BuffaloBud Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I don't see anything wrong with having some long term vision, but there are some big potholes (no pun intended) with this. Financially the city, county, and state have major issues. The general area has taken forever to come up with a unified plan for the expansion of the Peace Bridge. Take a drive through downtown. Where would you put it that it would draw stuff other than football games? There is no major entertainment section at that neck of the woods. The city and county have bigger issues to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I don't see anything wrong with having some long term vision, but there are some big potholes (no pun intended) with this. Financially the city, county, and state have major issues. The general area has taken forever to come up with a unified plan for the expansion of the Peace Bridge. Take a drive through downtown. Where would you put it that it would draw stuff other than football games? There is no major entertainment section at that neck of the woods. The city and county have bigger issues to deal with. 614762[/snapback] We here in Cincy went through it a few years ago. Bottom line is that with decline in sales tax revenue to pay the debt, the County faces a real problem. One hears this or that "economic impact" statement. Locally, the governments tend to find a "hired gun" to praise the project. Ours is UC's Center for Economic Policy or some such. The feeling here about them is, tell them what you want them to say and as soon as the check clears, they prove your point based on their deep and unbiased understanding of the subject. The Cincy deal ended up with the Owner, Brown, holding all the cards. No restuarants etc. He made sure if you wanted to purchase food, it's either at the Stadium, or take a long hike. Not surprisingly, the county commissioner who was the big pusher of the new stadium now works for the B'gals with a fat 6 - figure contract. I personally don't feel that people are clamoring to come and spend money in Cincinnati, just to see the B'gals. Even if they did, the place is pretty much sold out due to recent on-field success. So the money is mostly local, and would have been spent elsewhere - locally. My feeling is that if there is an economic gain coming from outside, it comes with MLB, where there are almost always tickets to be had, and there are 81 home games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slothrop Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Good thing that A-Hole Giambra only has a few months left in office. His approval rating is around 1 percent and the only smart thing he ever did was decide to not run for re-election.614565[/snapback] I think Giambra has two more years left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Nothing a retractable roof couldn't take care of. 614730[/snapback] I like the game in the elements, albeit I have been to a few 50 MPH wind games back in the mid-80s, and I don't really care for that anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Nothing a retractable roof couldn't take care of. 614730[/snapback] Naaaah. Could you imagine never having the possibility of snow at a Bills game? I'll never trade our character for a little physical comfort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I am no expert on these issues...but does anyone here believe if a new stadium is built, that in itself will create jobs, enhance the city's chances of landing other events like concerts, etc...thus creating more business opportunities around the city (restaurants, etc)... Then if all this happens and people see the downtown Buffalo is somewhat alive again, maybe other busineses would be intrigued to move to the city. Think about this too everyone: If the NFL ever does go away from a cap, it is almost VITAL for the Bills to have a new stadium, to create more revenue, to keep up or at least hold their own against other NFL teams. 614714[/snapback] Most urban planners or those in the field who talk about or deal with sports stadiums view them (especially football) negatively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Good thing that A-Hole Giambra only has a few months left in office. His approval rating is around 1 percent614565[/snapback] When did it go UP?!?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I like the game in the elements, albeit I have been to a few 50 MPH wind games back in the mid-80s, and I don't really care for that anymore. 614793[/snapback] How did Cottrell's lawsuit against the County for reneging on the signed downtown domed stadium contract end up? Last memory I have - quite a while ago, was that they had to pay him several tens of millions in damages. Was that so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 How did Cottrell's lawsuit against the County for reneging on the signed downtown domed stadium contract end up? Last memory I have - quite a while ago, was that they had to pay him several tens of millions in damages. Was that so? 614804[/snapback] My parents and those of that age group are more familiar with that one than me. But that bastage might still be getting money from the county for all I know. Was it a downtown stadium? Thought I heard something about a domed stadium in Lancaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I am no expert on these issues...but does anyone here believe if a new stadium is built, that in itself will create jobs, enhance the city's chances of landing other events like concerts, etc...thus creating more business opportunities around the city (restaurants, etc)... Then if all this happens and people see the downtown Buffalo is somewhat alive again, maybe other busineses would be intrigued to move to the city. Think about this too everyone: If the NFL ever does go away from a cap, it is almost VITAL for the Bills to have a new stadium, to create more revenue, to keep up or at least hold their own against other NFL teams. 614714[/snapback] See my problem with all this is that stadium construction creates some temporary good jobs, but anything after that is low-paid part time work. Most people go to the stadium, enjoy the game, and leave after that. Not sure what that would do for the city. Lastly, I believe the stadium doesn't create wealth in Buffalo, it just re-distributes it. So what if businesses move from the suburb to the city. Doesn't create anything new. And if a new stadium is necessary to create more revenue, well where does that revenue come from? There is only so much in the area, and only so much to be spent on sports. If a new stadium means my tickets go from $720/yr to $1,000, well I walk. And if suites go up 50%, I'm sure many suite holders would walk too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I also wonder what kind of traffic nightmare would occur with a downtown stadium. I guess there is decent access with the 190 and Skyway but I get the feeling downtown would be very congested. Such an idea would look better if the toot-toot trolley had been expanded to the northern, eastern and southern suburbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 How did Cottrell's lawsuit against the County for reneging on the signed downtown domed stadium contract end up? Last memory I have - quite a while ago, was that they had to pay him several tens of millions in damages. Was that so? 614804[/snapback] I believe his estate settled for like $6-7 million in the end. And he was dead way before he ever saw the money. Maybe it killed him, the stress of it all. His suit was all about wanting all the future earnings, and future earnings of additional development he said he would have done. IE: the hotel, the mall, the restaurants, etc, and over decades they would have grossed $$$ so I want all that which could have been. He got like 1% of his original suit, and legal fees probably killed that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 My parents and those of that age group are more familiar with that one than me. But that bastage might still be getting money from the county for all I know. Was it a downtown stadium? Thought I heard something about a domed stadium in Lancaster. 614808[/snapback] It was to be downtown - about 55K seats, IIRC. I wouldn't blame Eddie - he had a valid contract and they told him tough, we're building in O.P. - sue us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 You know that Cottrel stadium would have been long gone too as it was only going to be about the size of the Astrodome. We would have had to have built something more in line with today's needs as far as suites and size. That Cottrel stadium would be way too small for today's NFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 My parents and those of that age group are more familiar with that one than me. But that bastage might still be getting money from the county for all I know. Was it a downtown stadium? Thought I heard something about a domed stadium in Lancaster. 614808[/snapback] You are correct - it was a dome in Lancaster - on Pleasantview Dr., where Ecology and Environment now sits. They ruined a very nice 9-hole golf course along the way, and were gonna take half my parent's property by eminent domain to widen the street into a thoroughfare - my Dad holds a grudge to this day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 It was to be downtown - about 55K seats, IIRC. I wouldn't blame Eddie - he had a valid contract and they told him tough, we're building in O.P. - sue us. 614822[/snapback] No, it was Lancaster. Walden avenue, 1/2 mile east of Transit road Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 It was to be downtown - about 55K seats, IIRC. I wouldn't blame Eddie - he had a valid contract and they told him tough, we're building in O.P. - sue us. 614822[/snapback] I, for one, won't argue about the present location for the Bills. Having spent a decade in the West Seneca/OP area, it's been an easy commute. Even in the city it's great. Zip down the Skyway, head over to Milestrip and zoom up Abbott. Also helps when a friend's family lives within shouting distance of the stadium. What is the general impression in Cincinnati with the two downtown stadiums? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I believe his estate settled for like $6-7 million in the end. And he was dead way before he ever saw the money. Maybe it killed him, the stress of it all. His suit was all about wanting all the future earnings, and future earnings of additional development he said he would have done. IE: the hotel, the mall, the restaurants, etc, and over decades they would have grossed $$$ so I want all that which could have been. He got like 1% of his original suit, and legal fees probably killed that 614819[/snapback] ahhh...Jandyce vs. Jandyce. Nice of the new Mayor to recycle the "vision", though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Now all he has to do is solve the future ownership question! Who's on deck for when Ralphie takes the dirt nap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Now all he has to do is solve the future ownership question! Who's on deck for when Ralphie takes the dirt nap? 614836[/snapback] Golisano-Wegman-Rich-Jacobs The Four Horsemen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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