SuperKillerRobots
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Chris Kelsay is well deserving of a big contract extension.
He is obviously well respected among players and coaches, as he is a multiple time team captain selection.
He has never been an off the field issue, he doesn't complain, and provides solid veteran leadership.
Even if you don't think he is an elite player, the fact is the Bills have to play someone at outside linebacker. Look at the other outside linebackers on the team - Ellis, Torbor, and Maybin? It's not realistic to cut the entire group in one offseason.
You have to pay somebody to pay outside linebacker for the Buffalo Bills, so it might as well be a good, hard working guy like Chris Kelsay.
I agree with this thinking, even though I don't like what Kelsey does on the field. You know he's going to know the scheme, practice hard, and be a leader. Maybe when they get a guy to play that position who has some talent, he'll learn how to be a professional from Kelsey.
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If you all vote me in for the G.M. position then here is what I would give to you.
1- I would get a trade done for Jackson by week 5.
2- I would cut Edwards, he needs to just be gone.
3- I would sign two decent free agents to help the defense and one WR.
4- In the draft I would do the following, assuming we have a top 3 pick.
With the first pick I take QB
Then I trade my two 3rd round picks to get back into 1st round and get stud LT
2nd round I go RT
4th round I go Center
5th round I go another QB
6th and 7th round I go depth, or best available player.
We have to get the QB and Offensive Line fixed. Please vote me into G.M. I know what I am doing..!
Good enthusiasm, but we still will have Chris Kelsey covering the TE and RBs out of the flat. Or at best, if you sign a guy to do that, we have some stopgap guy there. As far as I'm concerned this team goes nowhere unless they can get a OLB who has some athleticism and bulk. He doesn't have to be able to shut down Gates or Finley either - just keep them in check on a few plays a game so the other team can't go to them at will.
I don't think you can trade back into the 1st round with 2 3rd rounders, but that's not the point I'm going to make. I don't think we're as bad at LT as we are at RT and I'd definitely, at this point, go OLB before LT or RT unless the value was way off.
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I was just wondering what way the Bills fans would go if we had (or might i say) when we have the 1st pick in next years draft .
Not that i have lost all hope yet
, but with the general thought in the media and around the league being what it is i'm trying to be realistic .I for one am thinking our best pick would be Ryan Mallet (if he comes out) he's got a strong arm - gun slinger type mentality - tall and athletic , the only short coming that i've read about is he needs to work on his accuracy .
Jake Lockers stock is dropping pretty quickly seeing his performance this ear has been less than stellar . If Mallets not there at #1 then i'm not sure where i'd go.
But i know you all will tell me where to go cause i always feel the love from the Bills faithful .
So what's your pick ?????
Depending on how the QBs fall out, I think the first two picks (in no order right now) have to be OLB and QB. Before the season started the only player on the team I thought could stop us from drafting a QB in round 1 was Trent Edwards playing like Payton Manning. Little did anyone suspect that it would be Chris Kelsey's play that potentially forces us to take an OLB #1; he's just awful at what they ask him to do. Don't get me wrong - I want a new QB as early as possible, I just don't know if it makes more sense to go QB then OLB or OLB then QB. I think LT has fallen off the absolute needs list and onto the probable needs list, which puts two or three positions ahead of it. I actually think we need an RT before an LT.
Any talk of DeMarcus Love, OT from Arkansas? Ryan Mallett would be a nice pick if Luck stays planted in college another year, but Love is a bona-fide stud at LT and has handled Mallett's blind-side this season with a high degree of success. He was a G, but made the move to LT because of his excellent strength and speed. It would enable us to use him at LT w/ Bell moving to the right, a position better suited for him as he has had issues with power rushers so far in his career. At least whoever starts at QB next year would see the man coming instead of getting Clay Matthews-ed 3 times a game w/o warning.
Just noticed yer post. I like your train of thought, but know where you come from w/ the low expectations of our FO. A franchise QB doesn't come around too often and it looks like their might be two in this draft (Luck, Mallett) with a 3rd (Locker) with high potential (boom/bust potential). That being said, if we take one of them, what is to stop them from getting dropped 6 times a game. We need OL help more than anyone in the league. Wood and Levitre (maybe?!) are the only two starters that I could see starting for another team. Bell is a back-up with potential and Hangartner is bench fodder. Green is, simply put, not worth the salary or space on the roster at this point. Is Jamon Meredith that bad that we have to continue to watch a Raiders (!!!!) cast-off start for us at RT?
I think the asnwer is becoming yes.
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Ah there it is. The obligatory "get rid of Hang Man" post.
Sad thing is, Hang Man probably grades out the highest of anyone on our OL after 2 games. What I saw was Hang Man helping Howard and Wood getting abused. I still don't think Wood is fully back.
Why move Wood to center right now? Maybe we do that next year after he works on it during preseason?
Levitre does not look like a tackle in the NFL. He is athletic enough but a bit small and with short arms. He is a gaurd in the NFL and if you are watching he also has been struggling a bit.
As for the others:
Bell is looking ok but he cannot finish a game. When he comes out Meredith is a huge drop off.
Green looks like a turnstile in the same style as Kirk Chambers.
I have been noticing the same thing with Bell - he actually looks decent. It's possible he works out after all to a some extent. Meredith on the other hand is a huge dissapointment. I guess there's no need to second-guess GB's releasing of draft picks.
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This has been hit from many angles and your's puts a stronger emphasis on not blaming the players. There are faults there like ignoring the last 3 years of Trent's game footage and expecting something different this year.
The blame however really should fall on the front office. Nix is now included in that front office. There are two scenarios that could be at play there. One is that the front office really is that stupid and thought that they could hit the lottery again by developing a practice squad guy into a probowl LT and getting by on overpaid mediocre talent. WE NEED STAR LEVEL TALENT TO COMPETE. This means that Ralph needs to open up the purse. Let the moths fly out and spend some of those gold pieces he has been hanging onto to since the dark ages when he was a little boy. That scenario is about being cheap and putting the bare minimum product on the field to keep the fans interested.
The other scenario is that Ralph is preparing for an uncapped 2011. The Bills haven't done crap since free agency as we know it was instituted. Maybe Ralph is stock piling money and preparing for the inevitable dooms day when the Jerry Jones and Daniel Schneiders of the NFL world spend themselves into oblivion. The owners and players are morons. Unless they can get all of their issues worked out EVERYONE will lose money. They are arguing over percentages. What they don't realize is that the whole pie will get smaller as fans lose interest. Fans will lose interest as they tire of the continued squabbles over money and the inevitable lack of parity when wealthier big market owners can buy championships.
I was thinking the second scenario would be that they purposely went into the season with the idea that one of the QBs ont he roster would have a great year and get re-signed or the team would tank and they'd get they're pick of players at the top of the draft in 2011. The early 90s Bills would never have been very good without all those bad years in the early and mid 80s.
Also, I remember in the late 90s when we picked up a lot of good FAs every year. How can you say Ralph never did anything in FA? One of the best WRs in team history was an FA (Lofton).
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The fans don't deserve this and the players don't deserve this. Upper management (which obviously included the owner) deserves everything the media is dishing out right now. I place no responsibility on the players anymore because for the past few years, they are the ones who have been put in a position to fail. Is it Edwards fault he was never good? Is it Maybin's fault he was drafted when he was? Is it Whitner's fault he should have never been picked there? Go right down the line (including the coaches) and you just see such a void of talent and lack of football knowledge across the board.
I never got mad after the first two games this year knowing they would be pretty bad and now I am going to enjoy the abuse ownership will get for the remainder of the season. Sound harsh..tough luck. My money is being spent on crap and although I will continue to attend,I will sit back and watch this organization get blasted for the remainder of the season. They are the ones who deserve the abuse after trying to barely get by with the talent they put out there.
Who cares what anyone is saying about the FO? Even of the people that thought we might do halfway decently (or dare I say, well), they had to know that it was at least possible that this scenario currently playing out could potentially play out. The entire team deserves what it gets at this point.
And to answer your questions, yes it is Trent's fault that he sucks. Who else's fault would it be? Same for Maybin. I get the argument that it's the FO's job to pick the players where they deserve to be picked, but the player still has to show up and play - that's on him. These guys all have physical talent or else they wouldn't get drafted. It's incumbent on these players to try to get better and on the coaching staff to try to make them better (and the FO to draft them in the best spot). I just don't think any one (or two) aspects of the team deserves a pass.
But I guess things might be different if we had traded for Jason Campbell to address our QB situation (there were so many options out there) /sarcasm
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With the benching this week of Trent Edwards here & Kevin Kolb in Philadelphia the 2007 QB class could be the worst ever. Now there have been other drafts that produced no starters, but I can't remember one that featured a colossal bust on top with other high busts.
Here's that draft:
#1 Oakland-JaMarcus Russell -total bust out of the league.
#22 Cleveland-Brady Quinn-on Denver's bench sent away from Cleveland for little in return
#36 Philadelphia-Kevin Kolb-Now on Eagles bench
#40 Miami-John Beck-Cut by Dolphins, now on 3rd team on bench(Washington)
#43 Detroit-Drew Stanton-3rd stringer, never has been in contention to start
#92 Buffalo-Trent Edwards-you know his story
#151 Cincinnati-Jeff Rowe-1 year as 3rd stringer waived 3 times-out of NFL
#174 Baltimore-Troy Smith-Waived by Baltimore this year, 3rd stringer on 49ers
#205 Washington-Jordan Palmer-Waived as a rookie, backup on Cincinnati to keep his brother happy
#217 Minnesota-Tyler Thigpen-Waived by Vikings, had a brief moment in the sun starting for KC, then jettisoned for a low pick, now 3rd string in Miami. The great white hope of stat boys who want him on the Bills because he once started for Chan (as OC) even though KC only won 2 games that year.
Undrafted: Matt Moore-waived by Dallas, picked up by Carolina-just benched.
It's funny because Trent is the second best QB from that class.
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gailey is wishy-washy? sullivan wants to see edwards against new england again? or he doesn't? what?
the guy is like the soviet news service. same line, over and over. often right about racism in watts and not much else. i get the line that the bills are a dysfunctional franchise. the proof is unfortunately in the pudding. however this article is pure nonsense.
http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/columns/jerry-sullivan/article196311.ece
I thought Sully has been calling fr Trent's head for the past two years. Now he gets benched, at a reasonably early time in the season, and Sully is going to have a problem with it? I wonder if the editors just force him to write these crazy anti-Bills articles to sell papers; he hates it, but loves the job too much to leave. It could make for some good HBO hour long drama.
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Factoid of the Week That May Interest Only Me
Mike Florio of Profootballtalk.com ran the team-by-team salary-cap figures on his site Sunday. What intrigued me is that the last two teams on the list -- Tampa Bay ($80.8 million) and Kansas City ($84.5 million) -- are 2-0, and two of the four highest-paying teams -- Dallas ($166.5 million) and Minnesota ($143.4 million) are 0-2.
In other words, lets give this small market team crap a break. How much more evidence do we need to indict Ralph Wilson on all charges of running one of those mismanaged NFL franchises in history. Aside from our Bill Polian orchestrated days of dominance, the Bills have been astonishingly mediocre. It all goes back to this guy. And without going on a rant about all of the examples of this, I'll just circle back to Peter King's column.
Unbeknownst to Peter, many of the players/coaches he has been praising frequently this season....shock...were once members of the Bills, written off by the management and sometimes by the fans. I'll just start with a short list, that will likely expand as the weeks go by.
-Gregg Williams
-Alex Van Pelt
-Anthony Hargrove
-Jabari Greer
-Richie Incognito
Not to mention the huge list of young players PK mentions that were on record as supposedly being on the Bills radar on draft day, yet passed over in favor of the guys I need not mention.
Anyways, you can bash PK all you want. Don't care about that. I'm just using his column as a point of record. Fact is, I'm not so sure the Bills improve with the current ownership situation. Many players, coaches and GMs have come and gone over the course of the Bills history. But, there has been one common denominator. And I'm not sure anything changes until Ralph Wilson moves on.
I see what you're saying and respect the hell out of PK, but I don't think your point hold sup that well unless you come up with some sort of comparison to other teams in the league missing the boat on players/coaches.
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To be honest, I think this is too soon. I am not a Trent supporter, however I think that a lot of last week was more the OLine and WR than him. I don't think Trent is the answer, but I would have given him until week 4 and remove all doubt going forward.
Sorry, just one bad game, two games into the season under the new regime seems like a coach feeling pressure move.
I was kind of thinking the same thing. I thought Edwards played well enough last game to not get benched at this point. Those two INTs were both on the WRs - I wonder if Steve Johnson is getting the start this week.
I had hoped to see more out of Edwards this year and after that first game I concluded that he just doesn't look like a top 15 QB in that he doesn't really add anything to the equation. He's good enough to get it done when he doesn't have to carry the team, but without a defense and a big stud WR/TE, he's never going to do anything spectacular.
I would've been OK with giving him until the bye to sort things out, but if he isn't the QB that they want to move forward with, I get dumping him this early and just trying to win games as opposed to trying to develop him or another QB. I'm starting to think they didn't want a QB this year because they wanted to sort out the other positions on the team and not have to worry about getting a top draft pick killed. I think this scenario is almost exactly what would have worked to Edwards advantage had he come into the league in that sort of situation, not that it makes a difference now.
By the way, is it just me or is Edwards starting to look like Losman out there? First the hair and the sideburns and then it seemed like whenever they showed his face in the first half he had that deer-in-the-headlights-JP Losman-look. I feel like we've watched two people (not just football players) be completely defeated - battered, bruised, and discouraged - over the course of 5 or so years to the point where they look like they don't even want to be football players so much anymore. Playing QB for the Bills this decade must be demoralizing.
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The only problem is Jim's plan everytime I hear it is that if RW passes b4 he sells they will have to be high bid. I hope his friends have the deepest pockets in the country!! And RW has never publicly said he will sell b4 he dies.
I want to beleive him but that is the facts.
BTW nice post and thanks
To be fair on this, Ralph has never said his estate would sell to the highest bidder, just that his estate would sell. It's possible that there is already an agreement in place to sell the team based on a certain affrodable-in-Buffalo multiplier after Ralph passes. It's possible that Ralph thinks the league would push back on this type of setup if it were out in the open (and possibly pit the other owners against him even more), so he's keeping it quiet.
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Did anyone else pick up on Nix's MMQB Club question and answer session when he was asked about comparing McNabb's vettern performance in the win vesus Edwards' skitish performmance in our loss? His answer started out with something about McNabb's completion percentage (being less than or right about 50%) and said that those stats won't win you many games. Then went on to say, "I'm not a Donovan McNabb guy." He then backtracks to talk about how McNabb is a professional and has done it for a while.
I thought it was interesting that he said he wasn't a fan of McNabb, given all of the talk about trading for him in the offseason and how we were supposed to be after him. I wonder if that was true. I wonder if Nix thinks McNabb is past his expiration date so to speak.
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You have to believe we are going to see a change at RT some time soon. Even Nix made fun of Green in his interview. The sad thing is Wang is really more of a LT. He is still a few weeks away from playing. Meredith is only 304, Wang is 301. Howard id the biggest at 314 but least experienced. Urbik is a possibility but does not know our system. I don't think there is anyone we can just pick up. I am thinking Meredith is the least worst option. What do you guts think.
My guess is that until Bell can prove that he can play a whole game without needing to be relieved, nothing will change. If they put Meredith on the right side, who comes in for Bell? Not to mention, I don't think Meredith is an upgrade over Green either. I think the ebst chance is either Urbik or Howard showing something in practice - enough to get them a chance. I don't think Wang will see the active roster this year at all. He's going to watch and learn.
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I'm usually a glass is half full, optimistic type of fan and do spend time here coming to the defense of players and coaches (probably more than is sensical) when people start bashing them. I usually try to figure out the reasons for moves this teams makes and how those moves are going to help the team win. I'm sure you all know what I'm talking about, whether you agree with me or not.
That being said, I thought it would make mroe sense for me to provide a list of things I didn't like than what I did, since that might be more interesting for everyone to read (it's like having a Republican strategist analyze the democrat's strategy - not to get political).
Here's what I didn't like, keeping in mind that nothing I liked wiill be included in this post:
- Trent Edwards: I've defended Trent in the past, probably mostly because I want him to do well more than I think he will. I have not given up on him completely, but to say I was dissapointed with how he played would be an understatement. He looked gun-shy. he had open receivers down field, but would not make the plays. I don't know why he didn't throw the ball to Steve Johnson in the first half when he was open on single coverage. I don't knwo why Roscoe didn't get more balls thrown his way. I get that a portion of this has to get blamed on Gailey for not callign the best plays, but Edwards needs to make plays that can be made and he didn't. It's not uncorrectable, just dissapointing to see that from him when he's supposed to be a "renewed" QB. Watch out for the 1st round QB next year - we run away with that game if we had even Matt Stafford playing QB.
- Kelsey: I like Kelsey for what he does well enough and am probably in the minority or fans who are not terribly upset about his contract vs. production. I still even feel he has a place on this team, this year. That place however, is not as an OLB in coverage. he was pretty dreadful trying to tackle people in space (as he should be for someone who's never done it before). This guy should be primarily the DE in the sub package 4-2 and 4-1 looks - maybe even some 3-2 and 3-1 looks. He has no business playing OLB unless it's an obvious running situation or he's blitzing. Who knows though, maybe he'll get better as he gets more practice at it.
- Offensive Game Plan: CJ should not have started this game or played as much as he did in the first half. Jackson looked pretty good running the football and was better suited to get the type of yards that were there to be gotten in that game. Ditto for Marshawn. CJ looks more like a change of pace, 5 touches - 2 big plays and a TD type of player at this point. He'll get better, but there's no need for him to learn on the job when it's costing the Bills wins or potential wins.
Terrance McGee as #1 CB: Just let McKelvin take over the outside spot and draw the top WR from the other team. He's ready and more than able to do it. McGee is not a bad player, but doesn't have the size to cover anyone over 6'1" and 220 lbs. He gets pushed around way too much and isn't fast enough or quick enough in the short area to recover against bigger players. McGee belongs in the slot.
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A lot of posters on this board get a "woody" bashing Kelsay all the time.
Kelsay is no pro bowler. But, he's no slouch either. Maybe it's because he doesn't have a lot of sacks. Can you name more than a handful of LDEs that do?
OK, he's not the perfect DE. But, the fact is he's still a starter for the Bills. He's started for 7 seasons at LDE and missed only 2 games... How many starting DEs can say that? He's on his 4th GM and his 4th head coach, and he's still standing and starting. Are 4 Gms and 4 HCs totally stupid and the bashers smart? Now, Kelsay, in his 8th season is asked to convert to OLB in a 3-4 defense after playing his entire at DE career in a 4-3, and welcomes the challenge.
This just in folks, Kelsay is not what's wrong with the Bills. The Bills defense is not what is wrong with the Bills. The special teams are not what is wrong with the Bills. The Bills offense is the single biggest problem the Bills have... in particular, the QB and OTs, in that order.
So... if you want to bash a Bills player, why would you pick on Kelsay? There are at least 20 players other than Kelsay that you could shred.
4 GMs and 4 Coaches have liked Kelsay's body of work and his peers elected him captain again. That's fact. Do you think they're all stupid?
Normally I'm all about not being too hard on the whipping boy players on this team because they are all given far too little credit for what they do. I even share that opinion of Kelsey to a certain extent.
That being said, you picked a poor week to post this because Kelsey looked terrible whenever he was 5 yards past the LOS. He also blew a few run assignments that were costly. I'm willing to give him a chance or two more, but he's not getting aa pass from me either. He sucked bad.
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I'm partial to Lindsay Soto of the NFL network. I also like the dark haired chick on the NFLN redzone/sunday ticket commercial. (the one where they keep changing jerseys)
She's just the best, isn't she?
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No offense, but after seeing Kelsay at 4-3 DE last 5 years, how would anyone think that he would be ok as OLB in a 3-4?
Very few people focused on Gailey's comments on switching to a 3-4. He said that the reason he did it is that in his observation of the roster, he felt that the talent was more condusive for a 3-4. Then they go ahead and draft entirely for defense, even though the talent at hand was better suited for a 3-4? The story doesn't wash with the actions.
That's why the thread "Why not clean for real" makes esnse. If you're committed to rebuilding, then do it right. Why continue with the charade that Kelsay has a spot on this revamped roster? You can look equally pathetic with project rookies that can hopefully grow into the new system that you're putting in.
You lie! I'd love to see you find a link to that quote because I know it doesn't exist. He said soemthing to the effect of it being mroe trouble for offenses to play against and guess where the pressure is coming from. I never heard anything about him thinking the team had the personnel for it.
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Fred sees spaces and attacks them better than Marshawn or CJ. Please start him and use the other two as a change up. Also at least three times Edwards had to redirect CJ to get him in position before the snap.
I thought the same thing after the first half. I think it was a mistake to put everything on CJ's back right away. He should be used as a change of pace back at this point, so the team can let Jackson and Lynch do somethings. They both looked more decisive and patient than CJ.
Still not sure why TE lasered that screen pass to Fred on the first series though. You'd think you either softly toss it to him or put another back in there until his hand heals.
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Obviously, most of us (myself included) believe Green Bay will stomp the Bills at Lambeau. A 14-pt spread is huge, however, and the Packers will be missing Ryan Grant.
Mike Vick ran like crazy against the GB defense on Sunday; I can envision the Bills using a lot of wildcat with Jackson and Spiller as primary options.
Not suggesting by any means that the Bills will win this game, but I could see it being closer than expected.
I took the Bills and the points this weekend. It was against all my better judgement.
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The idea of calling an audible just gave Dick Jauron a hernia.
+1
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From the same article:
The Jets can take advantage of a loophole in the NFL’s blackout policy that allows team owners to get their games on local TV by buying up any unsold non-premium seats for 34 cents on the dollar.
I did not know that. I mean, I know the owners buy-up the tickets, but I did not know they could do it for 34 cents on the dollar.
...a little self serving there, and important to know whenever an owner goes out and does this, costing them just a third of the real ticket price.
The thing I wonder about is how this impacts the visiting team payout. In the NFL the gate revenue is split between the two teams playing that day 60-home, 40-visitor. I wonder how those tickets bought at .43 on the dollar are calculated into the gate revenue split.
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Well, there is never going to be any proof of it, if that's what you mean. I used to like him, and said on this board several times that I thought he was pretty good when he was on NFL Network. I noticed myself that he seemed different on ESPN, with a lot more wild claims that later didn't turn out to be true. That was before I heard first hand from a pretty well known reporter about what happened to him and why. It reinforced my opinion, and made sense, but it was still just second hand information.
Well sir, care to enlighten us to your second hand information?
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If stadiums were paid for the same way one would pay to construct an ordinary commercial piece of real estate, they wouldn't run into these problems. You don't take a 50 year mortgage on a building with an economic life of 25-30 years. You tie the loan to projected revenues from that building, not a separate building. It's just simple economics, no banker would give a construction loan to someone who doesn't have a projected revenue to pay for the loan and wouldn't extend the loan beyond the building's viability. If you build a stadium where the revenue pays for the debt within a reasonable time frame you don't get a demolished stadium with debt remaining.
This is sort of correct. One exception being that commercial short term loans are 1 to 3 years most of the time and long-term loans are never past 15 and usually for mortgages are 10 (with a balloon payment at the end that has to be refinanced). These loans would then be amatorized over a period of 20 or 30 years.
Stadium debt is done the same way, except instead of 10 or 15 year loans, they get 1 to 5 year loans with amortizations of something like 40 years. This forces refinances, but also strings along the debt for a long time. It's actually a very inefficient way of doing business because of all the changes. This is why when the economy tanks, every team with a loan feels it because they are being forced to refi their loans every few years and deal with the current economic conditions.
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Hoping For a fun season with the Bills winning 7 or 9 or 11 games. Hoping NO ONE gets hurt on our team or any other team.
No even number of wins, eh?
Since I complained about Troup (happy now)
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
I expect him and Johnson/McCargo to split Stroud's nickel and dime (4 d-linemen) reps as a DT.