Rochesterfan
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On 8/25/2025 at 8:20 PM, BillsFanForever19 said:
I'm assuming White unless he thinks he has a better opportunity being another team's PS QB.
Buechele playing the entire game and White sitting to me is more important than how Buechele performed against the players Tampa Bay are also going to cut.
I hear you - I just thought White sitting was always more of a prevent injury so he could get cut.
Steve was their PS 2 years ago and that was the plan last year barring the injury that shelved him for the year - so it is no surprise he is back on the PS.
I don’t think the Bills harbor any ideas he will develop and become a true back-up level player - I just think they like his intelligence and how he handles being the scout team QB and the things he can do as a number 3.
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3 hours ago, Rocky Landing said:
They dropped Keleki Latu (who made some nice plays blocking, and on ST) off the PS, I assume to make room Poyer. A bit surprising to me, as there are no TEs now on the PS. I suspect this PS is not altogether set...
Where did you see this?
The list the Bills provided from the official site had both Poyer and Latu + so he definitely did not get cut for Poyer as they had 16 guys and one was an IPP so they still had one slot if wanted.
I agree it is not fully set as the Bills use it to keep lots of guys engaged - so they will add and cut many times and there were rumors of 2 additional guys the Bills were trying to sign that have not been announced, but it had nothing to do with Poyer if it is true. I just can’t find it. Everything points to him being on the PS.
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2 hours ago, Sojourner said:
You can have no interest in developing a QB, no dispute there. But when you have a superstar QB, the development comes from mentoring and guidance from the guy above him as much as it does coaching staff. The point isn’t about drafting a guy to replace or “become the next Josh” but rather an insurance policy incase something happens because if it does this team isn’t going to win much.
The point isn’t every year but once in a while to take a flier on a guy you have as that insurance or are able to exchange for future draft pick/s to get another shot at a Milano, Taron, Shakir or Benford…
Mitch was dreadful in Pittsburgh, a team that is very friendly for a QB. They moved on to Kenny Pickett because he wasn’t doing enough, which even then had to be pretty minimal. If you believe Mitch can be successful at leading us to multiple wins if Josh is unavailable, more power to you. I was in that camp prior to his Pittsburgh 2 year deal. Not anymore. There’s better options out there. Grooming a backup versus a guy who’s played a ton of football and done so very averagely since his Sophomore year seems like a smarter option. Especially when you revert it back to your point about rather having a chance at more late round gems; you could get something for him.
I have 2 issues with the above:1) When Mitch was in Pittsburgh it was with Canada as OC and it was hilariously bad for QBs. None of the QBs played well and guys that had been there got worse. With the o-line and lack of creativity, Mitch looked just like all the other QBs in Pittsburgh. He will be fine for his role here.
2) The reason they don’t draft many QBs is because of roster builds. They do not want a QB that needs time to develop taking up a roster spot and they are correct. The Bills keep 2 QB on the roster and want a starter and a guy they can insert and hold on to a win if required. They also want an experienced QB that can talk with Josh and they can see what the defense is doing to make adjustments.
People would lose their minds had the Bills wasted a 5th rd pick on a guy like Milton just to cut and try to put on the PS. If they are going with a young QB, they want an UDFA or 7th round guy that can go to the PS and develop and they have that in Shane. The return also hasn’t been worth it. Milton and another player were traded for a 5th rd pick that was barely 20 spots in front of where he was picked. NE lost value overall on the trade and although they have drafted several QBs since near the end of Brady - very few have even netted anything close to the draft capital and has been an over net negative.
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1 minute ago, BillsFanForever19 said:
No surprise - He or White will be on the PS. Without the injury last year - he would have been the PS QB - so it is not surprising if he returns to that role.
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4 hours ago, Logic said:
From the posted article:
"Consider this. Sanders fell (we were told after the draft) because he viewed the pre-draft process as he was being recruited, not as he was being interviewed. He was essentially pushing back against the “honor and a privilege” nonsense. If his approach had been ratified by a high selection in the draft, others may have done the same.
And the NFL does not want the cyborgs to become self-aware.
So it’s not crazy. In the hidden (until it wasn’t) collusion ruling, the arbitrator found that the NFL’s Management Council, with the blessing of the Commissioner, encouraged teams as a result of the Watson contract to resist fully-guaranteed contracts. Would it be nuts to think that the league, which has made the draft into a massive offseason tentpole event by perpetuating the notion that it’s a Harry Potter sorting-hat ceremony, will react negatively to any player who doesn’t play along?
“It’s a job interview.” We hear it every year. Players get poked and prodded and interrogated and scrutinized. For the system to work, the players need to submit. If they ever realize the power that comes from saying, “It’s an honor and a privilege for you to be able to employ us,” the whole thing could fall apart.
It’s all about power. It’s all about showing those who don’t have the power that there are consequences to not yielding to the power."
Yeah - he acted like a jerk in what is considered to be a job interview and that caused him to fall - exactly as it should be. If he was truly a #1 - the Browns would be finding a way to start him rather than having to figure out if he or Gabriel will be back-up/3 rd string to Joe Flacco.
The fact is guys that have skipped the draft process and guys have treated the pre-draft process poorly have still been drafted high in the past if they had elite talent. If you have mediocre talent, and less actual training than others - those players have fallen.
Sanders has a chance to prove people wrong and it has started with 2 speeding tickets and some highlights and bad plays. He still has a long way to go.
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34 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:
You clearly missed the point of my post. My post wasn’t about releasing guys prior to the last pre-season game, but illustrating how lousy a significant piece of the “depth” is.
You posted in a courteous cut thread started by a guy talking about cuts prior to this game so they can catch on elsewhere - with a post about guys to cut and - I missed the point. 🤦♂️
You also point out how lousy the depth is by naming depth guys that have been around the league - so guys that multiple GMs have considered to be depth. It is a bad point and shows nothing. Depth is exactly what is guys - guys to become available when you break glass and if you go around the league you can do the same thing on every roster with guys much worse than this.
So overall - I guess I think you are just wrong about it - which is why I disagreed.
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14 hours ago, GASabresIUFan said:
to the posters who disagree with me, which guys on this list would you miss if they were cut tomorrow? Which of these guys, beside Tre White, will get significant PT even if they make the team? Maybe Moore if he builds some chemistry with Josh?
I think most who disagree just think it is a stupid post pre final preseason game.
Let’s cut all of these guys that are going to make the 53 as back-ups and then do what play our starters the entire 4 quarters on Saturday.
Lets look at it.
Yes - brilliant lets cut both back-up QBs one of which will make the 53, 2 WRs one of which most likely makes the 53, and a back-up tackle that will either make the 53 or be trade fodder, but your brilliant plan is to cut them now.
On Defense - let’s cut a young DL that will most likely make the 53 to cover suspensions and the guy that won’t count on the roster while suspended so he becomes a pickup later if injuries hit. Back-up LBs that will play a ton of snaps and STs this weekend, and several DBs including guys that not only will play a ton this weekend, but 1 of whom has a good shot at starting game 1.
Therefore - I disagreed with you because the timing and the names make no sense to cut these guys with a game coming up tomorrow. It is also stupid as at least 5 of those guys are making the 53 - so why in the heck am I giving them a courteous cut in the middle of the week before the 3rd preseason game.
If all those guys were cut today - yeah I would notice as we would not have enough backup to cover the 4 quarters and I hope and pray we don’t see any of them in the regular season because that means we finally got healthy, but I imagine some of them will have impacts good or bad as back-up on this team.
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18 hours ago, MasterStrategist said:
Not sure Bill is correct in saying "severe" agent inflation, re: gtd money.
Essentially the only piece being "double counted", is the prior 2025 cash he was due --- $5.3m.
So $25m of additional guaranteed money. And as mentioned a couple posts above, Buffalo can get out of the deal "favorably" cap wise in the final year.
16 hours ago, MasterStrategist said:@Rochesterfan, not sure why you disagreed on my post...
The math is the math:
1. Prior to new deal: Cook would have been paid $5.3m cash this season
2. New deal:
a. $15m guaranteed at signing in 2025
b. essentially another $10m guaranteed by day 5 of 2026 league year
c. rest in 2027/2028
So old = 5m gtd vs new = $30m gtd (essentially $25m guaranteed by this time next season), wouldn't call that a severe overstatement by agent --- as Bill posted
It not the math - it is the agent inflation.
1st - it’s not 30 million guaranteed - it is closer to 25 million overall
2nd - The full guarantee at signing which is what he is assured is only about 15 million
3rd - the final part of his guarantee is next year and some of that guarantees part his 2027 salary not a payout.
I agree with Bill (and it happens every time) this is another case of an agent inflating what he got,
In the end he got his salary this year guaranteed (was already going to get by playing) and 9 million for a signing bonus and 5 million of 2026. His Guarantee money at signing is only 15.3 million and that to me is the big number and that is very different than let’s say Barkley (36 million) or Henry (24 million).
It is a fair deal and keeps him under 2% of the cap and less than Barkley, Henry, and Williams on their deals. Once the details dropped - as it typically the agent greatly overinflated the value of the deal to make the math come out and allow him to rank the deal highly for RBs in history.
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2 hours ago, ChevyVanMiller said:
As amazing as the 2nd half scoring output was, the defense was even better. The Bandits held the Rush scoreless for 2 1/2 quarters. They collapse on the ball carrier so well and keep the shooting lanes clear for goalie Matt Vinc.
Vinc becomes the only person with two three-peats, for two different teams no less, and cements himself as the greatest lacrosse goalie of all time.
For those of you who came along for the ride in this thread, thank you. For those of you who aren’t watching the Bandits you are missing out on an all- time great franchise. It’s so amazing to see a Buffalo team come up big in the biggest moments and hold the championship trophy aloft in front of an adoring hometown crowd.
I hope we all live to see the Bills and Sabres do the same.
Go Bandits!
This is especially true after they came up small in their 1st 2 trips to the finals during this run.
To go to 5 straight and win the last 3 and be that clutch is just awesome.
I just can’t wait for another banner raising.
I am so happy my daughter came to NLL lacrosse later or she would be a Knighthawks fan here in Rochester, but coming on later as this run started she bleeds Orange and Black for Lacrosse.
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3 hours ago, ChevyVanMiller said:
Spurrier once asked a question when he was the Redskins coach that I'd still like an answer to: "If we're paying 53 guys why can't we dress them all on game day?"
That is easy - it was originally put into place to help balance teams rosters with injuries.
Team A has 4 guys injured, but not on IR - which used to be for the season - and Team B was healthy - then the healthy team would have 4 additional rostered players to play. By limiting the 53 - it allowed both teams to have 48 rostered healthy players to keep balance and allow the injured players to sit.
Team A could sit 4 injured players and a Healy guy, while team B had to sit 5 healthy guys, but now both teams have the same number that can play with no advantages and no one forcing an injured player to dress - just in case.
It does need to be re-evaluated with the practice squad call-ups and the ability to use of returning IR in season.
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It would be very interesting if they can get Rodgers on a contract similar to Russ in Pittsburgh and can do the same thing with Adams at WR.
I think with the NYG OL, Rodgers could have a bit more time.
I do worry that similar to the NYJ - bringing in Rodgers and Adams could set back Nabors like it did with Garrett Wilson and now he wants out.
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And what if instead of this stupid thought process that the “fans” have - we look at the fact that Josh seems to really like playing for McD and Beane.
Maybe he has spoken to ownership and stated his preference to play for these guys.
Maybe - he realizes that the last several years he has had the ball at the end of the game with a shot to tie or win and the lack of plays has been on him and the offense. He is always hardest on himself and that is part of the frustration - the game has been in his hands and they have not come away with the win.
I think he realizes how much of a say he has - he gets input on players that stay and go and draft picks - he stated Coleman was his guy - he thought he would be a great fit and that is the guy they made work.
If he wanted new coaching - he could talk to Terry and would before a change is made, but I believe the exact opposite - I think Josh likes McD and the freedom he gives the team and that helps ground him here. I also think you are more likely to see Josh leave if we make a change to a coach that doesn’t foster his attitude - someone like Bill Beli and his attitude.
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38 minutes ago, Gregg said:
Beane deserves his share of the blame as well. He has missed on his picks to much in the early rounds of the draft. The Bills have a good roster but not a great one. We have no "game changers" on defense. Von was supposed to be that guy but the injury and now age have prevented that.
Everyone complains that McD failure in the playoffs is based upon the defense and then you argue that the bills only have a good roster not a great roster and no “game changers” on defense.That means that McD must be coaching his butt off to get the second best win % in all of sports over the last 5 years and a top offense and top end defense with only a good roster and no “game changers”.
The fact that year after year the Bills have few to no Pro-Bowl players or all pros and yet McD dominates the division and wins a minimum of 1 playoff game with multiple trips to championship round and the last 2 years has the team in a 3 point game with the ball and a shot to win - tells me what I need to know.
36 minutes ago, Jrb1979 said:There is definitely a chance a new coach sets them back. It's also just as much of a chance a new coach pushes them over the hump.
This is completely false. Most coaches that take over teams become failures. It is exceedingly rare for a coach to take over a team and suddenly take them over the top. Especially as they tend to change out coaching staffs and styles - so you begin to see a lot of turnover and people out of position.
it is not unheard of, but the new coach pushing them over the top is a very limited sample size and the failure coaches are numerous- so actually getting better is probably closer to 5-10% chance with a 90-95% chance of the team getting worse.
That should not stop the change, but that mixed with the fact that the team and Allen love coach McD and the team is successful and has done more with a weaker talent base should also be part of the equation.
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On 1/27/2025 at 3:19 AM, Special K said:
Even though the Tush Push worked all season long, I thought to myself during the regular season "Maybe the Bills should run it to the right once in a while just to keep Defenses honest.", but since it always worked, I didn't give that concept much thought after a while.
When it was blatantly obvious the Chiefs were ready for the push to the left, it should've been obvious to have a call to change it up and run it to the right. Its not like running it towards Torrence and Brown would be a bad idea anyway. This is something the Bills coaching staff should've been prepared for weeks ago, but they continued to run the same play over and over again despite the fact it was not working like it usually does.
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, while expecting a different result......that was some insane play calling right there.
Do you ever think maybe - just maybe - there is a reason they go left. Like maybe the way Josh takes the snap. It is significantly easier for Josh as a right handed QB to begin to move left as it keeps his primary hand in place to receive the snap.
I think they recognize that trying to go right takes a step longer giving more time for the defense to close the gap.
Left or Right to me isn’t the issue. The issue is where are the plays off from it. Where is the fake block and Knox in the endzone for a pass?
I think going right may work sometimes, but my guess is the success rate would be significantly worse than going left for our team.
I think the biggest difference overall is the few extra microseconds it takes on the road for the offensive line to move. They were a quarter of a step late all night and I think that was the difference in the game. The crowd doesn’t necessarily mean only false starts as an impact - it also leads to just a minor change in timing and for 2 very evenly matched teams - sometimes that is the difference.
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12 minutes ago, Returntoglory said:
By all accounts , there was never a physical measurement with the sticks on that controversial run.
Wouldn't this have been a perfect scenario for a measurement??
The sticks are there this year mostly for decoration.
The NFL said prior to the year you would see less measurements because they were using the eagle eye spotting and that is what you got.
Someone above made the spot and deemed it short.
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On 1/25/2025 at 3:16 PM, Buffalo Barbarian said:
the defense knows we are going to run and it shows by how tight they stack the box but we make it 99% of the time , do it on 3rd down and 4th down if need be.
How do we feel about this now?
KC got stronger playing against it especially when it was obvious. You don’t think that there was an equally good chance the same thing happens fron 2+ yards out against Baltimore.
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6 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:
the defense knows we are going to run and it shows by how tight they stack the box but we make it 99% of the time , do it on 3rd down and 4th down if need be.
Nope - several times they rush to the line to run the play - preventing the other team from bringing in extra DL. Additionally, when the other team is not on the goal line - they still have to think about defending the entire field - so they keep LBs and safeties on the field giving the OL a huge advantage.
Down at the goal line after waiting to get the spot - Baltimore had already brought in extra DL. It was a totally different situation than even earlier when they hustled at the goal line and caught Baltimore with a standard defense and scored.
This is the second time that this happened - the first was Detroit - and neither time where the defense could substitute and get fully ready at the goal line did the Bills run the play. I think they recognized when it works and when they will have issues and they go to alternate plays.
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5 minutes ago, Magox said:
No one has been able to stop it, I think the Dolphins in one of the games stopped a 3rd and 1 and the Bills proceeded to get it on the 4th and half a yard.That tush push TD went in easily and could have gone for 3 yards.
The Bills scored easily on the TD from the 1 yard line. Not buying that at all
Until a team proves they can stop it, you continue to go for it. It is the only play in football where everyone knows it’s coming and knowing that despite that fact and that the Bills have the highest success rate that goes well into the 90% range (along with Philly), you run it until it is stopped
Disagree - it works because the Bills get them in a front where Josh has a gap. That is why the move him over - he doesn’t just go forward like Philly did.
The Bills recognize that at some times a team doesn’t have to defend most of the field - they can instead fill gaps - in those cases you do something else. The bills tried to let them rush to create a gap - it worked, but an extra blitz filled that opening and he got Josh down.
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2 hours ago, Magox said:
What I don’t understand is the Bills hesitancy to do the Allen tush push on 3rd and 2’s. When they run that play they typically get 1-3 yards, I don’t care if it’s ugly boring football it’s effective and they should absolutely be running that play every time when they are on the opponents side of the field. That’s a couple times now that I believe that play should have been run. I hope they rethink that
I believe it is a couple of reasons. The Allen QB sneak works best when they rush up and catch the opponent in a lighter box and have gaps for Allen to hit. It also works best with less than 1 yard to go.
Down at the goal line because of the time to get the ball spotted - there was time for the defense to bring in extra linemen and with little area to defend - they can bring in a lot of extra beef making it not only harder, but more dangerous for Allen. Think of the stop by Tennessee at the goal line.
Defending the end zone and defending 1 yard at midfield is very different. I think the Bills recognize that and respect the difference.
Earlier in the year at the goal line you saw a play like that and Josh went basically outside the tackle to get a gap.
If after the 2nd down run they could have rushed up and tried it - they have more success, but the ball was spotted outside the 2 causing a delay - which changed everything up and stopped momentum.
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7 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:
Chiefs haven’t scored over 30 all year ,,,
So look to score 31 on Sunday ….
Also …just heard that the last time the Chiefs turned the ball over was against us in November …. yikes !
Yikes - except the Bills had only 1 TO since the KC game - Josh’s 1 Int against NE in the endzone.
So neither team makes mistakes.
It is going to be a long, close, nerve racking game all around.
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10 hours ago, Man with No Name said:
my understanding is that you can challenge the spot, but you will technically lose because it's not a TD or 1st. They will still fix the spot, but you'll lose your TO. I went back and watched on tv, and I don't think the spot was as bad as most of us thought last night.
Though I won't commit to that position without seeing video on my computer where I can more effectively slow it down and freeze frame.
Agreed and 99% of the time even if it looks to be slightly farther - they don’t change the spot.The Bills have a former Ref making the calls from above - so I doubt it was much of anything. I would love to see some replays because I thought he was a bit closer, but man - the Refs really do a pretty good job catching it live when we think he is still up.
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13 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:
My head explodes when it's 2nd & 1, 3rd & 1, or 4th & 1 and the Bills don't do the Tush Push. It's darn near automatic and they usually end up getting 2 or 3 yards on the play. That 4th quarter drive last night where they kicked the late field goal to go up 8 is a great example. They should have Tush Pushed and they probably are in the end zone and could have saved me the end-of-game angina.
Don't get cute... Just run the Tush Push for the love of Almighty God!!!
13 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:In 1 yard situations, yes. Every time. But the frustrating thing is a lot of these situations we find ourselves in are 2 or 2 plus.
3rd and Goal from just beyond the 2 is not a given we're going to get enough push. Especially at the Goal Line and with that defensive front. In hindsight do I wish we would have tried that instead of what we ran? Sure. But that's just bc we know how it went with the play they chose.
But honestly, from the spot we were at (which was a rough spot btw) - I wouldn't have called a tush push either. Though I wouldn't have called the play we went with either. I'd have went with an under center handoff with Ray Davis.
And if we did go for a Tush Push on 3rd and didn't get in - I'd still have Kicked the FG rather than going for it on 4th anyways. This was the most situational of Situational Football.. situations. Is it possible we got it on 4th and the game was over right there? Sure.
You know what else could have happened? We could have been stopped again. And if that happened - we lose the game. Plain and simple. Simply not worth the risk.
The reason I believe for not running it - is what @BillsFanForever19 says for the most part.
The QB sneak works best when the Bills immediately run up to the line and can run it without the other team putting their big package in. The Bills did that in the Ravens game and got the yardage. It is less effective when the opponent can bring in extra guys to fill all of the gaps.
2nd I think they had decided that the FG was more important than going for a 4th down and risking losing the game with no chance - so they had 1 play from the 2 yard line with Baltimore able to bring in all of their d-line.
Everything changes if the Bills were up by 8 or less than 4 - then I think McD says we have 2 plays for the TD, but up by 5, 6, or even 7 - the FG to ensure you get another chance on offense was the right call - so you need over 2 yards on 1 play. I don’t know that is the play I want, but it was not the QB sneak from that spot against that Defense.
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21 minutes ago, HappyDays said:
What coaching errors are we pointing to from yesterday? Or in any of these playoff losses? The Ravens honestly should have controlled the game against because of a good gameplan and great 2nd half adjustments. But Harbaugh can't control for his QB and best pass catcher making multiple unforced errors.
He chased points all game failing on multiple 2 pt conversions.
He allowed the Ravens in critical situations to go away from Henry and try to score via the pass - see the 2pt plays and the FG drive.
It is not totally on Harbaugh - just as it is rarely on McD, but the buck stops with the coach and he didn’t do enough to put them in position to win and the players couldn’t pull it through.
It was 2 very evenly matched teams and one forced the other into several mistakes and that is without people acknowledging the 3rd fumble caused by Cam Lewis on the last drive that lucky for Baltimore happened to fall into the WR hands on the ground or the Bills force a 4th TO.
The Bills were obviously coached up this week especially with the weather to attack the ball and it worked.
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8 hours ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said:
I always think it’s funny how turnovers are treated like they’re just a random thing that happens instead of the result of skill and decision making.Lamar’s INT was an ill advised throw with even worse execution. On the fumble he tried being heroic instead of going to the ground. Bernard made one of the better punches at a ball that I’ve seen.
Not only that - Cam Lewis forced a fumble on the final drive also - the Ravens just got lucky the fumble landed back in the receivers hands on the ground.
The Bills knew that they were not bigger, but they are superbly coached and very disciplined and that lead to the victory.
The Bills have been playing like that all year - we are going to march down the field and get points and make few mistakes - their opponents can’t do the same - they make a mistake and that gets magnified in the playoffs.
Great job to the staff they outcoached and outplayed the opposing team once again.
8 hours ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:Question: if Ty didn’t rip off that first down on the last drive, I assume the ravens might have gotten the ball back if they held us? Did anyone do the math on the clock?
Yes that is why they had to run the ball instead of kneeling down. They could of used approximately 85 of the 93 seconds on offense without the first down.
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Eligible Receivers - 2pt Coleman Non-Catch
in The Stadium Wall
Posted
1 Million % disagree with this. Any spot challenge is very hard to win because unless they give him the 1st down - he loses the challenge. Even if they decide to move the ball 1 yard forward - if they rule him short of the 1st down - that costs us a timeout - which was way more valuable.
The spot was bad - terrible in fact- but because it is spotted at the point they begin the slide - not where he touches down - I could easily see them putting the ball 1 foot short of the line and the Bills losing the timeout. Even though they would have reset the ball nearly 1+ yards closer to the sticks.
The problem was they needed to be able to pick-up the 1st down anyway and they failed and also got a penalty - two strikes.