A Cry For Honesty in Discussing Bills Players

[Meathead]

he resorts to objectifying women as nothing more than their sum physical beauty, rated on a quantitative scale for our convenience.

what else is there

[I hate the Bills !]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

WR: It was a huge mistake to sign Lee Evans to a long-term deal. He is fast and has good hands; otherwise, he has been a huge disappointment the last five years. Roscoe Parrish is fun to watch but will never be more than a #3. The other WR's are feel good stories, but there is less than a 10% chance that any of the receivers (including the beloved Steve Johnson) are going to be legitimate #1 or #2 starters in this league.

 

LT: It is nice that Bell is related to Karl Malone, and we all wish he had his dad's talent, but Bell is not Peters (so as much as it hurts) we won't catch lightning in a bottle twice and have a TE become converted to a solid LT. We have no viable LT or LT prospect on our roster. And, for those that say Wang is a legitimate LT, I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?" Be honest...Wang, Meredith, Bell, and the other guys are not real LT's.

 

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina (when the team was a little better). He really isn't a starter but the o-line is so bad that he occasionally looks serviceable. The truth is he is nothing more than a backup. It's like holding onto a girlfriend that is a "6" hoping she'll become a "7" but the truth is...she doesn't have it in her...and you know (deep down inside that you honestly haven't had anything better than a "6" and won't...so you are stuck with her.

 

RT: Cornell Green sucks...He's old and useless, but he probably is the Bills second or third best tackle on the team.

 

TE: The Bills haven't had a legitimate TE in about 10-12 years. Nelson is fast but he'll never be a good blocker (a desperate need with a terrible o-line), and Stupar and other TE's are just waiver-wire guys that good franchises didn't have room for.

 

NT: We love Kyle Williams because he is a hardworking, overachieving, white guy who is a blue collar player. He was picked in the latter rounds, and his motor is consistent. He's gritty. He's a solid rotational guy, but he isn't ever going to be a solid NT. He's much better as a DE in a 4-3.

 

DE: Edwards and Stroud are solid backups but they aren't particularly good at anything anymore (other than leadership or nice guy personalities)

 

LB's: Some people are still delusional thinking Kelsay is worthwhile. Note: If you think Kelsay is a good player (you should be banned from this board for the season). Again, we like him because he has "stuck with the team, is a captain, a nice guy, and is "gritty." Poz is okay but is nothing more than what he is...an injury prone reach LB that we all hoped was Shane Conlan 2.0. Davis was a nice pickup because we can't get anyone. The rest of the LB's really are nothing more than backups. Maybin is what he is...Yes...he is fast...but we hate to admit it inside, but he is....__________________ (something with the words bust...useless....one dimensional are appropriate)

 

 

So deep down....keep in mind that the Bills really are what you know they are rather than what you hope they are.... So, if that is true (and it is), please stop with the Brian Brohm or Ryan Fitzpatrick chants...And, yes...Chan Gailey is an upgrade over Jauron and Nix is an upgrade over (whoever that marketing guy pretending to know football guy is).

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

 

Ok I agree with about 90-95 % of what you said ! Until the Bills do what you posted and what every Bills fans knows The Bills are nothing more than a JV team !

[xsoldier54]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

WR: It was a huge mistake to sign Lee Evans to a long-term deal. He is fast and has good hands; otherwise, he has been a huge disappointment the last five years. Roscoe Parrish is fun to watch but will never be more than a #3. The other WR's are feel good stories, but there is less than a 10% chance that any of the receivers (including the beloved Steve Johnson) are going to be legitimate #1 or #2 starters in this league.

 

LT: It is nice that Bell is related to Karl Malone, and we all wish he had his dad's talent, but Bell is not Peters (so as much as it hurts) we won't catch lightning in a bottle twice and have a TE become converted to a solid LT. We have no viable LT or LT prospect on our roster. And, for those that say Wang is a legitimate LT, I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?" Be honest...Wang, Meredith, Bell, and the other guys are not real LT's.

 

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina (when the team was a little better). He really isn't a starter but the o-line is so bad that he occasionally looks serviceable. The truth is he is nothing more than a backup. It's like holding onto a girlfriend that is a "6" hoping she'll become a "7" but the truth is...she doesn't have it in her...and you know (deep down inside that you honestly haven't had anything better than a "6" and won't...so you are stuck with her.

 

RT: Cornell Green sucks...He's old and useless, but he probably is the Bills second or third best tackle on the team.

 

TE: The Bills haven't had a legitimate TE in about 10-12 years. Nelson is fast but he'll never be a good blocker (a desperate need with a terrible o-line), and Stupar and other TE's are just waiver-wire guys that good franchises didn't have room for.

 

NT: We love Kyle Williams because he is a hardworking, overachieving, white guy who is a blue collar player. He was picked in the latter rounds, and his motor is consistent. He's gritty. He's a solid rotational guy, but he isn't ever going to be a solid NT. He's much better as a DE in a 4-3.

 

DE: Edwards and Stroud are solid backups but they aren't particularly good at anything anymore (other than leadership or nice guy personalities)

 

LB's: Some people are still delusional thinking Kelsay is worthwhile. Note: If you think Kelsay is a good player (you should be banned from this board for the season). Again, we like him because he has "stuck with the team, is a captain, a nice guy, and is "gritty." Poz is okay but is nothing more than what he is...an injury prone reach LB that we all hoped was Shane Conlan 2.0. Davis was a nice pickup because we can't get anyone. The rest of the LB's really are nothing more than backups. Maybin is what he is...Yes...he is fast...but we hate to admit it inside, but he is....__________________ (something with the words bust...useless....one dimensional are appropriate)

 

 

So deep down....keep in mind that the Bills really are what you know they are rather than what you hope they are.... So, if that is true (and it is), please stop with the Brian Brohm or Ryan Fitzpatrick chants...And, yes...Chan Gailey is an upgrade over Jauron and Nix is an upgrade over (whoever that marketing guy pretending to know football guy is).

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

Wow. Pretty impressed with our own opinion, arent' we? While some of the things that you state are probable true, please keep in mind that your opinions are not facts. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but facts have to be proven. Stating that someone is no good simply has no merit, because there are no facts to back it up. So while I respect your opinions, they are worth no more than my own or those of anyone else on this board. Your opinion is not necessarily the truth, it's only your personal view.

[FlutieFlake]

The thing that makes it easiest to downplay racism is when claims of it are made inappropriately. There might be merit to this topic (I'll leave that alone), but the examples of fans animosity toward Jason Peters and Marshawn Lynch destroy this point. On-field complaints about the two players seem small compared to other players of their timeframe (Kelsay, Whitner, Ellison, Pozluzny, Green, and Hangartner to name a few).

 

The origin of dislike for these two people is based around a conflict of values. A person with a perceived high standard of character doesn't like the idea of a player sitting out practice and preseason over complaints of what they view as extremely high salaries to try to earn more money, only to come back before serious income penalties incur as the season starts and games are missed (damaging the team more than their bank account). Likewise, multiple scuffles with behavior issues that have legal ramifications can understandably lower a fan's esteem of a person.

 

 

You mean like running people over with your SUV and leaving them laying in the street? You call that "a conflict of values"?

 

Wow. Pretty impressed with our own opinion, arent' we? While some of the things that you state are probable true, please keep in mind that your opinions are not facts. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but facts have to be proven. Stating that someone is no good simply has no merit, because there are no facts to back it up. So while I respect your opinions, they are worth no more than my own or those of anyone else on this board. Your opinion is not necessarily the truth, it's only your personal view.

 

 

So Cornell Green doesn't suck??? I haven't seen too many people defending this putrid excuse for a player...

[The Dean]

 

So Cornell Green doesn't suck??? I haven't seen too many people defending this putrid excuse for a player...

 

 

I think most of us agree Green is a sub-standard player. Xsoldier never suggested otherwise.

 

But there is a distinction between fact and opinion. The OP seems to think his opinions = fact.

[Wizard]

Ok I agree with about 90-95 % of what you said ! Until the Bills do what you posted and what every Bills fans knows The Bills are nothing more than a JV team !

 

Exactly...common sense...somehow some people get so caught up in being "Homers" (and there is nothing wrong with being passionate about your team), but I'm amazed at irrationality and a lack of honesty in the facts about this team. Many replies seem to support that thought. Until then, I will keep being a fan, but I will accept the Bills as a JV football team in the NFL.

 

Wow. Pretty impressed with our own opinion, arent' we? While some of the things that you state are probable true, please keep in mind that your opinions are not facts. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but facts have to be proven. Stating that someone is no good simply has no merit, because there are no facts to back it up. So while I respect your opinions, they are worth no more than my own or those of anyone else on this board. Your opinion is not necessarily the truth, it's only your personal view.

[/quote

 

Which war?

[dayman]

Wizzard you say if we think Kelsay is "worthwhile" we should be banned yet you say Poz is "ok?"

 

You have no credibility...although most of what you said I agreed with haha.

 

For real though I think you are too hard on Kelsay, too hard on Bell, and off the mark on Hangartner. Everything else seems to be about right. The Evans part was refreshing to hear someone else say.

 

But the bottom line is we don't NEED a replacement (and a really good one at that haha) at everyone of those and we won't be able to get it. Just most of them.

Edited September 30, 2010 by dayman