caracara

He has tons of potential and all the tools, but it might have been better if he had stayed at Texas with Duane Akina for his junior year. He's young and probably 2 seasons away from being great. IMO he'll be great, but maybe not this year.

I'll be following the Bills by any means neccessary, including stream, radio and TV, but I will be in Reliant Stadium in H-Town, kicking off football-November, yell'n "let's go Buffalo."

IMHO Vince will get better at the passing-game during the preseason and you'll come to see him more as a QB who can improvise/run, instead of a running QB. If Fitz got hurt and you put VY at QB and gave him 8 designed running plays a game, from the wildcat or not, he's going to get hurt before you know it, then you're down to #3. Same with Brad Smith. Neither of those guys are built for that kind of beating in the NFL. In fact the 2nd team 'running" QB would get extra attention from the defense once he crossed the LOS, and Smith and Young are not compactly built like Tebow. At the same time, if Fitz was healthy you could put in either of those two guys for a change of pace or to stick it in the endzone from inside the 7 yrd line. I know Vince is very good at that. So...if Fitz goes down, the 2nd string QB needs to be able to distribute, which means he must be at least a decent hunker of that thing we call a pigskin.

QB Play imo: All three QBs were let down by the lineman and penalties. Fitz: I think he's overpaid and is being given too much responsibility for the offense, based on what he's done. I thought he made a really nice throw on the TD that was called back. He looked fairly sharp and in command for the first preseason game. Don't write him off yet. Vince: was horrible. He threw an interception that was absolutely awful. I think he'll get better though as he continues in the system. First down and goal from the five is almost a gimme TD for a team with VY at QB. Thigpen: Not good. Among other things, he doesn't have any of "that certain something" that a NFL QB should have. He's totally uninspiring.

Life is really unfair sometimes. Wishing the best for the Reid family

Now I see why you answer to "Hopeful." and I'm right there with you. Go Bills!

I was overly defensive. the peeing remark was sandwiched between "quitting" and "temper tantrum," so I took it the wrong the way. No harm done. Personally I think Young could still be a starter somewhere in the NFL. Probably not in Buffalo barring a disaster. But folks can improve themselves. VY might get another chance to be a starter. someday

Dang. you were one of the folks I was trying to win over. It's a message board. I have my mod-given rights. Don't I get points for not responding to all of the exceptionally mean things said about Young? "Peeing on Chan's desk," and that stuff? In my own way I'll respond to those who insist that Vince isn't worthy. peace, and Go Bills.

Just a heads-up with all due respect. Fisher's Tennessee team was 5-11 in 2004 and 4-12 in 2005. Then they drafted VY. and the Titans went 8-8 in 2006. Vince didn't start until Oct 1st. He was the starting QB of that team for 7 of their 8 wins in 2006. That is why he won ROY and possibly saved Fisher's job. That "good team" was not that good until 2006, and they were trending the wrong direction before Vince became a starter. I think the Bills end up with the best backup QB in the league if VY can win the job this summer. That's all.

I agree with you. And I think he'll be a good leader on the field if he has to relieve an injured Fitz. Most players know Vince is for real. Take Mario Williams for instance. He'll be happy that Vince is finally with him instead of against him. There probably aren't many ball players in Buffalo who can say they ever beat a team quarterbacked by Young. But 1st VY has to beat out Thiggy. Go Bills.

Undoubtedly Chan is a straight shooter, more so than just about any coach I've seen, but every single coach uses the press to send messages to players and will sometimes hold things back so as not to unduly enflame or encourage a fan base. If he was extremely confident in his backups he probably wouldn't say so because without a doubt VY and TT need to get better. Chan doesn't want to see an iota of complacency. On the other hand, hypothetically, if Fitz was stinking it up right now, Chan would probably downplay it so as not to shake his starters confidence and stoke a QB controversy.

Don't worry about it. coaches say all kinds of things. They are usually doing more than just answering a reporters question.

There's a theory that Fitz's cracked ribs effectively ended a good season last year. IMO if the exact same thing was to happen this year, but with a healthy VY to step in, the results would be much better. The blockers have to block and the receivers have to catch the ball. The RBs have to run hard. If all that is going on then the offense won't drop off much even if Vince only knows 70% of the playbook. I may be wrong, but I don't think any VY quarterbacked team has ever lost 4 games in a row with him as a starter. Of course he has to beat out Thigpen just to earn the right to sit on the bench. If he does I think the Bills have the best 2nd team QB in the league.

nm

As someone who has watched RT play over a dozen times, here you go. Hit him hard and he gets jittery. I don't see how he'll stand up to the rigor of the NFL. He knows Sherman's offense, but I still find it hard to believe he was picked that high by Miami. He had one good college season in 2010 (before that he was a receiver), and nothing else. He's a good kid and his wife is lovely. He's smart and he has a good arm. But after some good licks, here come the bad decisions.

VY's conduct in the interview you reference is not only stupid, but I think any coach or vet QB would find it insulting. Obviously he's been disimbued of that notion by now. IMO Vince actually does elevate the level of play of those around him, and not just RBs like Chris Johnson. But that's my opinion and I've about worn out this thread, so I will let it go at that. Cheers.

The "Harvard Goes Yard" offense.

So, I will sometimes be here during said discussions to make counter points to the assertions that VY is a head case and a bad signing for the Bills, unless future happenings prove me wrong at which time I'll admit I was wrong. At this time VY has shown that he has moved beyond the issues we're discussing on this thread, and I'm thrilled that you wish him the best of luck at least while he's a Bill. As far as the the "lost puppy" remark goes, it does nothing to advance your arguments, but for a message board warrior such as yourself we'll call it a shot and a score. Sisyphean Bills, I followed VY pretty closely and I don't think he has ever boasted that he had nothing to learn, however I know he did make the HOF and Super Bowl comment. It is true that he had bought too deeply into his own headlines. He has said some dumb stuff, and other quotes have been taken out of context. At any rate he governs his speech pretty closely these days. He isn't humble about what he feels he can do on the field, although he understands that to some extent he has to fake humility. If you sat with him on a plane you would come away liking him. He's very humble in general. He's not an intellectual and he knows it. If you talk to him about football, and you'll see this in interviews, he falls back on speech that almost sounds like self-affirmations which he must constantly repeat to himself in order to deal with some of the crazy and unreasonable hatred that has been directed at him. I'm pleased that everyone wishes him the best as a Bill. I hope he justifies your hopes and my expectations.

And that psychologist completely cleared VY of being a suicide risk. Cynical, obviously Vince hates to even talk about it, but he has said repeatedly that he never considered suicide. Can't that be enough for you? Plenty of teams have psychologists on staff. Plenty of football players have talked to shrinks and counselors. Not many rookies have had a prominent talking-head on ESPN spewing blatant lies about them. His problems in Tennessee were of a situational nature. That will continue to be proven as he goes along. He has not had any difficulties before or since.

He was/is a young man. He could have handled things better. He ended his stay at Tenn by cussing the coach and walking out on a team meeting. I can understand the emotion involved, but there is no excuse for that. He apologized to coach and team. I predict you will never see anything like that from VY again. There are some NFL veteran coaches and media who could have handled things more professionally. They will never admit any mistakes. but we're in the same camp, hopeful. we both want the same thing going forward. cheers. Let's Go Buffalo!

Spot on, Hopeful. Truer words have never been spoken. or as Parcells might say "I don't wanna hear about the pain. Show me the baby." In my own life I try to overcome stuff a lot more than I B word about stuff. I just reserve the right to defend VY against message board haters. You've never heard VY B word about Fisher, Hoge or anyone else mistreating him. Well I'm a VY fan. I'll stand up for him. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pnt0XPxu020

Bluefire, I think that's a very fair take, and add to that the confusion that VY must have felt when he landed into the middle of a feud between an unpopular owner and very popular coach who didn't want to draft him.

Fisher had Young banned from the locker room. He was effectively off the team. Munchak wanted a clean slate. Cynical. you believe all the reports and negativity that came out of Nashville, and you believe them because you want to. You obviously don't like Vince. I believe in what i've seen from Vince on and off the field, and I believe those things his teammates have said about him. VY was dropped into a situation that was exceptionally bad. He was the victim of a smear campaign that started before he was drafted. In fact as far as i know, his particular situation, for a 1st round franchise QB, is unprecedented. To folks who like VY, it has been sickening. But that was Tennessee, this is Buffalo. The Buffalo coaches don't appear to have a conflict of of interest. If you believe Merril Hoge, and you obviously do, Jeff Fisher generated negative stories about VY and gave Hoge the green light to run with it. I've never heard of a head coach doing that with his newly drafted #3 franchise QB. Despite all this Vince led his team to victories. That's how he dealt with the adversity. To the OP House, VY could use some coaching from a coach who wants him to be the best QB he can be. Hopefully Gaily will help him out. Chan has always struck me as a terrific man and a pretty decent coach. Having worked under Jerry Jones, Chan might have some sympathy for people who have had to work under duplicitous a-holes

I didn't say anything about the mayor of Nashville. I have said that Fisher called the Nashville cops and told them Vince was possibly suicidal, and then later Fisher's office leaked it to the press. I have said what everyone knows. Jeff Fisher didn't want Vince. Owner Bud Adams insisted on VY being picked, and later Adams insisted that Vince start when Fisher's choice Kerry Collins was 0-6 and the Titans were coming off a 59-0 drubbing by NE. The fact that Vince went out and won 8 of 10 and probably saved Fisher's job only made Fisher more bitter. I've said that after Texas beat USC in the national championship Vince had the misfortune of being drafted to a team where the head coach was a USC grad and the OC was a former USC coach, and neither wanted him. All of Vince's "bad behavior" happened around Nashville. There has been none before and none since. When Fisher benched Vince the last time, Vince was rocking a 98.5 passer rating. Fisher finished out the season with Rusty Smith, losing. And in any NFL city there will be cops who will love to buddy up to the HC, just like you would, and they will do him favors. And Fisher has many, many influential friends in the NFL. I've said that Vince was drafted into a bad situation, and still won a bunch of games as QB. Now I'm saying that Vince isn't wacko or a terminal head case. You have never seen video evidence of Vince being disrespectful to coaches, teammates or opponents. He's a good guy.

hopeful, I wasn't "outed." I said I liked VY in my first post, and have made it obvious in every one of my posts since. But I am of the opinion that if he can't beat Thigpen for a spot, then he doesn't deserve to play in the NFL. The stuff about borderline personality disorder and VY being whacko is BS. Mentally weak? He isn't weak in the spotlight. He doesn't doubt himself at all. He expects to win. On the football field he's accomplished a lot more than Fitz, but Fitz has earned the trust of the Bills and the starting job. He did whatever it took to get where he is, beating out the competition. He has the higher IQ and he's a fine young man from a good family. His work ethic has never been questioned and never will be. I wish him the best. I want Fitz to stay healthy and win games. If Vince makes the squad and only gets to showcase his team spirit and solidarity (as i expect he will) I'll be happy with that. I want to see the Bills win. The cherry for me would be if VY helped the Bills get a playoff game in Buffalo. Hopefully if and when VY makes the squad you'll give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he's a good Buffalo Bill, until he proves otherwise. He hasn't shown any signs of complaining or sulking or pouting in the shower since the press reports out of Tennessee. And since I've been there myself ( long long long ago, my early 20s) I'll give VY a pass for his dust-up in a titty bar, his one and only brush with the law.