It would be awesome but I would be shocked if it ever happened.
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43 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:
Oh i meant after 2025 season so the 2026 offseason.
These are always estimates just because of all the different bonus structures and whatnot.
To move him in 2024 -
4.3M signing bonus prorated over 3 years - 12.9M
3.2M option bonus prorated over 4 years - 12.8M
1.35M Restructure bonus prorated over 4 years - 5.4M
18.5M Base Salary (This piece would be traded) - 18.5M
So i see it as 31.1M dead cap total if traded vs. a 27.8M cap hit if kept. If traded as a Post June 1st - you can move it across 2 years. Spotrac has it as 8.8M dead in 2024 and 22.2M dead in 2025 so 19M in savings. I'm just not sure how that would actually help our team.
I am not necessarily advocating for it, but I do think the current in season saving with a roll over make it an interesting conversation.
Assuming we move on from Diggs post June 1, don't spend a dime, and come into next season with an extra $24M in space, I think that number just about gets you to both a Douglas and Spencer Brown extension (something Beane has been rumored to be interested in). So with that in mind would you be willing to forgo this season without Diggs if it meant locking down a starting corner and right tackle for the next 3-5?
I might. I might not. It would take some balls, but at the very least I would have to pause.6 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:After watching Beane work his magic, I'm not to worried about 2025 and the cap unless the NFL's income goes down drastically. If you cut Diggs and Miller after this season, you'd take and 38 Million dead cap hit, but save $12 million over the combine $50 cap hit. I'm sure Beane already has a plan in place, but I agree there doesn't seem to be as many obvious places to find cap help.
Agreed. I don't think the roster is maxed out cap wise but we are running out of major cans to kick down the road as well.
57 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:$10 million over is light work.
Agreed. But with the next draft class, signings, etc. We will have to clear a lot more of the deck to make room. I think the team is committed to getting younger.
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5 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:
I always looked at Diggs deal as most likely a cut/paycut in 2025.
So did I. After his restructure he just becomes too expensive to keep all the way through his contract. But going through the numbers it is more advantageous to move on as a post June move this year than it is a new league year next year. New league year for 2025 only saves $5M. It only jacks back up to $18M if we go post June 1 again.
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/
I think there might be an error on spotrac since they did their last round of adjustments. They have Diggs as a post June cut saving $500k and trade $19M. It has been consistently $19M for a year.
https://web.archive.org/web/20211224005328/https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/stats-valuation/
PSL Pricing/Seat Selection Discussion
in The Stadium Wall
Posted
Unsure if this is a joke or not.
The Buffalo Bills are not playing in a free market economy.
They took nearly a billion dollars in public subsidy.
Christ.