todd Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Record as a whole, a good job? Based on what? GW and Gilbride, 17-31, orbust dratf picks? 23872[/snapback] Bust draft picks, eh? That's a hackneyed theme. And not supportable. Go for it, man. Name all the busts. Good ones like Travis Henry, Clements, Jennings, Wire, etc. You can't argue that point. Donahoe has hit some home runs, and if you'd like to bring up bust draft picks, you might want to look at the entire picture or else you may look like a fool. Gilbride? Well, he looked good at first, but then sucked. What is debatable is when he should have been fired by Williams, and the reprocussions if Donahoe forced Williams' hand, especially if he knew the season was shot. You want to take a shot at answering either of these points? Or are you going to fellate the opinions of moron Sullivan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I said it before and I'll say it again. 5 years is an eternity in the NFL. This is a league and an industry in which talent is largely judged on recent history. Donahoe's recent history is not good. There comes a point where he can't rest on the laurels of what he did 10 years ago. Nope. I'm right. You example of sample size is perfect. It's easy to choose the past 5 years because it omits the success that donahoe has had in the past. I'd even call the 2002 season a success because it was in line with what could be expected after a miserable first season under Williams. Jerry sullivan brought up the past 5 years because it was convenient for his idiotic, venom-spewing opinions. That in itself is a HALF TRUTH! It's as plain as day! If he took into consideration all situations, and the past 10 years, you'd see a different picture. But that's not the picture Sulliprick wants to paint. He doesn't want to be objective. I don't mind someone being negative when it warrants it, as long as you are objective. The wanker sure isn't objective, and that's what bothers me. To call out Donahoe as a failure is really, really stupid, and not supportable by rational thought process. Screw sullivan. 23887[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I said it before and I'll say it again. 5 years is an eternity in the NFL. This is a league and an industry in which talent is largely judged on recent history. Donahoe's recent history is not good. There comes a point where he can't rest on the laurels of what he did 10 years ago. 23909[/snapback] I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I think careers are long. Additionally, you must take into consideration circumstance, such as sacrificing his first season by fixing the salary cap. Additionally, his 8-8 season after that was pretty good. Last year was really the only failure. If sullivan would like to prove his point by taking a look at convenient stats, that's fine. But he's doing an injustice to factual reporting and editorializing. He has an agenda, and whatever it is, it has nothing to do with writing with his head based in reality. It's important to have long-term perspective. If you'd like to ignore that, so be it. I prefer to look at an entire picture. I dont' think that anyone can point to the hiring of GW as a good thing, but Donahoe has drafted well, and I think has assembled a pretty good staff right now. He's also brought in some darn good FAs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I really don't see where this team is much better or any better than last year. I think this O-Line is going to give everyone headaches again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Bust draft picks, eh? That's a hackneyed theme. And not supportable. Go for it, man. Name all the busts. Good ones like Travis Henry, Clements, Jennings, Wire, etc. You can't argue that point. Donahoe has hit some home runs, and if you'd like to bring up bust draft picks, you might want to look at the entire picture or else you may look like a fool. Gilbride? Well, he looked good at first, but then sucked. What is debatable is when he should have been fired by Williams, and the reprocussions if Donahoe forced Williams' hand, especially if he knew the season was shot. You want to take a shot at answering either of these points? Or are you going to fellate the opinions of moron Sullivan. 23896[/snapback] Wire looks to be a good backup who will start only because Lawyer Milloy is hurt. Jennings is somewhere around above average. Where are all the starters he drafted. Seven? Regarding your creative "fellatio" crack, I think we should keep your personal activities or desires out of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Wire looks to be a good backup who will start only because Lawyer Milloy is hurt.Jennings is somewhere around above average. Where are all the starters he drafted. Seven? 23980[/snapback] Again, my request was to name the busts. I haven't seen an answer yet. I'm sure there are some, because it happens to every team, but support that "bust" comment with facts, please. How many sacks did Jennings give up last year? What round was he drafted in? Has he produced appropriate value to be drafted that high? These are the types of questions you need to ask when evaluating a draft. Not just by throwing around the term "bust". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Wire looks to be a good backup who will start only because Lawyer Milloy is hurt.Jennings is somewhere around above average. Where are all the starters he drafted. Seven? 23980[/snapback] I agree Wire looks like a mistake so far, but you can't get them all right. Late 3rd-round draft picks are hit-or-miss anyways. OTOH, Jennings was excellent value for being a late 3rd-round draft pick, hats off to TD for this selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Again, my request was to name the busts. I haven't seen an answer yet. I'm sure there are some, because it happens to every team, but support that "bust" comment with facts, please. How many sacks did Jennings give up last year? What round was he drafted in? Has he produced appropriate value to be drafted that high? These are the types of questions you need to ask when evaluating a draft. Not just by throwing around the term "bust". 24034[/snapback] You said TD did a good job on the whole. I just don't see it. I will give you a B- on his drafts. You grade "on the whole" coaching staff and overall record grades. Fair enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 You said TD did a good job on the whole. I just don't see it. I will give you a B- on his drafts. You grade "on the whole" coaching staff and overall record grades. Fair enough? 24063[/snapback] You spoke of busts. Are you going to recant or name some? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Again, my request was to name the busts. I haven't seen an answer yet. I'm sure there are some, because it happens to every team, but support that "bust" comment with facts, please. How many sacks did Jennings give up last year? What round was he drafted in? Has he produced appropriate value to be drafted that high? These are the types of questions you need to ask when evaluating a draft. Not just by throwing around the term "bust". 24034[/snapback] Speaking on the "whole", you seemed to very quickly move from that premis to picking one player and stat to go with. How many sacks did the O-line give up last year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 You spoke of busts. Are you going to recant or name some? 24066[/snapback] 2002 1. Mike Williams T Texas (4) 2a. Josh Reed WR LSU (36) 2b. Ryan Denney DE BYU 2003 1 Willis McGahee RB Miami (23) - Projected Bust 3 Angelo Crowell LB Virginia (94) 2004 TBD How many STARTERS from 4 years of drafting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nervous Mullet Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Sorry to burst everyone's bubble going into a new season. I apologize if I offended anyone. I suppose you can call me "SullyII" 23612[/snapback] Like what you say matters. You're just a dopey fan like the rest of us. A counter opinion doesn't make you a divine prophet . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajzepp Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Man, there are a lot of Bills fans who are spoiled, not to mention completely unrealistic. TD has shown that he's a player, and he's here to build us a winner. He's shown the ability to use every avenue available to him to find us talent for this roster. Some people think it's just so easy to build a championship team......that's ABSURD! First of all, there are 31 OTHER teams competing for the same players we are. Second, even though some of you disillusioned backseat GM's would like to THINK you can draft whomever you want to, or worse yet, to be able to have a year or two years of hindsight to be able to make your selection, you have to play the cards your dealt. Donahoe can't draft a top four draft propect with the 13th pick. He uses his position - whether in the draft, free agency, etc. - to the greatest advantage he can, and I'm thankful for that. He can't hire Bill Parcells or whatever other "great" coach some of you think we should have if they 1) aren't available, or 2) don't give a crap about coaching here! Hell, I live in Atlanta now, and you know what the talk down here is? They are wondering when they are going to have back to back winning seasons......cause in like 30 years of football, they've NEVER EXPERIENCED THAT. We had a four year superbowl run, a resurgence in the late 90's, and now we are on the verge again hopefully. Some of you need to quit whining, take a look around the league, face REALITY, and be thankful that we have what we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taterhill Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 2002 1. Mike Williams T Texas (4) 2a. Josh Reed WR LSU (36) 2b. Ryan Denney DE BYU 2003 1 Willis McGahee RB Miami (23) - Projected Bust 3 Angelo Crowell LB Virginia (94) 2004 TBD How many STARTERS from 4 years of drafting? 24082[/snapback] this is just plainn ignorant,,TD hit 4 pretty much out of the park in 2001 with Henry, Clements, Jennings, and Schobel, Mike Williams is NOT a bust, Josh Reed is in his 3rd year, a year in which many receivers turn the corner, Willis has yet to play a down yet, stop the nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JinVA Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 this is just plainn ignorant,,TD hit 4 pretty much out of the park in 2001 with Henry, Clements, Jennings, and Schobel, Mike Williams is NOT a bust, Josh Reed is in his 3rd year, a year in which many receivers turn the corner, Willis has yet to play a down yet, stop the nonsense 24107[/snapback] not to mention Crowell either, for all we know he could be a starter but in the mean time we have Spikes and Crowell adds much needed depth in case of a TKO injury(knock on wood) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyJay1234 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Like what you say matters. You're just a dopey fan like the rest of us. A counter opinion doesn't make you a divine prophet . 24092[/snapback] Well the man that TD replaced. John Butler before he passed put on a record of 13-19 and if you count last season he was 17-31 with his apprentice AJ Smith running the show. Butler was considered by many a excellent GM and executive. TD last two years were 14-18. So again I must ask Jerry Sullivan. Who would you rather have? Modrak?? Yeah. Lets get the guy who ran the last few drafts. Who did we get the last couple of years? Oh yeah the likes of Mike Williams, Ryan Denney, Josh Reed, Willis McGahee, Angelo Crowell, and Chris Kelsay. Oh wait. Those are the picks you are calling out right Jerry?? So certainly Modrak can't be the guy. Well that and the fact that if they can TD his buddy Modrak is gone as well. So who? Mueller? Come on. The guy has been through 3 teams. What irks me the most is Sullivans hindsight and inability to offer alternatives. It is the crybaby school of journalism. Jerry- Why don't you write an article about what a mistake the Buffalo News made by hiring you Jerry and how Felser was twice the journalist you are. Follow that up by offering up no other solution for who should replace you. Make sure to include points where you have contradicted yourself or generally proved yourself to be a fool. How about this Jerry. How about we wait a few games this season to evaluate TD this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Man, there are a lot of Bills fans who are spoiled, not to mention completely unrealistic. TD has shown that he's a player, and he's here to build us a winner. He's shown the ability to use every avenue available to him to find us talent for this roster. Some people think it's just so easy to build a championship team......that's ABSURD! First of all, there are 31 OTHER teams competing for the same players we are. Second, even though some of you disillusioned backseat GM's would like to THINK you can draft whomever you want to, or worse yet, to be able to have a year or two years of hindsight to be able to make your selection, you have to play the cards your dealt. Donahoe can't draft a top four draft propect with the 13th pick. He uses his position - whether in the draft, free agency, etc. - to the greatest advantage he can, and I'm thankful for that. He can't hire Bill Parcells or whatever other "great" coach some of you think we should have if they 1) aren't available, or 2) don't give a crap about coaching here! Hell, I live in Atlanta now, and you know what the talk down here is? They are wondering when they are going to have back to back winning seasons......cause in like 30 years of football, they've NEVER EXPERIENCED THAT. We had a four year superbowl run, a resurgence in the late 90's, and now we are on the verge again hopefully. Some of you need to quit whining, take a look around the league, face REALITY, and be thankful that we have what we do. 24101[/snapback] Can I get an AMEN!!! Right on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Woohoo! I was waiting for a silly answer like that! You're making this discussion easy. Moulds was considered a bust by many fools until his 4th year. Funny, that. Josh reed is not a bust. He's only entering his 3rd year. Sorry, man, a 2nd rounder can't be called a bust after two years. Ryan denney? Brilliant. Isn't he going to split time with Kelsay this year as a STARTER? McGahee? The guy hasn't played a down of football and you are projecting a bust? I might just click the ignore button based on that single line. Angelo Crowell. Wow. How many starters? 1. Reed 2. Henry 3. Williams 4. Jennings 5. Clements 6. Schoebel 7. Kelsay/Denney That's pretty damn good, especially considering that you also build on FA, which you conveniently ignore. Not to mention Evans, who would start in 3-wr lineups, the fact that rookies don't normally start, etc. Oh yeah, then there's our nickel corners, and rotation on the DL. Nice try, man. You came up with 4 names that are "busts", two of them is starting, another hasn't played a down in the NFL yet he's still a bust somehow?! Please, this is getting silly. Step back and take a look at things objectively. 2002 1. Mike Williams T Texas (4) 2a. Josh Reed WR LSU (36) 2b. Ryan Denney DE BYU 2003 1 Willis McGahee RB Miami (23) - Projected Bust 3 Angelo Crowell LB Virginia (94) 2004 TBD How many STARTERS from 4 years of drafting? 24082[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Speaking on the "whole", you seemed to very quickly move from that premis topicking one player and stat to go with. How many sacks did the O-line give up last year? 24069[/snapback] I used that player as an example. You like to talk about busts. Is jennings a bust? What was the defense AS A WHOLE ranked last year? Dude, you might want to stop this argument right now, because you're getting creamed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJaimie Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 20021 Willis McGahee RB Miami (23) - Projected Bust 24082[/snapback] That line alone makes you seem ignorant. Projected bust? Who the hell are you? Nostradamus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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