Andy1
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Posts posted by Andy1
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8 hours ago, Pokebball said:
The difference, of course, is that the fetus is inside it's mother. That doesn't mean it's not a life.
We are not going to come to some kind of agreement unless we're all willing to compromise. There are hundreds of buts like the one you mention above. Can we work through all of those and find a national solution we can all live with?
I agree. Compromise is needed on all sides. I would suggest that abortion be made legal everywhere during the first 3-4 months of pregnancy. Make it illegal everywhere after 7 months. Between 4-7 months, states can do what they want.
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3 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:
What’s a “hardliner”, Andy? It’s a descriptive word, of course, but in the abortion discussion can have multiple meetings.
I am referring to those politicians whose position is no abortions period, from moment of conception, no exceptions. They equate abortion with murder.
Clearly, at some point, the fetus has viability and abortions should not be allowed beyond that point.
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7 minutes ago, Tenhigh said:
My guess is that its because most don't expect the woman to see much in the way of penalties. It's the abortion doctor that will likely face real time.
Then this is where it gets illogical and indefensible. If a woman takes her one-year old baby to a doctor to be killed, she would be charged with accessory to murder or whatever the appropriate legal charge is. Under the logic of the hardliners, a woman taking her embryo/fetus to get an abortion is doing the same thing. To treat the two scenarios differently would be admitting that an embryo/fetus is not in fact the same as a person.
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It’s interesting that no one is suggesting appropriate punishments for girls/women guilty of committing abortion. I’d bet that is probably the same response as is about to happen in republican state legislatures as they now have to deal with this hot potato. It’s easy take extreme positions on the issue when it didn’t matter because Roe was in place. Now these republicans have to make laws that will have consequences for their constituents. They will now have to send girls to prison or modify their view on the issue at the expense of disappointing the religious right.
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19 minutes ago, Buffarukus said:
i personally think the republicans are insane to push that kind of authoritarianism and are basically sabotaging their own elections by even considering anything but what the left originally said and has veered way off of. safe rare legal with a reasonable timeframe.
but i have a equally insane legal question for you. since leftists believe life begins after birth. a criminal who assaults a woman that causes her to lose a pregnancy. that cannot be murder correct? if thats the case then men who do not want a woman to carry a baby to full term can end the pregnancy and face only assault charges? its hypocritical to even suggest its murder. assault charge with a soft on crime liberal DA or 18+ years of financial responsability. not that hypocracy stops anyone nowadays
i think we as a nation need to figure out when life begins. you dont do that with a court. you do that with medical professionals and then with congress passing the consensus. funny how dem congresspeople calling for "action in the street" when they should be calling for "action at their job." but this is a great boost for a party that has litterally nothing good to run on and dont want the answers on that question. im pretty sure it would show that many of them advocated murder of children. not a good look which is why they depended on the court to do there job to begin with.
I generally agree with you. Dems who support abortion until the moment of birth are nuts and are not where most of the country is at on this issue. Roe allowed abortion without restrictions during the first 3 months of pregnancy. I think most people would agree with that. As you say though, it should be decided in congress at a national level so women have equal rights wherever they live.
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4 minutes ago, FireChans said:
Lmao.
”I just invented an entirely hypothetical scenario based on nothing, HOW CAN YOU SUPPORT THESE THING IN MY IMAGINATION!”
Well, in your opinion, what would be an appropriate punishment for the guilty woman? Religious counseling? A monetary fine? Probation? How much time in prison? I mean there has to be some punishment, right?
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I’m still wondering what the penalties will be for abortion or attempted abortion in states where it is outlawed and then, logically considered murder. In Texas, convicted murders get 5-99 years in prison and a fine of up to $10,000. Now since no God fearing republican wants to be seen as soft on crime, I would think that the poor girl or young woman (who is unable or cannot afford to travel to another state) convicted of getting an abortion would get at least 10 - 20 years in prison for committing murder of the embryo/fetus. Murder of embryo is equal to murder of a person. Are all you guys who support this ruling on board with this? This is where we are heading as a country. I’m sure the prison industry is celebrating.
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The majority of Americans want some sort of reasonable compromise on this issue, keeping abortion accessible during the early stage of pregnancy. It will be interesting to see if voters reject R politicians who take hard line positions on this issue.
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47 minutes ago, FireChans said:
Based on what? What hidden knowledge do "women" inherently possess?
As a married man, I have been taught that women do in fact have knowledge that is different from a man. Just ask a woman. They will tell you. -
1 minute ago, Pokebball said:
You are ignoring the other side of the issue. The life of the unborn. The problem with the abortion issue is one side focuses totally on the woman and the other side focuses totally on the unborn life. As long as we continue this, no solution will ever be reached.
This is a legislative issue to solve. The people need to solve it. All of us. And most certainly it shouldn't be decided by 9 robes. The SCOTUS kicked it back to us, where it belongs.
Are only men concerned about the life of the unborn? What I suggested was hypothetical of course, but I still believe that women understand this complex issue on a far deeper level than men.
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I would be ok with legislatures solving the issue provided that the voting members were all women. This is a womens health issue. If women decided the rules, we would probably get to reasonable compromise in the states.
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29 minutes ago, LeviF said:
“This is about the future of our children” is hilariously mealy-mouthed for someone who thinks children should be able to be cut up alive and sucked out of the womb on any whim of the “mother.”
Bought? Let’s say he isn’t arguing in good faith, which I’m not conceding. What makes you think he’s bought vs. out for revenge for the constant hit pieces and threats against his wife?This is obviously the response from someone who has nothing intelligent to say and who believes that 12 year old girls raped by their uncles should be forced to become mothers.
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2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:
If we learned anything this week, it's that the extreme left has been faking it and that yesterday's court decision has forced them to reveal they do really understand what a "women" is and they admit that men cannot get pregnant.
Maybe next week we're see some intelligent debate and compromise in legislatures between the extreme positions of the "right" to abortion on demand at any time during a pregnancy without limitations or conditions paid by the taxpayers vs. a complete and total ban with no exceptions. I've got confidence that can be worked through and that 99% of American's agree a proper compromise and correct decision is someplace between those two extremes.
Roe v Wade was the compromise you talk of. That is why people are so outraged about this court decision. From Roe v Wade in Wikipedia:The Court resolved these competing interests by announcing a trimester timetable to govern all abortion regulations in the United States. During the first trimester, governments could not regulate abortion at all, except to require that abortions be performed by a licensed physician. During the second trimester, governments could regulate the abortion procedure, but only for the purpose of protecting maternal health and not for protecting fetal life. After viability (which includes the third trimester of pregnancy and the last few weeks of the second trimester), abortions could be regulated and even prohibited, but only if the laws provided exceptions for abortions necessary to save the "life" or "health" of the mother.
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It’s time for young people to vote in numbers greater than they have never done before. Dems need to vote in an off year election in numbers that can overcome the gerrymandering of their districts. This is about the future of our children. I have my doubts if they will do it, but they have the opportunity to make a difference in November.
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If abortion is the murder of a human, how much prison time must women serve who get or attempt to have an abortion? If women get multiple abortions would they be eligible for the death penalty? How about the abortion of twin or multiple embryos? Republicans must now answer these questions.
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If men got pregnant, the right to have an abortion would be the 1st Amendment in the Constitutuon.
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Either:
A. Trump is mentally impaired and unable to discern fact from fiction leading him to do illegal actions.
B. Dozens of Republicans in states and in the Trump administration are lying under oath and conspiring to frame Trump.
or
C. Trump knew what he was doing was illegal and conspired with others to attempt to overturn the results of the election.
Take your choice.
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Ever hear of the Log Cabin Republicans? Unfortunately, they are finding that their party is rejecting them.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/dy7zek/texas-log-cabin-republicans-booth-banned
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Yes Manchin is not liked. He is trying his best to steer the party towards moderation (which is would be a better course for them to follow). I don’t know what’s up with Sinema. The sane dems know that if Manchin isn’t holding office and doing his thing, a Trumper will take his place. While neither are stars of the party faithful, there is no where near the hatred and anger towards them as there is towards the dissenters in the Rep party. There are now many, many good solid republicans who have supported the party all their lives who are banished into no man’s land because they disagree with Trump.
The dems are also not glorifying assault weapons in political ads. Guns in politics is a horrible combination that is not going to help our democracy.
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What I don’t understand is how anyone who speaks a word against Trump is immediately labeled a rino. Any deviation from total support of Trump is not allowed. If you are a public official, you can then expect piles of death threats from Trump supporters. This pattern has been repeated over and over with anyone who dares speak against the orange guy. Now there is a R candidate airing an ad busting into a house to kill rinos. Where does the insanity end? The glorification of guns and violence in political advertising is part of the problem. Some nut job is going to follow the hint.
Within the dem party, people speak out against Biden all the time, but they are not ostracized from the party.
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Never count on young voters showing up for mid-term elections. They are not reliable. Opposition R party has the motivated voters.
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Interesting ruling. I wonder how long it will be before people freak out that their tax dollars are funding Muslim schools somewhere. I could see the same people celebrating this ruling screaming in the future about their tax dollars funding the teaching of Sharia law in Muslim schools. I’m not sure how I feel about this ruling but I generally prefer that church and state stay separate. It’s best for both institutions.
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These words are from Mike Florio at PFT and struck me as being appropriate for this day.
“Yes, today is a day meant for all fathers to be appreciated. It also should be a day when all fathers recommit to their obligations and responsibilities. To realize that everything we say and do creates an example that could be emulated by anyone who witnesses it. To take a little bit of pride in who we are while also resolving to constantly strive to become better versions of ourselves.”
Like McDermott asks players to commit to being the best versions of themselves, we should strive to do so for our children.
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If Hillary Clinton can respect the investigative powers of congress and testify for 8 hours at the Benghazi hearings, there is no legitimate reason why Trump administration officials refuse to testify on this matter.
Roe vs Wade Overturned
in Politics, Polls, and Pundits
Posted
When it comes to morality, hypocrites are everywhere, including in the church. The louder people shout about an issue, the more likely they are a hypocrite about it.