Buffalo716
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Posts posted by Buffalo716
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2 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:
Who was the QB that these franchises ruined? Who did we ruin during the drought? Somebody that would have done something if McD was around 15 years ag with our culture?
The comment about coaches makes no sense. Every position on earth has a leadership role people report to that provides basic structure and strategy. Every sport has a coach and even if you're elite in that role in Football, you quickly show you're worth without your star QB. Meanwhile that QB leaves and just keeps on going. Calling out Fields or Lawrence is an example of guys to justify your point makes no sense. You have to have mental make up to be successful. By your definition we can blame the Raiders for ruining Jamarcus Russell or maybe Russell is the one that couldn't hack it. This run starts and ends with Allen. It is that simple. Once his time is done we will go back to the same pool of mediocre franchises searching for a QB that we can one day credit our coach for "grooming".
There was plenty of people after one in two years on this own website who were not sold on Josh Allen
Go back to the end of his second year and there was still plenty of people not 100% sold on Josh as the future of our team in this site lol
This is not as cut and dry as we just lucked into the best player in the world.. Buffalo Bills did have to help develop him
To think Josh Allen is the best player in the world on 31 other teams is honestly kind of crazy.. he might be on a couple teams.. on 24 other teams he's not the best player in the world because they would not have developed him correctly
We can agree to disagree but it's crazy to think that if player x starts his career at spot y he's exactly the same
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21 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:
This is beyond speculation and its just plan bad speculation. Both players entered the league with historically losing franchises. Both had low talent levels and roster support. Both had poor QB rooms. Dabs might be your shiny star, but that sort of fades given what Daniel Jones is doing. While also acknowledging the fact that Dabs did nothing prior. Your pushing the warm and fuzzies into the narrative years later, when Josh himself is the largest reason for the narrative.
I'm sick of this mass credit to coaches for largely player driven, QB driven outcomes. Its the biggest farce in the NFL. You have 4-5 guys who are really good coaches and help the roster. You have a whole bunch who are average. Then you have 4-5 who likely hurt the teams they coach. Without that QB1 nobody is consistently over .500, if I'm wrong, show me the consistent playoff coach who isn't directly tied to a high output QB. Which you will likely say "because of coaching". Except when said QB leaves, the coach somehow never establishes the same level of success. It's a story as old as time yet people here actually think McD or Belichick or Reid are the glue. Even if they're top 5 guys, even of All Time, it falls apart without an MVP QB. 9 Super Bowls between them with the same two QB's.
The Jets have not developed a franchise quarterback in 60 years
The bills developed Joe Ferguson Jim Kelly and now Josh Allen .. that's three times as many quarterbacks who played for a decade
The bears have not developed a franchise quarterback in 60 years... They traded for Cutler and never developed him more
Remember Sam darnold got drafted ahead of Josh.. he has tons of talent and a good work ethic.. he is athletic he is accurate he was considered a top notch prospect ... And he went to Palmer's quarterback school too and works hard.. the difference was he was on the Jets.. and Baker was on the browns... Now does Josh have more talent than Sam? Yes, but Sam was much more polished.. and Josh needed to get polished.. which takes a team, it always has
Josh Allen did not go to the bills organization which was in futile for 17 years.. he had McDermott right out the gate who is calm and level-headed and has a plan and allows players to grow... We know that now.. 8 years ago nobody knew what kind of long-term coach McDermott would be when it comes to player development
McDermott built a culture which is a great influence on everybody on the team.. from Josh Allen to the lowest guy on the practice squad... Everybody respects everybody at one Bills drive from the coaches to the chefs to the mail guy that Josh Allen shouted out.. that is the culture that breeds winning and development
Kurt Warner is a Hall of Famer and nobody can tell me he would be the same guy if he didn't go to the Rams... In fact most of his career is not that great... But with the right coaching and team around him he was an MVP
Yes I 100% Believe Josh Allen if he got drafted by the Jets is not winning six straight AFC East titles because they are a dumpster fire... He could still be good.. he certainly doesn't become the cerebral, non turnover machine we have now
He certainly is not an MVP.. that's literally taking credit away from everybody in the bills organization who has helped build him up
Again if they didn't need coaches to make them better.. they wouldn't hire coaches... If Josh didn't think going to Palmer would help.. he wouldn't go to Palmer... McDermott has had a plan since day one and he's executed it... This site was filled with plenty of people who still were not sold on Allen one and two years in... There were plenty of people here
Look at guys like Justin fields and Trevor Lawrence.. insane talent...
to just say we lucked into the best football player of all time is kind of Silly... He had to be molded.. and he took the coaching and he became the best player in the world
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2 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:
Part of the issue is the word "coaching" because it implies Xs and Os. I always stress on here - it's a team's overall Player Development Program, of which coaching is a part, but not the only part. There is so much that goes into teaching players how to become professionals and giving them the individual support they need in order to be great. Strength and conditioning, mechanics, other physical instruction and support are part of it - but sometimes it's even more wholistic than that. Helping them eliminate bad influences (friends and family members) who are interfering with their progress. Financial literacy. Teaching them to be good leaders and good colleagues. "Coaching" doesn't capture all of this stuff - and it varies wildly from organization to organization.
Exactly it's not all just x's and o's
It's the entire building.. how do they set you up for success? Do you have a lot of people to lean on and trust? Do they allow you to make mistakes without fearing repercussion? Is the attitude of building upbeat and positive or mundane and negative? Do your coaches push you to be the best person in life? Like you said getting rid of negative influences and bad habits.. or are they okay with that if you just show up to work? Do they have a plan to fix your mechanics? Or are they just winging it... Can you take constructive criticism or not?
There's so many little things throughout a NFL teams building that could make the experience really good or really bad for players... And how the organization is ran absolutely can impact development
It 100% does
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9 hours ago, FireChans said:
I agree with largely all of this. The QB himself is 90% personally responsible for their own development and success.
the old “how would Brady and Peyton have done if they were drafted in the opposite situations” question was easy to answer. Both may have had a slightly different number of Super Bowls, but both would have still been all time QBs
Darnold is about to go back to being a backup after spending 2 seasons with two of the best offensive minds in the NFL who couldn’t hide his flaws forever.
Sam Darnold was never going to be good. Seems like a nice kid so it sucks, but that’s the way it goes.
Yeah but if Tom Brady was drafted by the Detroit Lions also not Tom Brady
That's why good coaching could make somebody who's decent look good.. good look really good.. and make someone who's really good great
Bad coaching will take someone who's good and make them look average
There is zero world where if Tom Brady was drafted by plenty of teams he's anything close to getting developed by Bill belichick for 15 years
Even Patrick mahomes is regressing right now.. just because you are really really good doesn't mean it's guaranteed forever
In the NFL if you're not progressing you are regressing I have always said that.. Josh Allen's been steadily going up still to this day Patrick Mahoney's been slowly going down
And Pat still has great coaching.. if Patrick mahomes got drafted by the Chicago bears he's not anything close to what he was.. not close
To say situation doesn't matter is akin to saying coaches don't matter in the NFL.. players can train themselves players can coach themselves... Because nobody helps them and it's all them
Kurt Warner is a Hall of famer who literally struggled for years.. when he was in the right situation he was amazing... When he wasn't it wasn't that great
That could be any great quarterback... Joe burrow is going to be a footnote because the Bengals are ruining him and have ruined him... A great quarterback who in 10 years it's going to be what if he wasn't with them
Because situation is everything
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4 hours ago, Mikie2times said:
We have debated this before, but as happy calls out, I think the great ones will be great anywhere. Perhaps coaching and circumstance allow that to come together sooner. But these guys we are seeing boomerang are not the very best. They will ultimately prove to be starting caliber and sometimes really good QB's. Take Allen for example. He started his rookie year as all these guys did and did so for a perennial loser. His QB whisperer was a guy in New York who couldn't make Daniel Jones work and now it appears like Jones could be the next Boomerang QB. I'm sure Dabs helped Josh, but I'm more sure Josh helped himself with Jordan Palmer and the rebuild of his mechanics. You have called out how much McD is responsible for Allen. Allen was inevitable and that was because of who he is. Not anybody else.
I think the culture, team, and system matter more when the guy isn't at that level. Mentally or physically. They can't overcome a bad org and bad coaching. But I don't believe the elite ones would just all of sudden not be that way in other circumstances. Perhaps the progression would be impacted, but these guys just have drive, talent, and intelligence that is at another level compared to others.
I think the great quarterbacks will probably be good anywhere
I 100% don't agree that Patrick mahomes would be the exact same quarterback in 31 other teams.. if Josh Allen goes to the Jets I think he probably showed flashes and is good but again does not reach his height with the bills because of our organization being top-notch
Same with Tom Brady
If Tom Brady goes to the lions or browns at 22 I don't think he's anything close to the same player
I think they could all be really good.. but I find it highly highly unlikely that Brady gets 7 rings if he doesn't start off his career with belichick
I don't think mahomes has three super bowls if he doesn't start with Andy Reid
The Buffalo Bills organization 100% has been a calming growing influence on Josh.. literally every single 22-year-old kid has a chance to be a bust.. it's not fair to coaching staffs to say they don't have an influence which is why they're around... To think Josh Allen would be an MVP if he was drafted by the Jets , it's not happening
I think his career is much more Sam darnold trajectory then
Patrick mahomes is regressing from what he was and he still has great coaching.. so it shows that even someone who is considered great can even start losing itba bit... Even with tremendous coaching...Kurt Warner was great with the Rams
Didn't play good for years until he got to the Cardinals
There's a lot of things with quarterbacks going on and to think every truly great quarterback.. could be as just as good in any situation I don't believe that
Players would be coaching themselves and calling plays themselves if they didn't need people to help them develop... Josh Allen has been getting developed by the Buffalo Bills extremely well and the entire football world agrees with that
Joe burrow certainly can be a lot less effective in a lot of other places just look at him now he already struggles to stay on the field... If he was in Chicago his career wouldn't be nearly as close and it still falling apart
Situation matters
For the elite quarterbacks to even reach that elite status they need to be in the right place with the right staff... Sure once you reach elite status it's hard to lose it because they knew what it took to get there
But I don't think Patrick mahomes becomes elite Patrick mahomes if he's on the Chicago bears ... I don't believe that at all
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5 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:
What got you banned, and was it from PPP or the other parts of the board?
I can confirm your failings in this area. I, on the other hand am completely consistent except when I am not, usually with good reason.
I thought I was on PPP but apparently one of the Kirk threads was on off the wall
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1 hour ago, Mikie2times said:
This turnaround phenomenon is getting rather interesting, especially when you consider the parallels.
Geno Smith, Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold all started for franchises that are poorly ran. They all started year 1. Daniel Jones is likely going to be the next one on this list. Outside of the bad franchise part, perhaps an element exists just not being burdened by expectations. It has to be a bit much to be a 21 year old tasked with turning around a dysfunctional franchise. Most of which are still dysfunctional years later. To go into a situation largely free of expectations but with the experience of your past. It has to be a pretty damn good feeling for some of these guys.
It's because where you land extremely matters
To think it doesn't is fool's gold... These are 21 to 23-year-old kids... And 97% of them need to grow and learn
There's a reason why the bears haven't successfully developed a quarterback in 60 years lol never had a 4,000 yard thrower
It is the organization
Same with darnold... Nobody question his talent or even his work ethic.. the Jets organization spits out quarterbacks for 50 years
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On 9/15/2025 at 7:51 PM, Simon said:
COuple notes on yesterday:
> He wasn't horrible for being tossed into a starting role unexpectedly when Milano went down, although he still has issues with angles and tackling at times. He actually had a pass defended, which may be the first one ever in his career. He also had my favorite play of the game. After he got called for roughing on the sideline while Benford was holding a guy up (the refs screwed up the number on the penalty) watch what he does on what I think was the very next snap; Babich sent him up the A-gap and I think it was Breece Hall that tried to pick him up. It did not go well for Breece.
If you have access, it's worth finding that play just to watch what Williams does to him. 
> How long is Taron out? The Bills might be even more inclined to run more base nickel rather than try Andreesen or a hobbled Shaq Thompson in the 4-3 they've been messing around with the first couple weeks.
> We're flirting with that situation with missing starters on every level of the defense again; you can get away with missing a guy here and there, but this stuff becomes exponentially harder to handle when it gets to be cumulative like this. You can do things defensively to hide soft spots, but those options become extremely limited as those soft spots multiply.
> Thoughts?
I think he's has the best physical tangibles out of our linebackers
He has our best blend of size speed and hit power... I think you could absolutely be starting on some other teams around the league but we don't trot out a lot of linebackers
When he's not thinking and just playing he can be good
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Well I got the ban Hammer a week ago but It is what it is
This was not right wing terrorism
Some liberals went from cheering it for days.. to gaslighting the right into thinking it was their own person for damage control.. to conspiracies
The Utah governor, the FBI are looking into a bunch of radical left-wing organizations and plenty of news organizations are reporting that this kid had a tran bf doesn't fit the bill of a conservative
It's classic deflection because their party is falling apart.. no 26 midterms.. 2028 election they have no chance... The Democrat party needs to rebrand because it is done
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4 minutes ago, Roundybout said:
I’m just saying. Nearly every major democratic leader has denounced this, while the right wing voices are calling to round up democrats. And we don’t even know what the shooter was thinking!Joe Biden said to put Donald Trump in the bullseye and then he got shot lol
They also pushed violent rhetoric way too far... There are so many mentally unhinged people in this country
And that violent rhetoric got our president shot and a young man
If CNN didn't talk about Donald Trump a fascist nazi for 8 years.. if the liberals didn't radicalize a bunch of new generation 18 to 35 year olds in the last 8 years this wouldn't have happend
But it happened because now people on the left think people on the right are Nazis which is actually ludicrous
You will see the word Nazi thrown around a hundred times today with Charlie who is the last thing to an actual Nazi
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2 minutes ago, 4th&long said:
You are part of the problem. You are such a victim.
I'm not a victim I'm praying for the victim today Charlie Kirk
You think it's acceptable for Democratic politicians to go on TV and call specific conservative political pundits or politicians Nazis which is in fact how you start violence
Remember Joe Biden said to put Donald Trump in the bullseye
And then he also got shot... Yeah that rhetoric is violent
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3 minutes ago, 4th&long said:
Horse sh it.
That's not horseshit lol
There are many people in the liberal left who called themselves communist or socialist
Conservatives are not Nazis... Yet for 8 years we have been called Nazis
Being called the Nazi when you're not is a lot more dangerous than calling someone a communist whose political ideas align with Communism
Nobody here on TBD is a Nazi.. there are people with communist ideas
It's not as dangerous to call that person with communist ideas a communist.. it's calling a spade a spade
it is dangerous to go on television and call people Nazis who are in fact not Nazis
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3 minutes ago, 4th&long said:
And all I've heard for 8 years is trump calling people names. Done act like the right don't call people names, you see it all the time on here. Trump is the president he needs to set the example. But the people that elected him love the way he talks about his opposition. They take their q from him. The left do it just as much. It's a cycle of hate.
There's a massive difference between calling someone a communist... Which if you listen to some of these people talk they are communist
It's calling a spade to SPade
Now calling someone a Nazi who is not a Nazi is in fact potentially dangerous because that's a different form of evil.. there's mentally deranged people out there whose goal is to kill Nazis
And then some in the liberal media tell you who the Nazis are.. it's basically spotlighting them
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27 minutes ago, 4th&long said:
You asshats love the guns. You guys love trumps hate speech. He has a service detail. Poor Charlie didn't.
All I have heard for 8 years is people calling Donald Trump a fascist and a Nazi
My family fled the Nazis.. that is uncontrolled hate speech.. but nobody condemns the liberals because of free speech... they've been drumming that up since before Donald Trump was elected 8 years ago
No violence has gotten perpetuated from radical liberals because they've been calling the right Nazis for 8 years
That hate speech literally radicalizes people like the person who shot Charlie Kirk because he probably thought he was a Nazi because what he was told
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14 minutes ago, ALLinALLEN said:
He said that if he saw a black pilot he would question if the guy was qualified...he was not "just having conversations" he was incredibly racist, sexist, and the center of a lot of divisiveness in our country. Nobody should ever face this kind of despicable act - but I am not going to just pretend he was "just having conversations" with the subjects he stood on.
No offense but that's not the entire context of the situation
And that's not hate speech... It's not racist.. ask his wife if he was sexist
He literally gave everybody the chance to speak, he was the bastion of free speech for a younger generation
He was a son a husband and a father
There should be no spinning this in any way about who he was as a person besides this is a downright tragedy
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1 minute ago, boyst said:
Hospital released that he is in critical condition.
That shot blasted right through his neck I don't know how anybody could survive that
Prayers he fight through
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2 hours ago, Yobogoya! said:
That Ravens fan on the board from last week could take a lesson here.
THIS is how you engage the opposition on their own forums. Now not that this is a masterclass in trolling, mind you, but the stupidity is JUST above the threshold to reach a fun level of comedy.
And it's even more fun because the Jets are gonna lose. I love Jets week.
It's jimmy spags... He gets outta the joint usually right before we play the Jets and always comes says hi lol
He's the only jets fan I don't mind either and it's funny
@Jimmy Spagnola enjoy the season
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41 minutes ago, SydneyBillsFan said:
Josh ......112.0
Lamar....144.4
Josh is passing against a secondary loaded with first round picks, whilst Lamar is picking on a combination of rookies/sophomores and athletically limited DB's.
Lamar also has the benefit of a generational monster RB that allows him to pass in situations where the box is stacked.
Josh also passes for 180 more yards and with a similar completion percentage.
And yet - somehow Lamar has a substantially better passer rating.
I don't get it.
It's just an outdated mathematical number
Obviously having a number in the hundreds is better than a number in the 70s or 80s
But it's far from perfect, same with QBR
These ratings have flaws
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2 hours ago, Draconator said:
The preferred site is an old rail yard about a mile from the current stadium. When the owners of Walmart own your team, they can afford to privately fund a new retractable roof stadium.
When you play in a city as big as Denver owners can privately fund your team and get it back a lot sooner
Ralph Wilson didn't pay for Ralph Wilson stadium either.. it's called a precedence
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9 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:
If the D-Line was good, everything behind them would have been clean. You cant rely on safeties to tackle running backs.
No because Bernard took himself out of tons of plays with washing himself out or not being in his Gap
I like Bernard a lot he constantly was in the wrong Gap and getting washed out double whammy
He wasn't where he needed to be most of the night in the run game
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6 hours ago, Augie said:
I had to look it up. He had 16 catches for 195 yards, and that is not nothin’.
I was the first one here to defend the Dawson Knox pick because I said lack of stats at the tight end position in college is the one position where it doesn't mean Jack
Knox never caught a touchdown pass
You're looking for traits that's it pure physical athletic and football traits whether it played out on the field or not.. because college isn't known for utilizing tight ends for the most part
You're looking for what they do when they do catch the ball.. how do they run after.. can they inline block... Do they get open even if they're not throwing the ball to them... Does he have an NFL frame.. can he get in and out of cuts fluidly..all of this comes before pure statistics
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3 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:
I really don’t even completely understand the ‘but this massive football venue can be used year round with a roof’ argument…there’s only like three months that would even apply to and when you’re a pretty small market you’re not even getting a lot of big concerts and such in the first place.
I’m all for people personally preferring domes but it really feels like a ploy to try to bring a Super Bowl to a non-traditional area when teams decide to build one. Buffalo could never logistically support a Super Bowl anyway
Exactly and I've already had so many back and forth with the dome people only
I literally went the website for Jerry world's Palace.. and there was like 15 events booked for the entire year and that's the best dome in the world
every stadium survey said a brand new stadium whether it was multi-purpose or football only was bringing in about the same as a brand new Target
So keeping it best as possible for football and keeping our traditions definitely is in more of our interest than going full corporate
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Just now, Low Positive said:
I left for Indiana for grad school and Cincinnati for a job. Nothing sunny about any of it and would move home in a second.
That's awesome that you still love your roots
And there's nothing wrong with leaving and growing most of my family has including my brother
But to me Buffalo is a beautiful city
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2 minutes ago, Low Positive said:
I am a WNYer until I die and agree with everything you say about us. But I see a lot of discussion on here that tends towards "no one wants us because of taxes and snow and we never do anything right." I just assumed those were local people because who else cares about NYS taxes?
No I assume those are expatriates
Who have left Buffalo to Sunny pastor and think we lag behind America in every single category
They think we are too stuck in the past, they think we refuse to want buffalo to grow, and and that we are fine with being a rust belt City with no future
Those are talking points I've heard from expatriates for multiple decades
Ben Johnson?? Ben Johnson?? LOL
in The Stadium Wall
Posted
If Josh Allen was as surefire as you thought he would have went number one overall
He dropped to seven because of question marks ... To think there's never been supremely gifted and smart players who did not reach their peak is not true
Plenty of hard-working physically gifted players never reach their full potential...
In Fact in the NFL it's extremely rare for a player to reach their full potential
Again this doesn't mean Josh Allen would be terrible on other teams... To think he is the best player in the world on the bears or Panthers or Jets is far-fetched
There is a reason the Packers have went from farve to Rogers to Jordan love.. it's because organizations have a big part in developing a quarterback
Any quarterback getting drafted in the top 10 has MVP potential.. it's about how they are developed from 22 to 26 in those formative years
Obviously Sam darnold would have been a lot better off in Buffalo.. MVP no, do I think we are still better than the Jets dolphins and Patriots? Yes
Do I think Josh Allen is an MVP with the Jets no.. do I think he's still good yes