Dawgg

Let's just roll up all the threads on this board into one. Then we can have one, big happy thread.

3. Extending Kelsay to that ridiculous contract essentially forced the Bills into a corner because they then had to extend Schobel when he had 3 years left on his deal at a reasonable price. If you're going to open up the checkbook on a defensive lineman, do it for a disruptive player. Chris Kelsay hardly qualifies.

People really underestimate the Bills' draft picks around here!

... and if you have a hard-on for missing the playoffs year after year, sack up like a man and admit it. Because it's front office decisions like these that go a long way in explaining why the Bills have been so bad for so long. Some folks have the stones to call it as they see it.

Well at least he's playing at a bargain basement price, courtesy of our front office!!!

Not on this board... no way!

Another novel idea for you: re-read my post, but this time understand what I said. Demetrius Bell may very well be a great player some day -- but he's a project who is at least 2 years away from making any meaningful contribution. If Dockery or Peters get injured this season, Bell won't be much of a help. My point is that year after year, the Bills fail to invest in building any sort of depth in the offensive line. Projects are great and all, but the league is littered 3rd, 4th, and 5th round linemen who start early in their career and make meaningful contributions to their teams -- the Bills notwithstanding. And you wonder why we have to pay $65M for a decent guard!

You've been throwing this argument around for a while. Simply dividing the number of "busts" by the total number of players picked at the position is not an accurate way to determine probability of success -- far from it. First of, in the second day, teams' draft boards differ rather significantly -- so you can't assume that a player picked in the 5th round was valued as such by the other 31 teams. Second, a lot of it is dependent on scheme and a team's ability to develop rookies. Does a rookie OL drafted into Indianapolis have a higher chance of success than a rookie drafted into Arizona? In many ways, YES because Indy has a better track record at developing young talent. Finally, the probability is dependent on the scouting staff. If the Bills' scouts know how to identify linemen at the collegiate level, your chances of success increase dramatically. Problem is, this has been their achilles heal for years. Rather than address the problem in the front office, the Bills just ignore the position altogether. Once again, the subpar results speak for themselves.

"Revamp" may be a bit strong. Overdorf, Guy, and the scouting staff remain largely intact. Aside from Levy replacing Donahoe, it's largely the same folks. From what I've heard, they plan to use Mike Pollack, their 2nd round pick, as a guard even though he played center in college. Bottom line, versatility is the name of the game and Pollack can play 3 positions and will be locked up in a multi-year contract at a reasonable price. Gandy is a decent player in his own right, but he's the odd man out here. Being the odd man out of a very deep OL is not necessarily an indictment of your play. It's just another example of a good organization consistently investing in the positions that are paramount to offensive success: the o-line. You might not see Pollack on YouTube highlight videos, but he's a huge addition to that team.

Hmm... perhaps that has something to do with the fact that they drafted 3 linemen in the draft this year, because they continually invest in their O-Line by bringing in young talent through in the middle rounds of the draft? He got lost in a numbers game -- the Colts re-signed him to a 1-year tender at $1M just 3 weeks ago but no longer needed him after drafting 3 youngsters. Ever since Polian left, this franchise has been very bad at utilizing the draft to build an offensive line -- yet another reason for their abysmal performance this decade.

If he outplays both Polamalu and Sanders, he will be considered elite, regardless of whether or not he gets the nod. Kerry Rhodes is a Pro Bowl caliber safety that has yet to get voted in... I'd be thrilled to see Donte perform even close to that. But as you said, he's not there yet.

They're BOTH important. But the problem is that the Bills draft DBs year after year, neglecting O-Line prospects in the middle rounds in favor of project tight ends, DBs and wide receivers. When you consistently do that year after year, you're in trouble.

I will address 2005, as I don't have the time to look at every single year. I know you love to regurgitate lists of past transactions and picks to prove your point, but you can't just exclude a whole bunch of significant data points!!! Dylan Gandy has a number of starts for the Colts, who have a very good offensive line. He has also started and performed well in playoff games. You fail to mention David Stewart, taken by the Titans in the 4th round out of Mississippi State, who has been a fixture at right tackle, received a first-round tender and is about to be extended by the team. You also conveniently leave out Jason Brown, a fixture at guard for the Ravens, also taken in the 4th round. He was voted to Sports Illustrated’s All-Pro team and is one of the best young guards in the NFL. Todd Herremans was drafted as a tackle in the 4th round out of Saginaw Valley but started every game the past 2 years for the Eagles as guard, including 2 playoff games. You leave him out as well.

EXACTLY.

This, I agree with. I will take it further by saying he has quite a ways to go before he reaches "elite" status. I'd agree with this too. Potential? Of course, that's why he was drafted where he was. But he's not elite today, nor is he close.

Completely agree. Hey I like Whitner too -- seems like a great leader and he definitely puts forth 100%... that said, I know elite when I see it and he simply doesn't fall in that category. I love how people throw the word "elite" around like it's a dime a dozen. To put Whitner in the elite category TODAY, you have to be the ultimate homer. Well... come to think of it, I guess it all makes sense then

Here's a novel concept: rather than draft projects, how about spend mid-round draft picks on offensive linemen who have started and been successful at major college programs and whose skills translate directly to the NFL? That way, we can avoid having to plug gaping holes with overpriced free agents... can't expect Jason Peters every single time!

Yes, because that's what I said Clements was a great player (still is) and I would have rather kept him than overpay for Derrick Dockery. But that's a different story altogether. In any case, you can keep telling yourself over and over again that Whitner is an elite safety... doesn't mean that he is. Maybe this year with a better surrounding cast.

Nope, not necessarily. He made the tackles he was supposed to make -- that's what an NFL-caliber strong safety does. I also saw him leave plays on the table, particularly in run support, where he'd have the guy in his grasp and didn't quite make the play. He also had some issues covering tight ends. Again, he has a long way to go before he can be classified as "elite." He's certainly being paid like an elite player though

Your standards are shockingly low. He was solid and played every single snap except for the season finale. Was a great leader and knew the scheme very well. Elite? Far from it.

While I don't expect him to become a top 3 safety in this league, I do expect him to make a few big plays here and there. He is one of the veterans of this defense now, has been in the same system for 3 years -- and if Stroud and Poz play up to their billing, the opportunities should be plentiful.

... or just make a play every once in a while. That would be nice! The excuses are gone this year, with the upgrades on D... though I'm sure the peanut gallery will rush to his defense regardless of how average his plays is.

Sorry, but that's not what I said. What I did say, however, was that the fact that Josh Reed being the most dependable receiver on the team is an indictment on the team's overall talent level at the position (or lack thereof). Yes, Reed has been a pretty solid complimentary receiver. But when he's your most dependable playmaker in the WR corps -- over a fairly long time horizon -- you have a problem.

... anyone wonder why this team has barely been below average during that span?

Limped into the playoffs? The team was 3-1 in November and 2-1 in December when Flutie sat out the season finale -- that's hardly limping. He wasn't a prolific passer, but the offense was a smashmouth running offense -- ultimately our owner (and many fans) had a hardon for the young $25M gun-slinger riding the pine and were captivated by his potential. I can't blame Ralph for wanting to see what his $25M was getting him... but wrong place, wrong time. I have nothing against RJ, to tell you the truth -- it's not his fault that he got the nod and it's not his fault that the team lost to the Titans -- but it was still a classic case of a meddlesome owner undermining his coaching staff.