MrLocke Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Sorry if this was posted. Camp Battles. Pretty good read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 For some reason my work connection is blocking parts of NFL.com and CBS Sportsline. Can someone paste the text in here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cr8ZyA$$BillsFaNnTexas Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 It's training-camp time again in the NFL. That means groans from the players, cheers from the fans (because football is back) and endless evaluations by the coaches. Is Tyrone Poole the same corner he was pre-surgery? (Getty Images) On most teams, the majority of positions are filled -- is anybody taking Tom Brady's job? -- with few to be decided in camp. For other teams, usually the bad ones, there are a lot of jobs open. That's when camp and the preseason become important. So moving into the opening of camps, this is the right time to take a look at key training-camp battles from each team. We'll go division-by-division, offering eight separate stories on the camp battles for each team, and who might win those jobs. We'll start with the AFC East and work our way through the league, with four divisions this week and four next. New England Patriots Tyrone Poole vs. Randall Gay, cornerback Poole missed last year with a knee injury, but he played well in 2003. At 33, age is starting to be a concern for him, but he might have one or two more good years left. Gay surprised much of the league, and the Patriots, with the way he played as a rookie free agent last season. He is never going to be a great player, but he knows what it takes to be a starting NFL corner. Edge: It depends what the Pats want. Do they want the experience or the youth? If Poole is all the way back from the injury, he can still handle NFL receivers, although Gay played well for a rookie. Opening-day starter: The choice here is Poole, strictly based on his being healthy. The Pats will have a decent player here no matter who gets the start. New York Jets Ray Mickens vs. Derrick Strait vs. Pete Hunter vs. Justin Miller, cornerback NFL camp battles Date Pos. July 18 AFC East July 19 NFC East With the retirement of Donnie Abraham, the Jets will turn to long-time nickel back Ray Mickens as the first choice to be a starter opposite David Barrett. Mickens was a decent player inside in passing situations, but he's small and that could be a factor in the run game. Strait, a second-year player from Oklahoma, has the potential to become a quality cover corner. Hunter, acquired in a trade from Dallas, is coming off knee surgery. He does have decent cover skills. Edge: Mickens. He has the experience, and it's his job to lose. Opening-day starter: Strait. The feeling here is that he has too much ability and will take the job from Mickens, who is more of a nickel back anyway. Buffalo Bills Ron Edwards vs. Tim Anderson, defensive tackle The Bills lost Pat Williams to the Vikings in free agency, creating a huge (360-pound) void in the middle of their line. Replacing him will be tough. But Anderson is a second-year player from Ohio State they are high on. He's not big at 300 pounds, but he plays hard and he had a good offseason. Edwards started 16 games in 2003, so he has the ability to be a starter, but he doesn't have as much upside as Anderson. Edge: It seems as if Anderson has it heading into camp because he did so well in the offseason work. Edwards is the bigger man (320 pounds) and the more experienced of the two, so that could help his case. Opening-day starter: Anderson. The Bills were praising him too much the past five months for him to be on the bench. Plus, he has a chance to be a darn good player. Miami Dolphins A.J. Feeley vs. Gus Frerotte, quarterback The previous Dolphins regime traded away a second-round pick for Feeley, and he was a major disappointment last season. That's why Frerotte was brought in to challenge him. New offensive coordinator Scott Linehan, a guy we respect a bunch, worked with Frerotte in Minnesota, so he is familiar with the team's new offensive system. Neither of these two players is a Super Bowl-caliber quarterback, so whoever wins the job is mostly a stopgap measure. Edge: Because he has more time in the offense, it's Frerotte. A comfort level for a quarterback is an important thing. Opening-day starter: Frerotte. The belief is the coaching staff is leaning that way already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Ok having read this - my take on the Edwards/Anderson situation is this: Ron Edwards should be the starter until Anderson proves he can step up. I know the Bills are high on him, but not to get on the field last season really leads me to question how well developed a guy like him might be. He was inactive for many games - and is only 300lbs. He might have upside - but us fans really haven't seen any of that. I'd have to go back and see how he performed in pre-season last year to evaluate him as a raw rookie - but Edwards has show me he has got some skills to perform. Remember back to the Snow Bowl - Edwards blew up in the backfield spectacularly to knock Ray Lucas out of the game. He had some very good games partnering Pat Williams in 2003 and I think deserves to be the lock at DT next to the Keg until Anderson shows his worth. The only problem I see here is that Anderson is light at 300, and Ron Edwards is a pass rushing DT, so we really don't know how well these guys are going to do against the run. My money is on Edwards to be the better DT for the first period of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richNjoisy Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Nick - I am pretty sure Tim was injured in preseason and was placed on the IR, so your comment about him being inactive doesn't make sense. IOW, he was hurt and couldn't be activated. I'm right aren't I? My recollection as to preseason is that the Bills were high on the guy. I don't recall any great plays but I might have missed something. As to his weight, again I would have to see what his weight is at camp in the next few weeks since his injury and his young age both may have been factors. As to your comment about Edwards: I absolutely recall the great game he had against the Fish , I think we also had something like 5 INTs that game. But other than that game Edwards was silent UNTIL last season when he started to make some noise. I have no idea who will win the DT battle but I H-O-P-E it is Anderson since I think I know what we wil get from Edwards (competent DT play with flashess of the great). Anderson made the scouts drool coming out of college. I am hoping they hit the jackpot. Go Bills! -RichNJoisy Ok having read this - my take on the Edwards/Anderson situation is this: Ron Edwards should be the starter until Anderson proves he can step up. I know the Bills are high on him, but not to get on the field last season really leads me to question how well developed a guy like him might be. He was inactive for many games - and is only 300lbs. He might have upside - but us fans really haven't seen any of that. I'd have to go back and see how he performed in pre-season last year to evaluate him as a raw rookie - but Edwards has show me he has got some skills to perform. Remember back to the Snow Bowl - Edwards blew up in the backfield spectacularly to knock Ray Lucas out of the game. He had some very good games partnering Pat Williams in 2003 and I think deserves to be the lock at DT next to the Keg until Anderson shows his worth. The only problem I see here is that Anderson is light at 300, and Ron Edwards is a pass rushing DT, so we really don't know how well these guys are going to do against the run. My money is on Edwards to be the better DT for the first period of the year. 385829[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 I don't recall TA being hurt at all. He was just not activated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven in MD Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Looks like both NE and NY have cornerback issues...I hope we exploit that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richNjoisy Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 I don't recall TA being hurt at all. He was just not activated. 385858[/snapback] Huh, I could have sworn he was hurt in preseason but you apparently are correct - I can't find any indication he was hurt my bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 I don't recall TA being hurt at all. He was just not activated. 385858[/snapback] Your right Nick, I think he played in a few games last year, but not active for most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Huh, I could have sworn he was hurt in preseason but you apparently are correct - I can't find any indication he was hurt my bad. 385881[/snapback] No sweat - and therein is my concern. We are high on a guy who sat out most of his rookie year... And did nothing when he did play. Inactive vs. Jax. (9/12) Saw first regular season action in NFL against Oak. (9/19). Did not record a tackle. Bye (9/26). Inactive vs. NE (10/3), at NYJ (10/10), vs. Mia. (10/24), at Bal. (10/24), vs. Arz. (10/31), vs. NYJ (11/7), at NE (11/14), vs. STL (11/21), at Sea (11/28). Saw first game action since week 2, but did not post a tackle at Mia. (12/5). Inactive vs. Cle (12/12). Saw action on special teams at Cin. (12/19). Inactive at S.F. (12/26). Saw limited action on the defensive line and action on special teams vs. Pitt. (1/2). The above is not a ringing endorsement of a guy we all expect to be our replacement for our All Pro DT. Just seems really unlikely to me. Don't believe the hype until it's proven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 No sweat - and therein is my concern. We are high on a guy who sat out most of his rookie year... And did nothing when he did play. 385901[/snapback] Isn't that true for J.P.Lossman too...Just as JP is getting his shot, our other younger players have to be put on the field to see if they can play...50% of them do...and 50% don't..... The above is not a ringing endorsement of a guy we all expect to be our replacement for our All Pro DT. Just seems really unlikely to me. Don't believe the hype until it's proven. 385901[/snapback] When was PW a All-Pro DT...I don't think he even made it to the Pro Bowl.... Plus the guy was in on only for 2/3 of the total snaps. I am not for the hype...but you have to get your draft picks play at some point....not 3-4 years after drafting them......You picked your draft picks for a reason....to play them.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch19079 Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 one player will get the start over the other. but edwards is a better pass rusher. Anderson is a better run stopper. so 1 will be in on passing downs, while the other will be in on rushing downs. but after training camp, we will find out who will be in on 1st down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Isn't that true for J.P.Lossman too...Just as JP is getting his shot, our otheryounger players have to be put on the field to see if they can play...50% of them do...and 50% don't..... When was PW a All-Pro DT...I don't think he even made it to the Pro Bowl.... Plus the guy was in on only for 2/3 of the total snaps. I am not for the hype...but you have to get your draft picks play at some point....not 3-4 years after drafting them......You picked your draft picks for a reason....to play them.. 385918[/snapback] I just don't see why the pundits would annoint TA the starter with no experience behind him. Sure he has to play - but I'm not going to be as high on his as, say JP, becuase the drop off from PW to TA is greater than that from DB to JP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 I just don't see why the pundits would annoint TA the starter with no experience behind him. Sure he has to play - but I'm not going to be as high on his as, say JP, becuase the drop off from PW to TA is greater than that from DB to JP. 385952[/snapback] Are you completely sure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 - but I'm not going to be as high on his as, say JP, becuase the drop off from PW to TA is greater than that from DB to JP. 385952[/snapback] How so....We don't have enough game experience for either JP or Anderson to say that the difference between them and their predecessor is marginal or huge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 How so....We don't have enough game experience for either JP or Andersonto say that the difference between them and their predecessor is marginal or huge. 385955[/snapback] I think that I beat ya by 1 second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Becuase Drew stunk it up last year - meaning JP has less to accoplimsh to go beyond thet performance than TA does to surpass Big Pat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Becuase Drew stunk it up last year - meaning JP has less to accoplimsh to go beyond thet performance than TA does to surpass Big Pat. 385967[/snapback] Yeah...but last year does not hint at the capabilities of TA or JP...Plus PW was in on only 2/3rd of the plays..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Yeah...but last year does not hint at the capabilities of TA or JP...Plus PWwas in on only 2/3rd of the plays..... 385976[/snapback] Of course. But last year counts in terms of how we measure performance this year, i think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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