Give Spiller a break

[jumbalaya]

I'm not labeling him a bust. I'm just saying he hasn't proved anything yet. He is a nothing until he's a something.

Normal Bills high draft picks are either (a) a bust, (b) they get hurt and miss a lot of games or © turn into average players while better players at that position are drafted later in the same round. Looks like CJ will be a normal high draft pick for us unfortunately. He will either get hurt a lot or he will not live up to expected potential. Horrible to pick #9 and only get a return guy.

[bowery4]

Sorry i was too busy proving other people wrong as well. You haven't proven anything.

 

If we draft Luck, then we sit him for another year and learn under Fitz. It's A LOT harder for a QB to be successful in his rookie year than a running back. Just look at the success rate of rookie QBs to rookie RBs...But I guess you already knew that. What about Big Bent? Why shouldn't all QBs be held up to the same standards?

 

So you're just proving to me that you don't know what the hell you are talking about and that you have a personal thing against me for some stupid reason. Cool

Dude nothing personal, I kind of agree with you. Picking Spiller wasn't a big need but you can"t blame him for it. And I do think that picking BPA IS how good teams are built. I really don't like the way drafts in the past for this team have gone and it seems many times we picked for need instead of BPA.

 

[akm0404]

You need to learn some reading comprehension buddy. I said Freddy is an elite RB in terms of pass-blocking.

 

Oh sweet. That's like saying we have the best quarterback in terms of hobo-bearding or that the Bills are the best team in the NFL in terms of home-game-selling.

 

Wish we had an elite running back in terms of rush-yard-gaining or touchdown-scoring.

[McBeane]

Oh sweet. That's like saying we have the best quarterback in terms of hobo-bearding or that the Bills are the best team in the NFL in terms of home-game-selling.

 

Wish we had an elite running back in terms of rush-yard-gaining or touchdown-scoring.

 

I hope you don't really believe what you just said. If you think that pass-protection from the RB position is important than you clearly don't understand the first thing about football.

[DreReed83]

Seriously? Every rookie has to become a starter and be a big playmaker their first year or else they are a bust. Really now? No patience at all? Bruce didn't blow people up his first year, Brees didn't either, Peyton Manning had a bad year as well. Akm you are better than this. Seriously? You don't expect a legit response more than I have given for sure right? Come on now. Let's see a more level headed post by you Akm. I know u have it in you.

 

oh wait, u are just being sarcastic right? that must be it.

 

No. ANY RB that comes in as a rookie who was drafted in the top 10 SHOULD produce. At least show something. At least see the field. DO SOMETHING. Bruce Smith had 6.5 sacks his rookie year which is GREAT for a rookie DE. That showed something. QB's are different because it's just a harder position to grasp. RB, its easier to get adjusted to, since its mostly instinct. To QB, you have to learn so much more.

 

Dont compare a RB rookie to a QB rookie. It takes longer to develop a QB. And if your rookie QB develops quickly, then you got yourself something special.

 

People need to stop comparing a rookie RB to rookie QB. QB has so much more responsibilities than a RB. A RB needs to read the hole, and react to it, and read the blitz and pick it up. A QB has to worry about where his 10 players are on the field AT ALL TIMES AND worry about where all 11 players are on the other side. He's responsible for EVERYTHING on the field. So I don't want to hear another person compare a rookie QB to a rookie RB again. Please.

 

Hey Bowery. You afraid I'm gonna quote you and make you look bad? Well I'm calling you out anyways.

 

Big Ben didnt start immediately and only started because Mark Maddux got injured. How hard is it to play for a team with the number 1 defense and the number 2 rush offense in the league. That takes A LOT of pressure off a young QB. Same thing with the Jets last year. Number 1 defense and number 1 rush offense. See the pattern? Number 1 defenses and number 1 rushing offense to help the QB? Do you think that Roeth and Sanchez won the games their rookie years? NO... Roethlisbergers numbers werent that great his first 2 years. VERY conservative. 17 TDs and 13 turnovers. Its not like took the league by storm.

 

Teams that draft for need and within a system are teams that will succeed. Teams like the Ravens, Patriots, Eagles, will always draft for need and draft smart. Smart drafters build successful teams. BTW Spiller wasn't the "best player available." If we took BPA, we wouldve drafted Dez Bryant.

Edited December 10, 2010 by DreReed83

[akm0404]

I hope you don't really believe what you just said. If you think that pass-protection from the RB position is important than you clearly don't understand the first thing about football.

 

 

And if you really believe that how good a running back is at pass blocking is even a FRACTION as important as how good they are at say, actually running with the football and scoring touchdowns, you are delusional.

[CodeMonkey]

I hope you don't really believe what you just said. If you think that pass-protection from the RB position is important than you clearly don't understand the first thing about football.

So a RB being able to pick up a blitzing LB and keeping your QB alive and healthy is not important?

Damn dude, I'm glad I'm not playing QB on a team you are coaching.

Edited December 10, 2010 by CodeMonkey

[McBeane]

So a RB being able to pick up a blitzing LB and keeping your QB alive and healthy is not important?

Damn dude, I'm glad I'm not playing QB on a team you are coaching.

 

No I mistyped. I meant to say isn't, not is, and can't edit it right now.

 

I'm on the same boat as you, trying to prove to these fools that pass protection from an RB is very important.

[CodeMonkey]

No I mistyped. I meant to say isn't, not is, and can't edit it right now.

 

I'm on the same boat as you, trying to prove to these fools that pass protection from an RB is very important.

Ahhh OK.

[DreReed83]

No I mistyped. I meant to say isn't, not is, and can't edit it right now.

 

I'm on the same boat as you, trying to prove to these fools that pass protection from an RB is very important.

 

Yup...pass protecting is more important than gaining yds and running with the ball.BTW. Spiller does neither well.

 

I'm still waiting for those stats that show that Fred is "ELITE" among RB in terms of pass blocking.

[akm0404]

So you guys really think that, for an NFL running back, the ability to successfully gain yardage on rushing attempts and score rushing touchdowns is ANCILLARY to being able to block?

[CodeMonkey]

So you guys really think that, for an NFL running back, the ability to successfully gain yardage on rushing attempts and score rushing touchdowns is ANCILLARY to being able to block?

In my opinion a starting NFL running back needs to be able to:

1) Gain yards without holes being made by the O-Line that you could drive a truck through

2) Catch passes including running good routes

3) Block on passing plays

 

I consider 1 and 2 of equal importance with 3 just slightly behind (but still very important).

Scoring touchdowns is irrelevant as it is just yardage where you happen to be near the goal line.

 

Regarding Spiller so far in his NFL career, I don't think he has shown consistent ability for any of the 3.

Edited December 10, 2010 by CodeMonkey

[Packerland Bills Fan]

Look at what Spiller did in college. If he never amounts to anything, then maybe the Bills should just trade all their picks away for veteran players and not draft anyone anymore.

 

The thing the Bills needed to do after the Spiller pick was upgrade the OT position with someone like Bulaga or Safford. Troup can't beat out Williams at NT. Carrington may or may not start one day. Trading those two picks and getting back into round 1 to take an OT was what they should have done.

Edited December 10, 2010 by Flatlander

[akm0404]

Wow. I'm shocked at what people here think the role of an NFL running back is. Running the ball and catching passes are of equal importance? Blocking as important or just slightly less important?! Scoring touchdowns irrelevant?!

 

*head explode*

[Koufax]

The thing the Bills needed to do after the Spiller pick was upgrade the OT position with someone like Bulaga or Safford. Troup can't beat out Williams at NT. Carrington may or may not start one day. Trading those two picks and getting back into round 1 to take an OT was what they should have done.

 

Not beating out Kyle Williams is not an insult to anybody the way he has been playing. Carrington sure has looked like he has a lot of upside now that he has gotten on the field. I think Troup and Carrington will be good players for us, but that is more hope and faith in Nix than any real evidence. But trading up for a tackle reminds me too much of the McCargo situation. As well as Safford has played, I just don't think giving up two good players for one makes enough sense unless you are really convinced that the guy is worth it. I would rather make two good picks to help our team than reach for one.

 

If you are basing it off of 2010, I think Bell has been good enough compared to Bulaga/Saffold to make taking two high picks on our front 7 away not such a good idea. If you are basing it on 2010-2015 like I think picks should be judged, it is much too soon to know, but I would rather have two good football players than one, so a 2 for 1 trade for a team with a shallow roster like ours better be a home run and not a McCargo.

[CodeMonkey]

Wow. I'm shocked at what people here think the role of an NFL running back is. Running the ball and catching passes are of equal importance? Blocking as important or just slightly less important?! Scoring touchdowns irrelevant?!

 

*head explode*

This isn't college where all a RB has to do is run. This is the next level.

There are plenty of college backs that can run very well and that's all. They generally won't amount to **** in the NFL. They certainly will not end up as elite backs.

 

For touchdowns, say one back runs the ball the first 99 yards and someone else comes in and gets that last yard and the touchdown. Both backs are of equal value to you? At the end of the day one got 99 yards and the other got 1. The latter just happened to end up in the end zone.

Edited December 10, 2010 by CodeMonkey

[DreReed83]

Look at what Spiller did in college. If he never amounts to anything, then maybe the Bills should just trade all their picks away for veteran players and not draft anyone anymore.

 

The thing the Bills needed to do after the Spiller pick was upgrade the OT position with someone like Bulaga or Safford. Troup can't beat out Williams at NT. Carrington may or may not start one day. Trading those two picks and getting back into round 1 to take an OT was what they should have done.

 

College is college. Doesn't always translate to what they do in the pros. Colt Brennan, Danny Weurffel, Gino Torretta, Timmy Chang, Desmond Howard, Ron Dayne, Rashaan Salaam, Andre Ware, Ki Jana Carter, Tyrone Wheatley, Napolean Kaufman, Garrison Hearst come to mind who were successful and productive college players who never succeeded in the NFL. So I really REALLY don't give a rats azz about what he accomplished in college.

 

This isn't college where all a RB has to do is run. This is the next level.

There are plenty of college backs that can run very well and that's all. They generally won't amount to **** in the NFL. They certainly will not end up as elite backs.

 

For touchdowns, say one back runs the ball the first 99 yards and someone else comes in and gets that last yard and the touchdown. Both backs are of equal value to you? At the end of the day one got 99 yards and the other got 1. The latter just happened to end up in the end zone.

 

Pass blocking IS important. NOBODY is denying that. But it's not more important than running the ball and scoring TDs. REGARDLESS...Spiller hasnt shown the ability to block well, run the ball and catch well either.

[akm0404]

Seriously, its a nice luxury when your RB is able to excel in pass blocking. But really, to say that their ability to block is as important as their ability to RUN THE BALL and SCORE THE TOUCHDOWNS is absurd.

[starrymessenger]

No. ANY RB that comes in as a rookie who was drafted in the top 10 SHOULD produce. At least show something. At least see the field. DO SOMETHING. Bruce Smith had 6.5 sacks his rookie year which is GREAT for a rookie DE. That showed something. QB's are different because it's just a harder position to grasp. RB, its easier to get adjusted to, since its mostly instinct. To QB, you have to learn so much more.

 

Dont compare a RB rookie to a QB rookie. It takes longer to develop a QB. And if your rookie QB develops quickly, then you got yourself something special.

 

People need to stop comparing a rookie RB to rookie QB. QB has so much more responsibilities than a RB. A RB needs to read the hole, and react to it, and read the blitz and pick it up. A QB has to worry about where his 10 players are on the field AT ALL TIMES AND worry about where all 11 players are on the other side. He's responsible for EVERYTHING on the field. So I don't want to hear another person compare a rookie QB to a rookie RB again. Please.

 

Hey Bowery. You afraid I'm gonna quote you and make you look bad? Well I'm calling you out anyways.

 

Big Ben didnt start immediately and only started because Mark Maddux got injured. How hard is it to play for a team with the number 1 defense and the number 2 rush offense in the league. That takes A LOT of pressure off a young QB. Same thing with the Jets last year. Number 1 defense and number 1 rush offense. See the pattern? Number 1 defenses and number 1 rushing offense to help the QB? Do you think that Roeth and Sanchez won the games their rookie years? NO... Roethlisbergers numbers werent that great his first 2 years. VERY conservative. 17 TDs and 13 turnovers. Its not like took the league by storm.

 

Teams that draft for need and within a system are teams that will succeed. Teams like the Ravens, Patriots, Eagles, will always draft for need and draft smart. Smart drafters build successful teams. BTW Spiller wasn't the "best player available." If we took BPA, we wouldve drafted Dez Bryant.

Cant agree more with your comment re Dez Bryant. What a playmaker. To think that people questioned his fitness at the combine. What a joke.

[akm0404]

But can Dez Bryant block linebackers? That's what is truly important here. Touchdowns are for losers.