Gary M Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 The D is 8th in total D and 10th in scoring, and that is with the O giving up 7 pts to the Pats. I know they are lacking on third down, but if the offense did anything other than punt I think you would see this D shine. They held two teams to 13 and another to 16 and the O couldn't win. I know they didn't stop the Jets or Jags on their last drives, but come on, 13 and 16 points, those should be wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 I know they didn't stop the Jets or Jags on their last drives, but come on, 13 and 16 points, those should be wins. 75273[/snapback] If they had made stops when they had to they would have been wins. That's the difference between good and great. It's also the difference between 3-2 and 1-4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 Gary, the defense is good, but without a consistent pass rush (one game does not cut it; they have to do it for the rest of the season), they'll never be a shutdown unit and will continue to struggle on 3rd downs. Yesterday was a good sign that maybe things will change. Then again, it could be a fluke. We'll see this Sunday what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary M Posted October 19, 2004 Author Share Posted October 19, 2004 If they had made stops when they had to they would have been wins. That's the difference between good and great. It's also the difference between 3-2 and 1-4. 75278[/snapback] I didn't say they were great, I just can't see how anyone can bad mouth them. In the Jags game the O had the ball with 7 minutes left and could run out the clock. In the jets game the first seven drives ended with punts, which included drives of 1:28, 2:56, 1:17, 1:48 and 2:06. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 I didn't say they were great, I just can't see how anyone can bad mouth them. In the Jags game the O had the ball with 7 minutes left and could run out the clock. In the jets game the first seven drives ended with punts, which included drives of 1:28, 2:56, 1:17, 1:48 and 2:06. 75306[/snapback] Fourth and 17. Gave up THREE 4th down conversions with the game on the line. One point lead late in the fourth quarter. Needed ONE stop. Just ONE. Couldn't do it. Next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 Fourth and 17. Gave up THREE 4th down conversions with the game on the line. One point lead late in the fourth quarter. Needed ONE stop. Just ONE. Couldn't do it. Next. 75312[/snapback] I think that you were correct when you said that stopping teams in crunch time and carrying the water to put up a W even when your O stinks is the difference between good and great. This is what made the Bears 85 D and the SB Ravens great. As a Bears fan (I grew up in Chicago and was even at the Gears game against SF where Gale Sayers was first hurt) I always felt we had a better chance to score when our D was out there than when McMahon was in control. They were great Ds and we are not. However, you are correct in applying this assessment to the current Bills D if you also are willing to acknowledge they are good. The D has the failings you mention which stop them being great, but they are far more productive than the O and if the weren't a good D we would be 0-5 today and the 4 Ls our TEAM put up would have all looked like the NE game rather than the D at least keeping us in games against Jax, Oak and NYJ so that we could blow it at the end. I think Gary is correct and your assessment is also correct unless you view any D that isn't great as being a total failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KurtGodel77 Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 I didn't like the way that Morris ran all over our defense in the first half. Nor was I pleased with that 7:00+ drive Miami used to kill the third quarter. In the second half of that Miami game, our offense looked as good as our defense. At least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 I think that you were correct when you said that stopping teams in crunch time and carrying the water to put up a W even when your O stinks is the difference between good and great. This is what made the Bears 85 D and the SB Ravens great. As a Bears fan (I grew up in Chicago and was even at the Gears game against SF where Gale Sayers was first hurt) I always felt we had a better chance to score when our D was out there than when McMahon was in control. They were great Ds and we are not. However, you are correct in applying this assessment to the current Bills D if you also are willing to acknowledge they are good. The D has the failings you mention which stop them being great, but they are far more productive than the O and if the weren't a good D we would be 0-5 today and the 4 Ls our TEAM put up would have all looked like the NE game rather than the D at least keeping us in games against Jax, Oak and NYJ so that we could blow it at the end. I think Gary is correct and your assessment is also correct unless you view any D that isn't great as being a total failure. 75356[/snapback] I'm probably not as tolerant because they've talked so much about themselves and "taking the next step." It's not a step to me - more of a leap. If you want to be the strongest unit on the team then you have to make plays when they matter the most. I look at our team and I see one player who consistantly comes through when we need him. It's too bad he's the punter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 Stats don't tell the story. EVERY time the Bills have had to suck it up on D with less than two minutes left in the half, the other team has either scored a touchdown (Jax, NE end of 1st half to tie, Mia end of 1st half to go ahead) or gained enough yards to kick the game winning FG (Jets). Until they can stop a team in crunch time, they should not even be considered a good defense. Willis & the running game is the only thing that saved this D from being tested yesterday because we held the ball the last 6+ minutes & Miami never got to try to tie against what I consider a very suspect D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 Stats don't tell the story. EVERY time the Bills have had to suck it up on D with less than two minutes left in the half, the other team has either scored a touchdown (Jax, NE end of 1st half to tie, Mia end of 1st half to go ahead) or gained enough yards to kick the game winning FG (Jets). Until they can stop a team in crunch time, they should not even be considered a good defense. Willis & the running game is the only thing that saved this D from being tested yesterday because we held the ball the last 6+ minutes & Miami never got to try to tie against what I consider a very suspect D. 75419[/snapback] The goaline stand on Sunday was of their own making because they failed to stone Miami (an incredibly stoppable O w/o Rickey), but it was cruch time beauseit was 1st and goal from the 1 and the D stopped them. Given the wind, situation ans Miami was knocking on the door for a tie with it going against them this was crunch time. Likewise, they then faced Miami with the wind against them the rest of the way and shut them down. I would not wet my pants over this because it was just Miami. but the D certainly did the job Sunday and from a TO for a TD from Spikes to the surprising Edwards step up the unit deserve a lot of praise and if we are lucky this is the start of a change from being good to being great. They are far from great (witness the crucn time drives, the pass rush problems of the front-four. and the safety play without Milloy - his tackles make the difference between this being a #2 statistical squad to bein a #8 statistical squad) but they are at least a good squad which is in the upper third of the league in terms of D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typical TBD Guy Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 The D is 8th in total D and 10th in scoring, and that is with the O giving up 7 pts to the Pats. I know they are lacking on third down, but if the offense did anything other than punt I think you would see this D shine. They held two teams to 13 and another to 16 and the O couldn't win. I know they didn't stop the Jets or Jags on their last drives, but come on, 13 and 16 points, those should be wins. 75273[/snapback] I bet we'd easily be a top 5 statistical unit without those killer injuries to our secondary. And maybe this is wishful thinking, but I think we are 1 DL and 1 DB away from being the #1 NFL defense. Two guys I'm looking at closely to put us over the top are Kelsay and McGee. If Kelsay steps up at DE, then we can start producing a pass rush without having to always resort to blitzing. And if our other second year man McGee steps up at CB, then we could slide Vincent on over to FS and hopefully start grabbing more interceptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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