VW82

Chargers o line jumped on that TD throw. Should have been a false start.

Don't see how. It's pretty clear that Whaley wasn't the one making decisions in that draft room. Besides, McBeane's fate is tied to Allen now. If he turns into a franchise guy it won't matter that Mahomes is good too. Doesn't look great right now though.

In related news, Patrick Mahomes looks like a sure fire franchise QB

Is it a bad sign that Edmunds and Allen are the two worst players on the field?

Man Edmunds whiffed badly on that open field tackle.

McCoy had one edge rusher to beat in open space which he did (because the guy thought he had the ball). Instead Allen kept it, got chased out and threw it into double coverage. Pretty sure the right call was Shady there.

Just went back and watched it again. 54 on the Chargers was the only guy who could have made a play on him. Perhaps it's asking too much to have your QB make a running play to beat a defender in the open field. Possibly better than asking your RB to beat three guys though.

It was a read option. Allen needed to fake the hand off and run left where there were no defenders. It would have been an easy first down.

Another thing...Allen makes terrible decisions on the read option. He takes away a sure fire TD from McCoy in the preseason. He pulls the hand off back from McCoy in that FG drive this game only to get sacked. Now he hands off to Murphy when he has a runway to the left for a first down. He's literally guessing out there on the read options.

Literally anyone. Sign a QB off the street. Make a trade. Allen is not ready for this. If it doesn't get a lot better and soon he'll get the bust label and fans and teammates will turn on him. Once that happens, it's over. This is such a bad situation for him.

So...on the FG drive Allen has a missed hand off that results in a sack. He throws a sure fire pick which is dropped. He missed a wide open crossing route by the RB even though he's only 10-15 feet away. He airmails the receiver over the top by 15 yards. Gets bailed out by an unsportsmanlike penalty. Completes a nice a pass downfield to Clay. Gives up a terrible sack with Jones wide open over the middle because he ran backwards instead of stepping up in the pocket and keeping his head downfield. This drive is all the proof you need that Allen shouldn't be out there.

How does Allen miss that??? WTF Edit: and then he airmails the reeceiver by 15 yards on the next one. Lol

Just threw a sure fire pick that was dropped

Giving Allen weapons isn't going to make a difference if he has no idea how to use them. He could have Jerry Rice, Gronk, and Barry Sanders out there and he'd still get sacked or chased out of the pocket every few plays because he has no idea where the rush is coming from. We can blame the o line all we want for that but the QB needs to be able to make pre snap reads and adjust the protections as necessary. Allen is still clueless in that regard.

Yeah I would have Brady ahead of Rodgers all time too. But I do think Rodgers is the better player now and has been for some time. He has a higher ceiling IMO, and I would put him top 10 all time. Brady has had the better career though, no question.

I think the knock on Manning underperforming in big playoff games is fair. Manning's record as the higher seed is very misleading though. Go back and show me which of those games he had the better team. Outside of maybe one or two of the Denver losses I promise you you're not going to find many. The reason he was the top seed is because he was so much better than every other QB during his prime that he drastically improved the win totals of those Colts teams. Then when they got to the playoffs and faced very good defenses from the Steelers, Pats, Chargers, Jets, etc., he was just ok and it wasn't enough to overcome the fact that their team wasn't as good (outside of him). I always thought Dungy was so overrated. Colts were consistently outcoached in the playoffs. The early Pats losses will always be fishy. They seemed to know exactly what the Colts were doing in those games, and they're on record sneaking into walk through practices and taping teams during that period.

To be clear, I'm not talking about Brady vs. Rodgers all time, only which guy was the best player in any given year. You don't think Rodgers has been a top 10 QB over the last three years? Not sure what sport you're watching.

When would you say he's been considered the consensus best QB? Despite his amazing 2007, I think if you could go back and poll people at the time most would have still picked Manning to start a new team. It was Rodgers who was the best player in 2011 when Manning was out with those neck surgeries, and then Manning came back with two MVP seasons right after, followed by Rodgers winning it again. Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I think most would have taken Rodgers over Brady these last three years as the top guy despite Rodgers's injuries and brutal teams he's had to carry to the playoffs. Brady's been fantastic and has probably been the second best QB over that period but he's also been playing on the best team in the league and for the best coach. He's had that advantage for pretty much his whole career. Has there ever been a player in any other sport who was considered the GOAT and yet was never really the consensus best player at his position for an extended period? I think It's a fair question.

The GOAT QB discussion is more interesting to me. It would seem the consensus is Brady is now the guy. Two questions: How can Brady be the GOAT if he was never really considered to be the best QB at any point in his career? Manning was the guy early, then Rodgers for the last several years. How do you separate Brady's greatness from that of the Pats organization, and specifically Belichick? Further to the second point, I'll make a cross sport comparison. By any statistical measure, Martin Brodeur is the greatest goalie of the modern era. But how can we call him the GOAT when Hasek was the much better player during their respective primes? Brodeur greatly benefited from an institutional advantage with the Devils whereas Hasek was forced to carry the Sabres every year just to make the playoffs. I'd argue it's the same with Brady and Manning. Both Brady and Brodeur clearly distinguished themselves individually during the latter stages of their careers but I'd argue their GOAT candidacies are much more reliant on longevity and strength of their teams/organizations over the years than people are willing to admit.

I actually saw Tremaine out and about the other day. He was shopping when all of a sudden these five dogs got off the leash and were running right at him. He threw down his bags and got into an athletic position to try and stop the dogs for their owner. One by one they deked him out and just kept on going, except for the last one who stopped and bit Edmunds's leg after making him fall down. Then TE got mad and he ate the dog! We probably shouldn't have used two draft picks on him.

This isn't about the Allen pick, or even trading away all our picks to get him. If he's the right guy, then it's worth it. This is entirely about McBeane messing up the other QB spot(s) on the roster to the point where now they have to play Josh before he's ready and with little to no help. They're throwing the kid into the olympics before they've fully taught him how to swim. All they needed to do was get through the first half of the season so he could see and learn how teams prepare and what he needs to do, and then play him when we're out of it and the pressure is off. He'll still probably suck at that point because he's such a raw rookie, but the weight of the world wouldn't be on his shoulders and he wouldn't have enough games left for the fans and his own teammates to turn on him. That last part is a real thing btw. Allen probably needs several games plus another off season of work to iron out some of the fundamental kinks in his game. He may not get that second part now if he doesn't improve and the team watches him lose his confidence. At that point he's just Peterman with no support in the locker room. Once that's gone, it's over.

Yeah...I just don't get the opinion that this is business as usual for a rookie QB. 100% agree with OP. Maybe Allen won't be ruined by this experience and will overcome the terrible spot he's been put in but don't tell me it isn't a terrible spot for a raw, rookie QB. McBeane F'd this up and they know it. There was too much invested in Josh to handle the situation this way. Too much at stake to not give him every advantage to succeed. Imagine you're starting a new job out of Uni, the hot shot new recruit. Except, while still in your training period the company fires the manager and promotes you to be manager. Now you have to lead all these people even though you don't fully know your job and the whole industry is watching your every move. Now pretend all those people under you are also counting on you to make them look good so they can earn their living and provide for their families. This just wouldn't happen in any other walk of life, and should never have happened on the Bills. It's BY FAR the most questionable decision I've seen by the Bills in a long, long time and there have been a lot of questionable decisions.

Reasons not to sign Tebow: Big distraction for the organization Vote of no confidence for Allen before he's even played a game He wasn't good even before he got booted from the NFL He hasn't played in several years and would be unlikely to be in football shape Tebow was never known to be a cerebral QB, and wouldn't likely be much help coaching Allen in meetings or otherwise

Earliest he'd get fired is near the end of next season. Pegulas will have signed off on this rebuild so they knew there was a good chance this was going to be a down year. Next year will be the money year. If McBeane can't improve the roster and they wind up whiffing on Allen, there could be some fire the coach buzz going into the final few games. I still doubt they'd do it, but you never know what gets said or how things play out behind the scenes. Three years is enough time to determine whether your new coach/GM have the goods IMO.

Between Wentz and Goff, Wentz was considered far more NFL ready at the draft and even coming out of camp. Eagles also had a SB level roster to surround Wentz and take some of the pressure off him. Everyone keeps comparing him to Allen because they both came from small schools but the comparison ends there. They're completely different QBs, with polar opposite situations (as far as help talent), and their learning curves coming into the league couldn't be anymore dissimilar.