Perry Turtle
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Posts posted by Perry Turtle
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So lunging holds no bearing to the rule. So basically, the ref was wrong.
Aside from the fact that the ref perceived lunging to equal hitting low, yea. Big surprise. They're probably wrong on half the calls they make (or don't make).
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Suh must own the record for accidentally kicking people in the head.
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Ok I'm trying to look up chop block definitions, but I can't find where it says anything about lunging. Is this a new extention to the rule or something? Could you clarify the lunging aspect?
It's the refs perception. He's sees Incognito dive, so he assumes he went low on an engaged player, so he makes the call. The rulebook, at that point, has nothing to do with the call.
In that moment. he's not making the call based upon a scientific measurement, or a strict interpretation of the rulebook, he's making it on his perception of a guy going low on an engaged defender.
So either you rely on a refs perception that the block was within the legal area (above the hip), which would be insane, because everything I hear is that the refs basically suck (and I believe they do), or you coach your team to avoid those situations by not leaving your feet to block engaged defenders unless your QBs health is in jeopardy.
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You say that now, until of course theres a play where he decides now not to help out on a block, the defender gets free and the QB is sacked and your screaming why Richie didn't help out and just stood around......
It was a blown call that the Bills will hear about when the league send out their apology letters. The referee defenders here can say all they want about intent or whatever, but the rule states thighs or lower, last time I checked the waist was above the thighs.............
Yeah, and that letter and 25 cents will be worth 25 cents.
This is really simple. When a Buffalo Bill taunts an opponent, he's getting flagged. When a Buffalo Bill shoves or punches an opponent after a whistle, he's getting flagged. When someone on the bench mouths off to an official, he's getting flagged. When an engaged defender gets spun around, the Bills O lineman is getting flagged. When an O lineman lunges at an engaged defender, he's getting flagged.
It doesn't matter what the rulebook says, that's how the refs are calling that game, so that's what's going to happen. And no apology is going to change that.
Until the Bills actually adjust to these realities, the SOS is going to happen.
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The guy didn't even buckle or bend from the block. There is no reason to make that call. I understand bad calls from bad angles. That happens all the time. But not only did Incognito hit him at the waist, the guy didn't even bend from the hit. Intolerable call.
I think the refs make that call 10 out of 10 times, regardless of where the contact happens. And that's due to their over-aggressive interpretation of the rule. It's wrong, but that's the way games are being called.
O-linemen can't lunge and make contact with an engaged defender. To double-team they have to stay on their feet. Otherwise, the overwhelming odds are that the referee is going to make the call.
Incognito didn't have to leave his feet to help with that block. If he takes one more step and stays on his feet, that call has no chance of happening.
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So no more double teams? Kind of a dramatic change to the game, don't you think?
There are several dramatic changes going on with the game right now, much of it coming by the way the refs are calling the games (which I don't agree with). Teams can make adjustments or waste time arguing that penalties that cost them games weren't called right.
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That wasn't a planned block that was in the game plan, it was a double team after the initial block.
Right. They need to be coached up that engaging a pass rusher who is already engaged with another offensive lineman could result in a 15 yard penalty, regardless if they hit the rusher high or low.
It's a crap shoot due to the way the refs are calling it on the field. Just like lineman are coached on what a ref will call when it comes to holding or blocks in the back, they have to be coached up on this too.
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Agree with everything you said. I have learned something from the refs in the first 4 games of this season too.... I learned that the officials are making this game unwatchable.
I definitely agree with that. But it's painful to watch the Bills play directly into the refs over-zealousness to be seen on TV 35 times a game.
He changed the game plan after the game was out of hand. He was still calling a one yard out into the 4th quarter! The redzone calls were insane.
Regardless of the adjustments, coming into a game vs one of the strongest run defenses and weakest pass defenses and running the ball on 1st and 2nd down is amateur hour. The short passing was consistent through the game and never worked. It wasn't until the game situation absolutely took away those option that the team finally started consistently throwing intermediate routes that were previously successful and then abandoned.
I agree with everything regarding Hughes. IMO, he needs to be suspended for his crap. I would say benched, but that doesn't hit him in the wallet. Not sure if you can suspend a player for being a douche bag and hurting your team on the field week after week, but I doubt it, and it's too bad.
As for the chop, I think it's crazy to ask a player not to make a legal block during a game because it may be called incorrectly. How can a player make that kind of adjustment in the heat of a play?
I said it earlier and I'll say it again, when you have an athletic QB that runs like TT does, there is no time that you shouldn't be looking around for a block. Yes, it was it ended up being unnecessary, but Incognito doesn't know that at the time. For all he knows, the play is breaking down behind him and TT is getting ready to run. He isn't engaged so he finds the nearest guy and engages, LEGALLY. It was good play and is what everyone on that OL should be doing.
I agree with that, but until these plays are reviewable, it's a crap shoot that a perfectly legal block is going to result in a 15 yard penalty. There's no way to challenge this, and the refs are just not calling it by the book.
It sucks, but it's a fact of life right now in the NFL. Usually chop blocks are designed in run or screen plays. Those have to be removed to remove risk of a penalty being called (see Clays' penalty from the Colts game). And when the line is pass blocking, they have to be coached to stay away from rushers who are being engaged by another offensive lineman.
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This penalty has not been called correctly all season. The refs are calling it tighter than the rulebook, and it's not reviewable to make sure they got it right. Coaches should know this, especially Buffalo's staff because Clay was called for a WTF chop block in week 1.
To be safe, teams should consider this blocking technique to be dead. It's a penalty risk every time it happens, regardless if it executed correctly (according to the rule book) or not.
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Mike Pereira just said chop block was not a penalty there.
Problem is that the refs are calling chop blocks much more tightly than they are written in the rule book. The Bills knew this because Clay was called for a WTF chop block back in the Colts game.
Since this play isn't reviewable, Roman and crew should have taken anything that looks like a chop block out of the playbook. Usually chop blocks happen on runs or screens. There was no reason for Incognito to throw this block on a downfield pass.
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The refs weren't great out there, but when have they ever been great. How may personal fouls have been called on Hughes the past two years? When is this guy going to finally just STFU and play football. How many back to back personal fouls have been called on the Bills on the SAME PLAY this year. It's no surprise the refs have rabbit ears, so STFU and play football.
This wasn't the first bogus chop block called on the Bills this year, so you know that the refs are calling it too close. So avoid doing anything that looks even remotely like a chop block, especially on a pass play during which there was NO pressure on Taylor.
No doubt the refs are WAY too active this season. But it shouldn't be a surprise. PLAY SMART. This is a dumb football team right now. Each week the refs are teaching them a lesson that they refuse to learn.
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This is a dumb football team.
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4 plays inside the 10 and not one pass into the end zone? What kind of voodoo ritual do we have to perform to get a real offensive coordinator in this town? You play scared 2 scores down in the 4th?
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Jerry Hughes isn't a linebacker. He shouldn't be dropping into coverage, especially on pass downs. The Bills have personal for a 43 cover 2/3 scheme. Rex keeps having them play a 34 cover 1 scheme.
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His "bad" game still finished with 3 TDs, a rushing TD and a 93.3 QB rating...a hell of a lot better than Fitz's bad games.
If that's his floor, we've finally got our guy.
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I got to tell you I follow this stuff very closely. Vegas took an absolute beating in the sports books for opening weekend. Said it was their worse opening weekend in 20 years. Putting 2 & 2 together, I had the line figured around Patriots -4. If the line is -1.5 & 85% of the action is going on the Patriots, I don't want to jinx anything but this all points to a win for the Bills. Remember you heard it here first. Vegas very rarely loses big 2 weeks in a row.
Yep. Vegas is betting the Bills to win this week.
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Man, they are hammering Bradford. I think maybe 8 hits in the first half alone.
The Eagles were supposed to be amazing on offense but...yikes. do people still think we'd be happy with Murray.
Philly has a great preseason offense, where there's no game planning. You have to wonder if defenses are beginning to figure out Chip Kelly's offense. And Murray could prove to be a bad fit in Philly's offense. He'd look more like Karlos Williams in Buffalo's offense. Philly is going to miss Shady.
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Pittsburgh's offense has lacked urgency the entire game.
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I'm really impressed with Ben Franchise tonight.
Yeah, it looks like his offseason program of eating fried chicken and smoking menthols is paying off.
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I don't know I've been going back and forth. On one hand you have the greatest TE to ever play the game (who happens to be from Buffalo). On the other hand you have Troup. So far Gronk only has 3 1/2 times as many TDs as Troup had tackles. There is still time though.
Without Troup, the Bills switch to a 34 defense would have been a disaster.
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Do you think this is the first time that Pittsburgh has seen this fellow Gronkowski play?
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It's a TD. Just delayed a few seconds.
We get the comedic value of watching the clueless Steelers play goal line D.
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That's not a TD. It's on the inch line.
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Steelers are a hot mess. Just freakin' terrible.
The Chop Block Rule
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Bingo.
Especially since the Bills average 3 penalties on every onside kick they attempt.