Joe B article on why we need to go SS and my response

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Mods, if you feel the need to merge this I will not be insulted!

http://www.wgr550.co...tentId=12795899

 

Joe,

 

I just read the article on adding Vaccaro in the draft. It was well written, very sound in logic and goes along with something I have been saying for a long time about the league and where I see it headed.

 

(...) Where we failed is the middle - KWilliams and MDareus - is that they got run all over. They are penetrating players who are good at beating their man. (...) Wanny's scheme had these guys way out of position/ability and that left the LB's to get mugged. A layman would think the problem was the LB's not realizing the problem was the scheme, the out of position players and the lack of suitable defenders in the backfield. LB is not the biggest need, to get back on subject.

 

The league now employs TE's to stretch seams, get outside the hashes and and move the old fashioned zone coverages. There is no way anyone in their right mind uses a FS to cover that TE. A SS is a must, and I thought Bryan Scott was that guy last year and think he could be that guy next year in Pettine's unique schemes using 3 Safeties. I do not know how good Searcy is going to be, I did not see enough of what I needed to last year and there is the possibility of AWilliams going to SS, too. However, I am done with trying to convert players to SS no matter how "natural" they may be - George Wilson was very good there a few years back but he got exposed last year in the most basic and natural parts of the SS game. That is why we need Vaccaro, that is why we need to make defense a priority. (..)

 

(...) It still comes back to why we need a real safety, an all purpose SS - as you pointed out, all the reasons. We do not need a guy who can lay the wood, a LaRon Landry type as much as we need someone who can shift on a dime and cut off down field runners should MDareus and KWilliams not bounce back. This is why we did not need to get a big FA linebacker, although I would like to take a look at Darryl Smith in a few weeks if he is still available. Our problem is not the LB's, we have a lot of options now. Our problem is not the CB's, but we could use one. Our problem is what happens in the middle and there are two glaring holes there - DT and SS. We have addressed the DT issue with Branch and we hope KWilliams and MDareus get back to 2011 form. That means SS is the biggest need on our defense - possibly a higher value then any other position.

 

Weeeellllllll....J, I respect your opinion, and I'm not quite sold. I readl JoeB's article, and his major point against drafting a LB high seemed to be ..well, let me quote:

• Pass Rusher - With the signing of Manny Lawson to a four-year contract, where does a versatile pass rusher fit in to this defense right away? Lawson, Mario Williams and Mark Anderson are already there. If you draft a guy like Dion Jordan or Jarvis Jones, that's the same role you just signed Lawson to do.
  

• Linebacker - First of all, who's to say they've given up on Kelvin Sheppard and Nigel Bradham yet? Sheppard is entering his third season, and Bradham showed flashes during his rookie season. They certainly aren't All-Pro players at this point, but you could do far worse. Secondly, is there someone worthy of the eigth overall pick that plays either middle or weakside linebacker? It doesn't appear so.
  

 

Maybe I don't follow JoeB's logic. Item: Lawson has never been known as much of a pass-rushing LB - 18 sacks in 7 seasons doesn't earn you that label and while he can pressure, he's been sent after the QB less and less the last few years. As far as I know, the Bills primary motive for signing him was as a solid run-stuffing LB. I hope Mark Anderson lights up the opposition like a pinball machine, and I hope Mario Williams turns into the Beast we hoped when he inked his contract, but I don't see the Bills as over-stocked at solid pass-rushing LB or LB who can drop into coverage.

 

Contemplate the Giants, where for the last 2 years Osi Umenyiora had been a backup. 'Nuff said.

 

I understand the point about the value of the SS, and that guy can't do it all, bless him. I seem to recall several big gainers on the Bills last year including a run that broke loose for a TD. I happened to see Coach's film on that play and it was very clear that Byrd was cheating up to where he thought the run would penetrate the line. Why? Good guess is he had no faith in the run stopping abilities of the LB ahead of him, for good reason. He guessed wrong and left a ginormous hole. If we want a stout run-stuffing D, we have to improve at LB, it seems to me. Yes, yes, you're absolutely right, the LB got mugged at times. At other times, they weren't mugged, they were burned. And frankly, doesn't a Mike need a bit more ability to disengage from a block and pursue the play than Shep has been showing us? I'm all for not giving up on Shep and Bradham yet. But neither am I up with

 

Now, I'm all in with relative value. If the Bills honestly think there's a dominant, game-changing league leading SS there at 8, and there just isn't a LB of comparable quality, draft the SS. I'm not a draft expert, I'm not a big college football fan, and I don't play one on the net. That seems to be the crux of Joe's argument though: that there isn't a Mike or Will LB worthy of the #8 pick. I can't debate that point. I'm not Bill from NYC and my head won't explode if we draft a SS.

 

That said, I do think both you and JoeB are under-estimating the need to strengthen the Bills LB corp. Joe B's "they haven't given up yet" and "you could do worse" are not very cogent arguments against a need to improve over Shep and Bradham at those positions.

[BillyBaroo]

I thought the article was really well-written and was very persuasive. I am just used to the old adage that a safety can be an aging cornerback who still has some pop. I just am always going to feel like #8 is way too soon for a safety.

 

Is it really true that there isn't a linebacker that would help us?

[#34fan]

I'd be happy with vaccaro at 8. I think he's a stud and paired with Byrd will a devastating safety duo. I believe he'd be phenomenal in coverage vs TEs, can lay the big lick and is sound vs the run. While I'd also be happy if we drafted a QB, LB or even OL, I just want to add great players. I think Vaccaro will be a great player, so I'm cool with it.

 

I see Vaccaro as one of those "meh" Strong safety prospects. He'll be OK, eventually. Perhaps as good as George Wilson when all is said and done. For me, however, he's just not physical enough. Doesn't play with enough attitude. I like the kid. But I like DJ SWEARINGER a WHOLE LOT BETTER. Swearinger is the best of Troy Polomalu and Ed Reed rolled into one. He flies to the ball, and hits like thunder. His ball instincts are prohibitive to any passing game.

 

If we take a strong safety, he should be first on the list. If things go as predicted, he should still be on the board in round 3. This kid would be an impact player from game one, and will help shore up our defensive backfield.

[RealityCheck]

Safety at #8 makes no sense. The front 7 needs to be addressed in that they don't have nearly enough pass rushers or run stuffers. If they go offense they need someone who can score points. Of all the oversized CBs in this draft and FA I would think that some of them can play safety adequately in a 3 safety set. At #8 I would prefer pass rush or offensive skill position.

[Gordio]

Alright, I am not saying Voccaro is a must. I realize the many hangups with him - UTexas being a big part of that - but I think that a safety needs to be snatched up early and one that is ready to start.

 

It is exactly right, though, everyone says offense wins in the NFL. But, like the pooch said, it is defense that loses games. 2012 was proof of that. Our defense lost 3 games flat out. Our coaching staff was the reason.

 

We need to field the 11 best players on both sides of the ball, and prior to the draft I am going to parlay my defensive series of threads back to an offensive series and then to the question of the best 22 players on this team. So, get ready for that. Open your mind that the best players on this team must be played regardless of position and that should mean two RB's on the field at all times. Yes, Fred Jackson as a fullback type and CJ as a HB type. If we find a good 3rd DE that means we find a way to put him on the field, too. Our success should not be predicated on basic schemes of the systems historically run by by this league. Teams are not doing this anymore. Look at everything SF did. Look at Seattles defense. Look at the Ravens offense, and take away 3 players on the Ravens and look how they used every drop of talent to find success.

 

Our 2013 season has no excuse. There is talent on this team, enough to make the playoffs. I had little hope for 2012, I knew the gel would not be set but before these guys age out of their own talent we need to stoke this up.

 

Screw your & Joe B's safety pick @ 8. Losing organizations pick safeties @ 8. So with that being said I am sure the bills will do it. Voccarro is not even that good. I would rather have the kid from USC or Elam & both of those guys could be around in the 2nd round.

[freester]

Screw your & Joe B's safety pick @ 8. Losing organizations pick safeties @ 8. So with that being said I am sure the bills will do it. Voccarro is not even that good. I would rather have the kid from USC or Elam & both of those guys could be around in the 2nd round.

 

I could not have said it better

[tennesseeboy]

I can see us tgrading back from 8 and perhaps taking Smith or, if not available, Nassib later in the first round and going for a SS or OLB in round 2. Lots of high quality OLB's and offensive linemen running around in rounds 2 and 3 so the extra pick we may get may be extremely valuable.