BillsVet
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Manny Lawson played well for SF this season at OLB this year in a PT role. Mario Williams not so much for Houston in that he didn't register a sack his final 8 games.
McCargo's foot injury concerns me. It's the same one he broke in college and subsequently missed a season.
I know they want a rotation of DT's, but without him playing good football, Larry Tripplett's going to be in the same position this year as he was last, fighting off multiple blockers while the 1-Tech guy gets engulfed too. I know that despite the Cover-2, both Triplett and McCargo were featured together for a short time. Kyle Williams can't be counted on for more than depth.
We're depending on McCargo more than I think the front office ever wanted to at this point in his career. DT is a big question mark.
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Chris Brown sounds like a rational choice. Then again, this team goes against the grain quite often. I like the Michael Bush pick if he's physically ready. Marv has a history with backs that other teams pass over in the first and early second rounds. That guy is going to the Hall of Fame this season.
Who knows if Chris Brown can carry the load for 20+ a game. If he does and stays healthy, I could stand to live with Anthony Thomas at the right price.
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Swinging the deal for McGahee with Baltimore was a solid move. In the long run it has excellent potential to be the better side of the deal. Of course much of that is how Buffalo chooses to use those picks.
As for #3, I think they simply had no one on the roster worthy of being a starting CB outside of McGee last season. Marv knew this and decided paying NC the money was ok for one season. Beyond that was out of the question. Call it ethics, call it whatever, but I think they needed something to depend on in 06 for their secondary. The franchise tag provided the answer.
Marv certainly should not be outside of criticism for just being Marv and the GM of this football team. They've made some good moves and some bad ones. I think he knew this team would not get turned around in one year or even two.
At this point I'm done predicting what they'll do next. They do not disappoint if you're looking for the surprise factor.
Not sure if they still go RB in RD 1. DJ is a big defense proponent and that, IMO, carries a lot of weight with Marv. Last year's draft was an early indication of that. I just hope they don't fall in love with a player again and lose sight of the big picture. We can't afford to have a bad draft.
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They're all smoking what Jamal Lewis was selling a few years back.
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First, Is Jim Overdorf the GM? I keep hearing this guys name about everything the GM should be doing.
Second, yeah, it is March 8, but getting a RB sooner rather than later is imperative. We're running out of options. You might find one in the draft, sure, but I'd like to have someone on my roster who has some starting NFL experience earlier than mini-camp. Now, that doesn't mean we get someone who's aging, but someone who can handle 20 carries per game. Keep waiting and the options dwindle. Fraud Williams and Levy's college boy Jackson aren't the answers.
I think drafting a RB in round 1 or 2 takes away from drafting defense too much. And we all know this board has pointed out in several threads how weak the defense looks on paper.
Besides, everyone knows how keen Marv is on starting rookies.
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I didn't mention DBs anywhere in my post, I'm strictly speaking of how the Bills have used their picks in the past 5 drafts. I guess you LIKE using multiple first round picks on RBs & QBs within a 5 year span? That being said you could include DBs as well. Good teams are usually built from the inside out. Drafting "skill" positions year after year with your first round picks get you where the Lions and Cardinals are. A lot of talent...and very few victories.
Have we not learned anything from the TD debacle? If there are priorities on a football team, it's the DL and OL. Marv and DJ chose to improve the OL to give the rest of the O a chance to score some points and have a ball control offense. We've had two coaches before DJ that said they were going to be a ball control offense, and only now in 2007 are we putting our money where our mouth is.
That said, having a durable RB along with someone serviceable below him on the depth chart is something I'm sure Marv and DJ will address. If they see something in Chris Brown then fine. I'd still like them to pay him what he's worth and not give him a Peerless or Josh Reed deal that is much more than anyone else would have dared.
It might be sexy to have a name brand back. But I'd rather have a strong OL with an average back than a bad line and an above average back. RB's are plentiful in the NFL. Quality OLineman aren't. DJ talked about using the draft for defense again this year. So I guess that means we're going RB or something. It's gonna be fun speculating until draft day.
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My respect for Len Pasquarelli just went down a notch. Saying Tim Anderson is like that remains far from what Bills fans saw this season. Perhaps Lenny is describing him as more of a 3-4 guy or something because he certainly didn't live up to even that modest description. Solid? Surely not Tim Anderson.
D.J. Hackett would be nice, but that price for a 2nd is something we don't have the luxury of giving up. Still, I don't think Seattle would let him go. As much as I'd like someone better than Peerless or Josh Reed, we've got to stockpile picks to make this team work.
Admittedly, I've never heard of Chillar, but he sounds ideal. Now, let's see who Marv referred to when he cited the 1 or 2 RFA's they were interested in. This season they got it right by getting the better UFA's in here first and then they'll hopefully pursue the RFA's.
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I hope all this Turner talk didn't originate from the Bob Matthews article in the Democrat and Chronicle. I'm not sold on his perspective or wisdom concerning Bills matters. There's no source outside of him that I've seen other than message board stuff. Not saying I wouldn't be unhappy with it, but at which price?
It'd be great to get Turner, but a 2nd is about all I'd offer. If Alexander a few years ago didn't get much more than that, why does Turner merit a 1st and/or a 3rd?
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I think Marv has been pretty clear that you shouldn't expect much from rookies. He rarely played his rooks as a coach and had there not been the injuries we had this season, I don't think they'd have played much this past year. Of course, in the era of free agency and players changing teams so frequently, rookies have been asked to play more. It may develop them faster, but there's a price to pay in that they'll make more mistakes. I don't care if you play at the big schools in college, there's nothing that can adequately simulate the NFL.
That said, I think the front office had their gameplan and didn't let go of the guys who came here. That's a good sign that players have a good feel that the staff in Buffalo are good people.
Picking up guys like Ballard, John Davis, et al, that was a few lifetimes ago in NFL history. Each year new amazing things happen in free agency. Staying ahead of the trends is where teams win and lose. Everyone said NE wouldn't do much in free agency, but they've done something and upped the ante. I like the fact we strengthened our weakest part of the team. It shows they're a little ahead of teams in that department. I'll take a strong OL before anything on a football team.
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Two words:
CEDRIC BENSON
Former #4 overall. Bears don't need another RB.
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Here's the simpler answer:
We don't need a RB. So we only give up Willis McGahee if we can get better by doing it (not going to happen), and not because Marv doesn't like him.
Willis will be a very good Bill this year, and we will have to get a new RB next spring for the 2008 season.
Willis should be at least satisfied that he'll have hopefully one the best left sides in the NFL to run behind. If anything, this could make him look better than he really is and increase his stock when the 2008 FA period begins.
Marv is not the type who would get rid of the starter and have someone like A Train as the starter. He knows better, hopefully.
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I know Turner is not as proven a starter, but he'd be a great fit in Buffalo. 5'10" 235 with great burst and power. Still, I think it's a pipe dream that we acquire him. I know Willis isn't the front office's chosen one, but RB's are more plentiful, whether in the draft or Free Agency. I still don't think SD gives us Turner for McGahee. It's makes little sense to have McGahee paired with LT. It's to pursue a RB at this point. I just think the braintrust looks to the defensive side of the ball and makes McGahee earn his rep this season.
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I know you want to trade down...but what if we can't? Why can't we consider all positions at #12?
Okay, so who IS the 1-technique answer? Who are we locked into so much that we can't consider other positions, like OL, WR, DE, etc.?
Again, who is so much better? As I said, I do realize you want to trade down, probably to the range where we'd be able to draft the crazy name from Penn State or Timmons...but if we can't trade down and are drafting from 12th, again, who are we so in love with that we must make a pick at this position and can't look at the entire draft board?
Right. It doesn't really make sense for a Tampa 2 team to draft a CB 12th overall anyway...but even if we did, that draft pick wouldn't be any more of a sure thing than Youboty is. You realize this, and yet you still think we must pick from one of these positions in the 1st?
On the contrary to what you stated, I don't think there's any reason why we can't pick the best player available. If we get a hard-on for Jarrett, Lynch, Anderson, Brown, or anybody else...and really think one of these guys is the type of player that will make an impact in the NFL...why can't we draft them?
Can't defense be the priority without being the 1st rounder? If we drafted offense in the 1st and defense in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th and 7th...what would you say our draft emphasized?
The strength of the Cover-2 is up the middle. Getting middle of the road players to play DT, MLB, and S is like chasing your tail. You'll never get what you're after. Chicago had Harris and Johnson at the DT spots and Urlacher being the beneficiary, though a bonafide playmaker. Ian Scott isn't the answer. Marv knows being able to run and stopping the run are absolutely necessary to win. And I believe we've already addressed the OL. As for WR, Price and Reed both have decent size deals. Don't think Marv does much beyond a 4th round or below pick at WR. Keep in mind, DJ had about 4 30+ point games in Chicago during his 5 seasons there. He's a defense first coach. Last season's draft I'm sure he had a great deal of input and curried a lot of favor with Marv.
Okoye seems to be what the Bills need. That's my admittedly non-NFL personel guy opinion. If he's gone, well there's more DT's available later. The answer at the 1 technique is someone who can hold blockers down while the 3 penetrates. Guys like Anderson either weren't strong or big enough to do that. Larry Tripplett wasn't freed up enough to make stops and opposing running backs ran wild. I don't like the options available in FA.
At 12, should we not be able to trade down, there are a host of options. I think there are some talented CB's out there, but we'd be telling Youboty he's persona non grata. Posluzsny and Timmons are options. Jon Beason in Round 2 might be there. There are some good LB's in the 2007 draft.
I don't have my heart set on one guy. I do indeed look at the entire draft board. Zeroing in on one guy, if last year was an indication, is not the correct move. You can't let emotion and lust for a player get in the way of making a rational decision. The Bills front office has backup plans should one of their guys get selected.
Spikes may have experience, and the Cover-2 demands people get into the right spots. But at which point does Spikes slower play become a disadvantage? The SLB doesn't need the speed like the WLB, sure, but you've got to get to the ball carrier too. Spikes was invisible in many games last season. And saying he wasn't in on 3rd down situations isn't an excuse there. Is his cap hit worth it? I don't think so. Just my opinion.
I think CB must receive another pick at some point because we've got very few on the current roster. Beyond McGee, Youboty, the recently signed Jabari Greer, what else do we have. Free Agency is a few days old, but that's not much to go on. Still, I'd leave it until Round 3 or below. Perhaps pick up a player who can bridge the gap until hopefully Youboty can start.
The fact remains your first round pick, unless he's a QB, should be someone who is capable of starting their first season. Not sitting the bench, or coming in on certain plays. I don't advocate best player available because what if Quinn is there at 12. Do you take him even though he could make an impact next season? No, because you've got your starting QB. You draft need, and if need isn't worth it at your pick, you find a trade to your liking. But you're always considering who's out there as well.
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I went to two Bills games this season and one was the SD game. Sitting in Section 123, I saw LT break through the line and up the SD sideline past Ko Simpson for a 51 yard scamper. And you know who was blocking on that play? Kris Dielman. It's scary that SD has retained so many players through 2009. Despite their coaching changes I believe they'll be around for awhile and not register one season followed by a few bad ones.
Dielman staying is a good sign that decent guys are still around. The Seahawks are a far cry from where the Chargers are. They couldn't keep Hutchinson (sure the poison pill contract) but Walter Jones is getting old, Alexander is two years removed from his MVP season, and Darrell Jackson is being shopped publicly. Not good for business when another premier player turns you down.
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Why on earth are we arguing about who is better? Dielman is good. So is Dockery. I think Dielman chose to stay with SD because they're top to bottom a better team than Seattle. And Seattle got a visit but a brief one. So what.
Some of the posts looked more like ultimatums and not simple questions. What is this, a trial?
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Spanish Inquisition...very nice. The next post, well I'll ignore that. Not really funny.
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I don't see Ian Scott as the 1-technique answer, no matter how cheap he is. His play wasn't stellar in Chicago last season. K.Thomas is strictly a nickel back IMO. Sure, they're on the cheap, but are these guys answers to the problems at hand? Probably not.
Saying Spikes was at full strength for one play is non-sense. Sorry to be negative, but he was not 100% the whole season. Not even sure he'll ever be the old Takeo again. That said, shopping him does not bode well for his status with the Bills. I'm sure that didn't go over well in the Spikes household.
As for Kyle Williams, I'm not sure he has much upside left. This is a guy who already benched 545 in college or something. Adding strength is easier said than done. I'm not convinced he's more than a good backup.
And no one said any CB in Round 1 will compare to NC. That's preposterous to think we'd find a guy who could step in and perform at his level. Youboty is basically a rookie, having played so little. Expectations for him shouldn't be much more than for a 2007 draft pick. He's the wild card in all this, his off-season performance might enable Buffalo to go elsewhere in the draft.
I don't think Levi Brown is going to be called by Goodell on 28 April. If they're going anything but DT, LB, or CB in round 1, then DJ was blowing smoke when he said defense would be the priority in the draft.
No, Free Agency isn't over...but moves among NFL teams are slowing down. And I don't think Buffalo will be after the marquee types the rest of the way
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Losing Fletcher is a much tougher hole to fill for the Bills than losing Clements. Folks are often confused on this point because Clements is obviously a much better player all things being equal than F-B is. The issue though is that the hybrid Cover 2 we run demands so much more of the MLB (who must both tackle like a DT on running plays and play the pass like a safety) meanwhile in the Cover 2 the way we run it tbe CB does not have to run with the WR but release him to the safeties or MLB after 12-15 yards.
Part of the reason why Marv correctly was willing to guarantee to Clements he would not tag him this off-season was that there was simply no way we would rationally commit so much of our cap room to a CB
While I think everyone knew without the F-Tag this year that NC would cash in, how would Marv have known he'd have to devote so much of the cap to one CB? Free Agency changes every year. You started to see that last season when guards got into the higb forty millions for contracts. It continued this year, and 3 guys got it. Fact is, free agency is something you cannot predict. Marv did not know what would happen in March 07 back in July 06. Don't give him that much credit.
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Fine. So will you get hysterical along with me if he picks Hall at 12 and doesn't trade down?
I would understand the need, but not the priority of the pick. The Cover-2 gets beat with your opponent running the ball down your throat. Now, Hall would fit with the type of zone coverage scheme they employ, but I'm more concerned about the run defense than the pass at this point. That said, neither really makes me want to jump for joy.
If Hall goes 12, or another CB for that matter, I'd be slightly disappointed. And I'd wonder what would happen to Youboty, whom I'm told is going to be good. What does that say about him?
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I've already seen a mock with Houston going at 12 to Buffalo. I guess we'll have to wait until Mayock makes his second to last or last mock in April. And then we'll know which surprise pick will happen.
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Me too. You're absolutely right. I meant to type Tank Tyler but not at 12.
That depends on who else is on the board at that time. It also depends on what happens through the rest of the FA period. IF we waltz into The Draft without having addressed the LB, CB, DT needs, Marv will be forced to address them there - again putting us in a bind because the best available athlete will probably go by the wayside. I could see Marv picking Ginn if he's there at 12. We need a good #2 receiver.
I absolutely disagree with you on not having the luxury or liberty to draft the best available athlete.
That's why we've been on the trash heap for so long. I'll agree with you that no LB this year is worthy of the 12th pick and certainly not Willis. Lawrence Timmons is ranked a lot higher than Willis on most boards. But there seems to be a love fest brewing here for him.
Back to the point of the original post I think Okoye has so much upside potential that I for one would not hesitate to pick him if he were there at 12. If it becomes a log jam at 1 Technique DT, then trade McCargo to the Jints. They're the ones that coveted him last year.
If Ginn is there at 12, I should have said this differently. Ginn is an outstanding speed guy. But we don't take him 12 because he doesn't fit with our priorities. I'm all in favor of taking Okoye, he's got that potential everyone is talking about and has great character and an excellent work ethic. He is young, but someone who will improve. But if he's not available, do we stay at 12 and simply take the best player available? No. This is why Calvin Johnson, despite being a freak of nature and the best athlete in the draft, will not get selected until probably 4th overall. OAK, DET and CLE all have more pressing needs. That is if no trades occur.
Without Okoye, a trade down is in order, unless they've got something on a player who can contribute quickly. I'm not a fan of Tank Tyler, because even though he put up 40 something reps at the bench press, his off-field issues are enormous. He will not fit in with Marv's vision of the Bills.
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True. But to me, losing Fletcher is simply not going to be that big of a deal compared to our play at the position the second half of last year, which is the thesis of the thread. We didn't have Crowell for 5 games. We didn't have Spikes for the entire year (we had half a Spikes). Ellison was a rookie. I think a healthier Spikes, Crowell in the middle and a second year from Ellison is probably as good as a slow Spikes, Fletcher and a rookie Ellison. If Spikes is released or simply not healthy enough we will have a problem, but the 5 mil he opens up can get us his replacement. Fletcher was pretty good in pass coverage but he really was making a lot of drag down tackles 6 yards from the LOS. IMO a lot more than in previous years.
Sure, we experienced injuries. And they will happen at some point this season. We needed to turn the corner with F-B because he was no longer what we wanted and Marv let that be known in the PC. Now, one might argue that some of the lack of play at LB was made up with Clements in the secondary. I believe that's what is being advocated in this thread, but Clements' play at CB did, at times, made the defense look better.
With the loss of F-B, do we have a suitable player for the MLB position? We don't know because at this point Crowell is the only option. Spikes is not a MLB, no matter how you break it down and free agency is not going to provide us an upgrade over F-B either. So, we look to the draft. I just don't think we find that player who is smart enough to handle the Cover-2 and attack the LOS this year. F-B was the constant over the course of the 2006 season. We do not know how big or small of a loss he is at this point. We did lose OLB's, but never the MLB. We temporarily replaced the injured OLB's, but I don't believe we lost Spikes and Crowell at the same time. We never needed to get another MLB out there. Oh, and who's second behind F-B on the depth chart. Yep, you got it, UDFA DiGiorgio.
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When did Carriker switch positions to become a DT.? He was a DE last I heard.
Furthermore, we are not at liberty to draft best athlete/player available. We must get players to fill our needs. LB, CB, and DT are our primary needs. If Ted Ginn Jr was available at 12, would you select him because we're thin at WR? You most certainly would not.
We do not have the luxury of drafting best player available. There is no LB worthy of being picked #12 in the draft. I'd rather they drop down in the first and pick up something in the second than pick a guy early because they want him.
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On a given draft, how many players become impact players their first season? For 2006, I don't think of the 32 selections, more than 5 actually contributed to their team winning football games. That may be too subjective for some, but this is why free agency gets out of hand-the guys on the free agent market may help you win now as opposed to later.
In Round 2 there were about 5-6 instant impact guys. That's not good odds for the current season, but hopefully bodes well for the future. The fact is, we let players go into FA without having an option once they departed. One might argue that Youboty was drafted to fill the inevitable hole Clements would create. But outside of perhaps Crowell, did we have a solution to F-B's departure? Not really. Moving OLB's into MLB spots is riskier due to the different demand on a MLB in the 4-3.
You might be able to once in awhile get away with a young CB with good instincts. Try getting away with an inexperienced LB core in the Cover-2. Not going to happen.
Rhodes signs with Raiders
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Everyone knows Rhodes was a back that shared the load. That's fine, but his deal with Oakland was about 7.5M for 2 years. Now, if we didn't like Rhodes because he was, well, Dominic Rhodes that's fine. But if it's about the money and we can't cough up that sort of money for a RB, then we've got a problem.
It takes a lot for a guy to decide to go to Oakland at this juncture. What would it have taken for Buffalo to sign Rhodes?
At this point the options at RB are getting smaller. Even if you re-sign Anthony Thomas, I guarantee we go RB in the first or second round. And if we do, then now you've got a rookie and Anthony Thomas sharing the load. I'm fine with that, as long as the back sharing the load is Lynch or Peterson. Lynch has some personal baggage, but we've used the first round pick to fill a hole we created. Those are the two guys ready to go now. The others have some issues.
The bottom line to me is Buffalo continues building for the future. The line is good on paper. But, there are many positions left to fill and depth to have in case of injury. RB wasn't supposed to be a problem in the off-season, and it's become one.