GunnerBill Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 The NFL used to be viewed as a promotion. It isn't anymore. There are 20 college jobs in the top 35 HC coaching positions. You would never be able to take someone like Urban Meyer from Ohio State to the Falcons. Those jobs just aren't close in terms of exposure and the money is comparable (if not more) at those 20 or so programs. It was a different story when ND was the only team on TV. It's different now. In addition a pro coach is paid by an owner; a college coach has $ funneling in from everywhere. You will see less and less college coaches going to the pros. Someone like Cutcliffe is a possibility at some point because as good a coach as he is (and he's fantastic) you will not be able to win a title at Duke. If he gets Braxton Miller next year though I suppose that they could compete at a very high level. The money pouring into college football at the moment is insane and endless. If Auburn doesn't want to lose Malzahn the boosters will pay off his house (like the Bama boosters did for Saban). There are stories that out there that boosters of rival schools are pumping money into their struggling rival's programs to keep the HC in place. There was $ going from Oklahoma to Texas in the name of Mack Brown in hopes that his great fundraising would keep him in place. There are similar stories with Brady Hoke and the OSU boosters. The bottom line is that the college game is a better game right now. It is MUCH better coached than the pro game. You see innovation and playmaking. Each game played is more important as well (not to mention the shady NFL officiating). I love the Bills but like the NFL SO much less than I used to. That combined with the exposure and the opportunity to be THE face of the team (not a QB or JJ Watt) is appealing to big time guys (see Jim Harbaugh, Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, etc...). Interesting take Kirby and I'm not saying you are wrong but do you think the offensive innovation in the college game is not linked at least in part to the lower defensive talent levels and the pretty vanilla defensive schemes? My take when I watch college football is that the offenses might be fun to watch and innovative and in some cases very good, but the standard of the defences is poor. I certainly believe defense is better coached and schemed at NFL level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan_in_raleigh Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Look for a successful college coach who's program is u der tight scrutinize and possible sanctions. That's why Carroll and Kelley left college for the pros they knew the possibilities of sanctions could hurt their reps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 They try to keep college coaches quiet until after national signing day in mid-jan. Any sense a coach could leave heavily impacts recruiting.I was thinking this same thing. Most of the time the discussions with college coaches are kept quiet so as not to impact recruiting. I have no clue if the Bills considered any college HCs. They may have reached out via intermediaries and been rejected. They may also have been hesitant to go the college route again after Marrone. We may never know, but I'd like to think they have atleast explored the idea and it just hasn't leaked to the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Interesting take Kirby and I'm not saying you are wrong but do you think the offensive innovation in the college game is not linked at least in part to the lower defensive talent levels and the pretty vanilla defensive schemes? My take when I watch college football is that the offenses might be fun to watch and innovative and in some cases very good, but the standard of the defences is poor. I certainly believe defense is better coached and schemed at NFL level. I do agree with this. That is certainly a part of it and I probably should have specified offensive coaching. They just create space. It is certainly a combination of factors but it makes for a more exciting game IMO.Unless he has told everyone he is not leaving Duke, I really don't understand how he is not being looked at by most teams in search of a coach. The perfect fit for him is actually Atlanta, given his southern roots and qb in place there. Based on the situation, he would work here as any young, first time coach would have backlash from those who wanted Schwartz, especially Schwartz. Not to mention, the guy flat out knows how to manage game situations, just watch the Duke-ASU bowl game from last month....Duke is totally over matched from a talent perspective...he keeps his team in game, they take lead in final minutes, only to have kick return take away victory, then puts together a final drive and almost steals back. He knows how to manage the clock, when to punt, and to have Schwartz as (new title--associate head coach) defense, would allow him to concentrate on his side of the ball. Very well said and Cutcliffe is a genius. He has worked wonders with bad talent and when he had real talent (UT) he competed at the highest level. He's just a great coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Just kind of stemming off of this Brian Schottenheimer just left the Rams OC job to take the OC job at Georgia. It's a growing trend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 College coaches from Top 25 programs have always had better job security, more control over program and players and a stacked deck (i.e. no limitations of salary cap or one pick per round in the draft; recruit your way to whatever talent you can convince to come). The downsides historically were pay, prestige (vs. NFL), rigors of the recruiting cycle and nasty alumni. A couple of the downsides have been eliminated, i.e. pay and prestige vs. NFL. Pay is now comparable and in some cases better, but non Top 25 it's still worse. Prestige has taken significant jump with the amount of TV and the popularity spreading. I still think a lot of college coaches aspire to be NFL coaches to prove they can win at the pro level, but that attraction is significantly less now than in years past Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 College coaches from Top 25 programs have always had better job security, more control over program and players and a stacked deck (i.e. no limitations of salary cap or one pick per round in the draft; recruit your way to whatever talent you can convince to come). The downsides historically were pay, prestige (vs. NFL), rigors of the recruiting cycle and nasty alumni. A couple of the downsides have been eliminated, i.e. pay and prestige vs. NFL. Pay is now comparable and in some cases better, but non Top 25 it's still worse. Prestige has taken significant jump with the amount of TV and the popularity spreading. I still think a lot of college coaches aspire to be NFL coaches to prove they can win at the pro level, but that attraction is significantly less now than in years past Great thoughts as usual TX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Great thoughts as usual TXI also agree with your observations on the college game being the proving ground for new trends and the better source for new ideas than the NFL. A lot of that I believe stems from college HC's having so much control of the program as well as colleges having more "soft" games to try out things on their schedules without fearing a loss. It'll be interesting to see if that trend changes as the college game evolves with more $$, the playoffs, the shift of talent into the power 5 conferences etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I also agree with your observations on the college game being the proving ground for new trends and the better source for new ideas than the NFL. A lot of that I believe stems from college HC's having so much control of the program as well as colleges having more "soft" games to try out things on their schedules without fearing a loss. It'll be interesting to see if that trend changes as the college game evolves with more $$, the playoffs, the shift of talent into the power 5 conferences etc. That is really interesting as well!! The idea that you can experiment a little bit when your talent is so superior early in the year. That never really crossed my mind. The playoff will really narrow the talent imo. I don't think that you are going to see many of these Khalil Mack, Antonio Bryant type of talents being under recruited anymore. There is far too much at stake at these big universities and their budgets are very large. It will kind of be like the NFL draft of 25 years ago. There were guys found all over the draft. As scouting and technology has picked up not many guys slip through the cracks. There are less and less early round busts and less and less stars coming out of the 7th round or later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 That is really interesting as well!! The idea that you can experiment a little bit when your talent is so superior early in the year. That never really crossed my mind. The playoff will really narrow the talent imo. I don't think that you are going to see many of these Khalil Mack, Antonio Bryant type of talents being under recruited anymore. There is far too much at stake at these big universities and their budgets are very large. It will kind of be like the NFL draft of 25 years ago. There were guys found all over the draft. As scouting and technology has picked up not many guys slip through the cracks. There are less and less early round busts and less and less stars coming out of the 7th round or later. NFL draft comparison is a good one, just like the amount of knowledge NFL teams have on college players has exploded, the same goes for college programs and high school students. Technology has made the process of gathering information on recruits and analyzing it, so much easier and more efficient. Granted you'll still get the high school kid that blossoms in college while at a lower level program, but those will be fewer and fewer. The recent litigation from the Northwester students might also change the landscape, as Power 5 conferences, Notre Dame and a handful of others will be the only programs financially equipped to pay athletes. You could very well see a Power 5 + ND + 6 or so teams separating into a new division where athletes are compensated in some significant way. In that world, teams might not be permitted to play outside their division due to liability issues or legal concerns. Not sure how much of this will improve the game on the field, however. I know the game is better today than it was 10 years ago, but I'm not confident the changes I mention will continue that trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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