dayman

He may JUST NOW be STARTING to lose his power...but for the most part the answer is yes.

Extreme "cooperation is bad" Tea Party Sect and Grover Norquist pulled it down into the gutter.

LOL. I couldn't really hear that good for some reason but I heard some of it. Lets not knock all teachers though. Just b/c that woman got a job teaching doesn't mean she's a teacher. LOL I got some headphones to hear it a little better this is sOOOOOO funny. "You will not disrespect the President of the United States in this class." "I'll say what I want." lol Oh God...I'm enjoying this too much haha. This is classic.

We need to do up some T-shirts.

I plead the 5th

Compromise to me doesn't always mean ending up in the middle. And it certainly doesn't mean ending up with a "good thing" if that's what it meant there would be one party...the party of compromise lol. It means cooperation and reaching a result. People lose/win compromises all the time...and both sides are going to have be willing to pick and choose where they can give and not be so caught up in political-capital. I'm not really familiar with anything about the example you put forth so I won't really get into it but sometimes what you call surrender is strength. True conviction, true conviction...to the operation of government and to cooperation for solutions/disagreements is a duty people in Washington have and there are some who have abdicated that duty (my opinion). I thing most people agree w/ something like the budget there's obviously two ways this ends...cooperation or crisis as a result of failing to act. Taking too strong of a bargaining position, certainly to start is sometimes good, but sometimes it creates inefficiencies in the bargaining process that ultimately hurts everyone. Decent book to consider checking out that I like is called "Getting to Yes." In no way has it solved the issue that bargaining is tough stuff but it's got some good concepts about how to approach negotiation and also (to me) shed some light on how some traditional hard-line negotiation tactics that I previously thought were "just how it's done" are actually harmful to those employing them.

To me a "moderate" is someone who can agree to come to an agreement and cares about the process of deliberation, and is willing to compromise to move us all one incremental foot forward. The country needs direction and either side refusing to compromise will destroy us. When I think of a "moderate" I don't necessarily think of just finding a middle though. It's not about changing people's mind or somehow proving someone idea correct w/ other ideas wrong (we live in a complex world). It's just about preserving some sense of rationality in the process itself and ultimately "getting to yes" even if nobody is completely happy with the result (usually a sign of a good bargain). Just a determination to get things solved by cooperation. Conflict wins elections. Cooperation solves problems in the real world. More than anything else, more than any specific idea on any particular issue the philosophy of being a moderate (lol) is about cooperation.

We've figured it out! Liberals are emotional idiots and conservatives just crush them on this board. I mean literally crush them with hard fact and irrefutable arguments it happens constantly. !@#$ing liberal pussies. Political discussion is boxing and liberals just got knocked the !@#$ out.

You'll have to excuse me it's 2AM where I live and I've returned from the bar. I suppose what I'm trying to ask is if it's fair to distill what you posted into a simple statement: "Since 2006 GOP supporters have been proven correct." (as general a statement as that may be)

I wasn't here until very recently but what happened was since 2006 is that GOP leadership has been proven correct?

lol no Tom read the !@#$ing topic...I have no argument against Bain or for Bain. I've said multiple times there's a lot of lying in re:Bain. Magox basically is Bain and is just an insane and angry person. Probably why he's a Bills fan.

lol...I've said my piece and you've said yours...I didn't say anything you actually accused me of as being false. My basic point is it's unfair to attack them w/ lies and it's also retarded to worship them as all things jobs/American. As for being reduced to this? I start here if anything I've risen to this. Just ask 3rdnlng.

Bain is literally God's work. It's George Washington reborn in the form of a private equity firm. It's the stuff that helps every single person in this country. It's the peoples work and does no wrong. :worthy:

Boo hooo I lost my job b/c of Dodd Frank...boohoo I am under the false impression the EPA going to far is somehow a new thing Obama did that hasn't been going on since the 70s...boohooo dey took mah job! I just want to drill like no one can see me, trade like nobody is looking, etc etc.... Edit: And btw I'm just going to put this out there before someone makes some retarded comment and trys to drag me down the rabbit hole defending everything Obama does...I don't really agree w/ all of Obama's energy policy nor do I back every decision the guy makes. I just support him over Romney, b/c that's the choice I have.

Get over the destroyed term. I'll use the term "loss" from now on when talking with you if you prefer b/c I'm just a nice guy. Also c'mon man read the damn thread. I don't know if it was you or someone else I quoted that part at the bottom in response to someone challenging me when I literally SAID that they weren't creating jobs rather they were creating greater returns...someone said that wasn't true or something and that traders do that...obviously private equity firms do that as well. EDIT: Ok so you two right now are on record saying you do NOT think it's the president's job to create jobs? So neither of you will EVER knock Obama on the economy then right? And don't give me some semantics about creating an environment for jobs/not getting the way as opposed to direct jobs b/c obviously that's what I mean and no I don't mean literally create a bunch of federal jobs. So stop being retarded. No !@#$ing **** that's what I meant. Thank you for educating me on that though. For a minute there I thought it was his job to hire everyone in AMerica and pay them w/ tax dollars but now I'm corrected thank you. /sarcasm.

Look you can admire Bain as a finance guy, I'm not saying you shouldn't they made a boatload they were profitable. This isn't an election for the next CEO of a private equity firm. And what mistruths am I propagating anywhere in my posts? As for "destroyed jobs" pull your panties out of your vag for Christ's sake. What would you call it when a job was there, and now it isn't?

LOL. Look it's retardation to parrot the misinformation and unfair attacks that target Bain. It's also pretty retarded brainwashed-behavior to worship Bain as you do. The President of the United States is in the business of creating job.

Not whiny. Glad you love Bain and Romney. Bow down.

Yes 3rdnlng...good job. That's the point, there are some jobs created and jobs destroyed. Intelligent, neutral economists have debate about whether the activities of Bain are on net, positive or negative for the overall economy and certainly for workers. That's the point. To go around championing Bain like Magox appeared to be doing though....that's is !@#$ing ridiculous. However, to defend it from unfair attacks is equally valid. And once again, it's not about general capitalism or the concept of private equity overall. It's about the activities of Bain and how they ultimately were so profitable...and I got news for all of you it's not just identifying an opportunity and investing money and helping manage a plan and growing out business like some lemonade stand acquiring more customers and hiring more employees. There is a lot more to it, some of which is far from the type of thing the "common man" would look at and bow down to as a job creating God. Some of it is exactly what I described above. And for workers of those companies...it's insulting that people would suggest that it was somehow good for America what happened (in their case). EDIT: And btw, Bain aside there absolutely ARE companies out there that are classic slash and burn vulture capitalists...to just look at people who have money and are involved in business putting money in and whatnot and call them the basis of all that is sacred for AMerican Capitalism is naive.

I don't need to be lectured on private equity or capitalism first off (Magox...what a blow-hard post that was I mean MY GOD lol). I don't oppose private equity, period...b/c I'm not a !@#$ing retard. The point meazza/Magox (as I see it anyway), is that there are practices which are shady (from an employee "common man" stand point) and the idea that Bain wasn't guilty of it (both on Romney's watch, and certainly after) is a blatant lie. The image that this was their standard business model, is also a blatant lie....and most of what is in that Gingrich ad I posted (which I posted ONLY to remind people this narrative was used in the primary and in basically every election Romney has ever had) is absolutely false. Bain capital DID make money by mortgaging companies having them take on a bunch of debt, raising earnings temporarily, taking out dividends by starving the company of operating/human capital and then these companies often collapsed. This is NOT every company...this is NOT the majority of companies. This is NOT illegal. But this is ****ty, from the perspective of the workers of that company. About 4 or 5 of Bain's biggest investments while he was there went bankrupt and they weren't all "turn around" jobs ... campanies like Dominos Pizza, Sealy Mattress, etc. As for the idea that it's not bad to go bankrupt if they come out and prosper...well they prosper b/c they are able to restructure and shed the debt Bain loads up on them! Being successful after that shows it was a company that could be saved to begin with and succeeded despite of the overloaded debt they incurred. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/dec/03/nation/la-na-romney-bain-20111204 Bain managers said their mission was clear. "I never thought of what I do for a living as job creation," said Marc B. Walpow, a former managing partner at Bain who worked closely with Romney for nine years before forming his own firm. "The primary goal of private equity is to create wealth for your investors." Bain's top 10 dollar investments under Romney — averaging $53 million — spanned a number of sectors, including healthcare, entertainment and manufacturing. The firm's largest investment was its 1999 buyout of Domino's Pizza, into which Bain put $188.8 million, eventually reaping a fivefold return. Four of the 10 companies Bain acquired declared bankruptcy within a few years, shedding thousands of jobs. The prospectus shows that Bain investors profited in eight of the 10 deals, including three of the four that ended in bankruptcy.

lol

It's a miscalculation to frame Bain and his experience there as a bona fide job creating qualification. Some jobs were created, and some jobs were destroyed. His job was to create superior returns, not create jobs. He should just say that and move on.

I didn't think anything was just curious...

Bain Capital is just an Obama narrative? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYg_OdXNc1Q&feature=related

Ron Paul would just let the free market decide if Aliens are real or not...