Gore's global warming movie

[erynthered]

  You did choose to post it for a reason, no?

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Yes. I thought it would be obvious. To stir the debate. Isnt that why you come here, debate positions and opinions on things?

 

The articles I posted gave a different opinion, of Al, and global warming. Keep up.

 

 

BTW, can you skate? Play defence? Missing a few teeth?

[RuntheDamnBall]

Yes. I thought it would be obvious. To stir the debate. Isnt that why you come here, debate positions and opinions on things?  

 

The articles I posted gave a different opinion, of Al, and global warming. Keep up.

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Sure, I was just continuing the argument!

 

EDIT: My point was, regardless of just how dire it is we should take the longview and be better stewards of the earth for our grandkids and beyond. Not, "hey, things aren't so bad, carry on with the wastefulness," which is what these guys would like.

BTW, can you skate? Play defence? Missing a few teeth? 

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I've got all the chompers and can't skate that well, but all the same I've got a feeling I will soon receive a call from Darcy.

[erynthered]

 

My point was, regardless of just how dire it is we should take the longview and be better stewards of the earth for our grandkids and beyond. 

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I can agree with that.

 

 

Now lace'em up, and go out there and knock someones head off!!!

 

BTW, we may need you somewhere else soon, whats your 40?

[RuntheDamnBall]

BTW, we may need you somewhere else soon, whats your 40?

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For the love of god, I wish someone would tell me!

 

I think Willis will be talking about it on the NFL Network.

[finknottle]

As opposed to the liberal's "how can we spin this to start another program to add to our base?" 

 

I don't disagree that we need to be better stewards of the land but the Democrats are just as bad as those they point fingers at.  The obstructionism that has been going on in this country for the last 40 years is criminal and holding Al "I got rich from Occidental Petroleum" Gore up as a poster child is ludicrous.

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No the conservative position would be to do something about it, and then have to defend the decision for the next 5 years as the liberals botch that the poor metoer wasn't really going to hit the earth, and that the conservatives have screwed up the alignment of the planets and pissed on the Venetians because of our rash attack on the "misunderstood" meteor.

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Ludicrous.  The distinction between global warming being a natural vs. man-made event is very important, as it tells you not just how you can address it, but whether or not you actually can address it.

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And yet here we are, wallowing in debates about finger-pointing...

 

It's like Nero fiddling while Rome burns.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

And yet here we are,  wallowing in debates about finger-pointing...

 

It's like Nero fiddling while Rome burns.

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Uhhhh...no, it's not. As I said, the nature of the beast dictates how you address it. It's not finger-pointing, it actually MATTERS whether or not it's a man-made or entirely natural event.

[VABills]

And yet here we are,  wallowing in debates about finger-pointing...

 

It's like Nero fiddling while Rome burns.

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You're right the liberals are Nero. Except unlike Nero they continue to throw fuel on the fire (Murtha and Time, Newsweek and the Koran, etc..... ). Yet the conservative continue to take action without discussion or excuses and the liberals continue to get pissed that they are left out.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

You're right the liberals are Nero.  Except unlike Nero they continue to throw fuel on the fire (Murtha and Time, Newsweek and the Koran, etc..... ).    Yet the conservative continue to take action without discussion or excuses and the liberals continue to get pissed that they are left out.

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At least finknottle's trying to make sense. Conservatives take action on global warming? Conservative's don't even accept the existence of global warming.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

At least finknottle's trying to make sense.  Conservatives take action on global warming?  Conservative's don't even accept the existence of global warming. 

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Really?

 

Muahaha

[cromagnum]

Watched some good shows on pbs about global warming , and have heard the political right claim that global warming does'nt exist. One example of their dismissal was a newsweek article in 77 claiming the new ice age is coming.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Watched some good shows on pbs about global warming , and have heard the political right claim that global warming does'nt exist. One example of their dismissal was a newsweek article in 77 claiming the new ice age is coming.

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see link above.

[finknottle]

Watched some good shows on pbs about global warming , and have heard the political right claim that global warming does'nt exist. One example of their dismissal was a newsweek article in 77 claiming the new ice age is coming.

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The basis of this is that, geologically speaking, for the past two million years we have been in the Pliestocene, the coldest stretch in the last few hundred million years. The period has been marked by successive waves of major ice ages, each lasting a few hundred thousand years, and each itself defined by individual periods of advancing and retreating glaciers. To the best of our knowledge, we are in one of these major periods, but in a warm period of retreat now lasting 10,000 years (but still essentially colder than any point in the last 200 million years). So, the theory goes, unless the Pliestocene is really over (and we have no reason to conclude that), based on the previous pattern we are overdue to lurch back into a glacial period.

 

Of course this is based on extrapolating from previous experience, and does not preclude man-made influences from kicking us out of the pattern.

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

The basis of this is that, geologically speaking, for the past two million years we have been in the Pliestocene,  the coldest stretch in the last few hundred million years.  The period has been marked by successive waves of major ice ages, each lasting a few hundred thousand years, and each itself defined by individual periods of advancing and retreating glaciers.  To the best of our knowledge, we are in one of these major periods, but in a warm period of retreat now lasting 10,000 years (but still essentially colder than any point in the last 200 million years).  So, the theory goes, unless the Pliestocene is really over (and we have no reason to conclude that),  based on the previous pattern we are overdue to lurch back into a glacial period.

 

Of course this is based on extrapolating from previous experience, and does not preclude man-made influences from kicking us out of the pattern.

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Those damn cavemen and their SUVs!

[kegtapr]

It's amazing the amount of irresponsibility in the media when talking about "global warming." On Good Morning America this morning, they were talking about the wildfires in the west and the connection to global warming.

 

To drive the point home, they interviewed a firefighter that spoke of global warming basically like he was an expert and had a correspondent in Death Valley talking about the heat.

 

What's next....reporting from the ocean and saying it's wet? Or how about a NBA player talking about how to perform by-pass surgery.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

To drive the point home, they interviewed a firefighter that spoke of global warming basically like he was an expert and had a correspondent in Death Valley talking about the heat. 

 

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[cromagnum]

It's amazing the amount of irresponsibility in the media when talking about "global warming." On Good Morning America this morning, they were talking about the wildfires in the west and the connection to global warming.

 

To drive the point home, they interviewed a firefighter that spoke of global warming basically like he was an expert and had a correspondent in Death Valley talking about the heat. 

 

What's next....reporting from the ocean and saying it's wet? Or how about a NBA player talking about how to perform by-pass surgery.

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True on that, but at the same time there's another network that distort's the fact's to bolster their point, that global warming does'nt exist, and twist the consensus of scientist view's, to mislead the public, I can post a link and you can listen to their point if view minus the details.

[TheMadCap]

There are really two issues here as far as I see it:

 

1. Global warming- It is a fact that natural and anthropogenic gases increase the ability of our atmosphere to retain solar radiation. PERIOD.

 

As finknottle alluded to earlier, one of the large problems encountered by changing the global temperatures even a few degrees is the threat to thermohaline circulation in the oceans. The oceans don't just slosh around, they are a very complex system. In a nutshell it works like this:

 

The gulf stream brings warm salty water from the equator north where it is cools. Sea water is more dense as its temperature decreases and salinity increases. This natural sinking of the cooler, saltier water drives what is known as the conveyor, and drives ocean ciruculation, which in turn drives weather patterns for the entire earth.

 

Now if the temperature of the Earth increases to where more fresh water from the ice caps dilutes the waters to where they are not salty enough to sink in the north, the entire process shuts down. The conveyor stops running, ocean patterns change, weather conditions get much colder, and then we are in a bit of a tight spot.

 

This is not a myth, it HAS happened in the past. Using sediment cores from the deep oceans, science has shown the conveyor shutdown as a major component in past climate shifts in Earth's past.

 

2. Humans' role in the process - This is where we get a bit more clouded. While it is true that humans are contributing Methane, Carbon dioxide, water vapor and other "greenhouse gases" to the atmosphere, there is really no way to tell (yet) if our input is currently affecting weather on Earth. The fact is, the Earth periodically goes through natural fluxes in surface and ocean temperatures for a number of reasons and the data we have is just not sufficient to say with any degree of certainty if we are directly responsible for more changing climate.

 

That being said, we should try and reduce our influence on this process, and as someone else pointed out, the US has done a fair job of decreasing CO2 emissions, saving forests, eliminating CFC's (another issue altogether), etc. Unfortunately, not everyone on Earth is on the same page on this one (see China).

 

There are many interesting theories on decreasing the CO2 we have, such as the IRONEX experiment of a few years ago. Iron is a micronutrient for plankton in the oceans, so seeding the ocean with iron complexes cause the plankton to bloom, the plankton use the CO2 in the atmosphere, thus reducing providing a sink for excess CO2. There are other projects out there that talk about similar sinks for anthropogenic CO2 such as the natural calcium carbonate in the ocean. Look it up, it's pretty cool...

[RuntheDamnBall]

One thing I'd care to mention about Gore / China is that I caught the man on Charlie Rose (who happens to be the world's WORST interviewer) and Gore had some stern words on China and its consumption.

 

I think he's probably being pretty forthright in his criticism there while still recognizing the good things they are doing (their more fuel-efficient cars, etc). The movie might have made it look like he was more pro-China than his more neutral public position indicates -- which should highlight the fact that though this is "his" movie, he didn't direct it. I think he is quick to point out, in the same way, what good people in this country are doing, and how much more we're capable of -- that's all.

 

Another thing: China, following our 20th c. example, is obtaining a lot of its resources from Latin America. India is doing more with Latin Am's human resources. There was a good Thomas Friedman column yesterday about how the region should look to India for its example rather than let itself fall into dependency on China. I think this bears watching in the future with regard to our environment and many other matters.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

There are really two issues here as far as I see it:

 

1. Global warming-  It is a fact that natural and anthropogenic gases increase the ability of our atmosphere to retain solar radiation. PERIOD.

 

As finknottle alluded to earlier, one of the large problems encountered by changing the global temperatures even a few degrees is the threat to thermohaline circulation in the oceans. The oceans don't just slosh around, they are a very complex system. In a nutshell it works like this:

 

The gulf stream brings warm salty water from the equator north where it is cools. Sea water is more dense as its temperature decreases and salinity increases. This natural sinking of the cooler, saltier water drives what is known as the conveyor, and drives ocean ciruculation, which in turn drives weather patterns for the entire earth.

 

Now if the temperature of the Earth increases to where more fresh water from the ice caps dilutes the waters to where they are not salty enough to sink in the north, the entire process shuts down. The conveyor stops running, ocean patterns change, weather conditions get much colder, and then we are in a bit of a tight spot.

 

This is not a myth, it HAS happened in the past. Using sediment cores from the deep oceans, science has shown the conveyor shutdown as a major component in past climate shifts in Earth's past.

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You just described the movie "Day After Tomorrow"...

 

...which is why I want to add, although it's NOT a myth and HAS happened in the past, it usually takes longer than five days.

[TheMadCap]

You just described the movie "Day After Tomorrow"...

 

...which is why I want to add, although it's NOT a myth and HAS happened in the past, it usually takes longer than five days. 

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It defintely takes longer than five days, was that the basis of that movie??? I never in fact watched it. No wonder most people don't have a good understanding of the facts of global warming, when you have garbage like that being mass produced...