moshermw
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Posts posted by moshermw
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What I don't get, all the Tyrod defenders, why can't we get a first round pick back for him?
Cuz it's a first rounder and his contract. Like 2 first rounders.
The better question is how did his contract get so high ? Somebody whose actaul job it is to evaluate QB talent - not troll on message boards - thought he was a $27M QB.
Dude's done nothing but represent the bills organization with class and play his heart out for this fanbase - will never understand the hate.
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What would you actually do if he developed into a good QB? I feel like every win would be bittersweet for you.
He already is good. Problem is he's not $27.5M good in about 50 % of folks on here's minds.
Huge TT supporter - even for my homer-ness, that's a big number to swallow.
Glad for the young man that it's even a legit conversation - not long ago, I was laffed off the board for even suggesting we try him out.
He's played about as well as I thought he would and believe we make the playoffs both years if we had a healthy, consistent WR corps and a notch or two better D.
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So cut our QB and nobody is available on the draft to help? Just give up?
Would he like Pegula to sell the team to Bon Jersey too?
He may or may not be right about TT, but one thing for sure is that he is a national media guy doing the bidding of large market owners and running down the Bills all the time.
Let me guess......if the Pats ke JG....genius! If they trade him.....genius! If they let him walk in a year.......genius!
Players that without question could play there part on a SB winning team:
Watkins, Tyrod, Shady, Glenn, incog, Dareus, Miller, Clay, Kyle, assuming Shaq, P Brown, Darby, Wood or Groy are not stars but not everyone will be.
That is 12 of 22 starting positions, without including pending FA like Gilmore and And Woods and without thinking hard. There are guys I left off that could easily step up. Only one of those guys is old and a couple others are getting there.
To blow that up would be a disgrace.
FIFY
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I keep hearing that the bills want to move on from Tyrod given what his option would do to our already strapped salary cap position for the next couple of years. In addition, there are reports that Whaley wants C. Jones to start or be the quarterback of the future. However, he is clearly a "project". We know that there is a small supply of starting caliber qb's in the NFL. We also know the bills don't have a plethora of draft choices this year. Lastly, virtually every expert would agree that Tony Romo is a better/more dangerous quarterback than Taylor, when healthy. There were reports that Jerry wanted to play him over Dak in the playoffs!
Here is a plan that might make sense for 2017 and beyond:
1) trade Tyrod Taylor before his option bonus kicks in to a Qb needy team, particularly one that wants a mobile Qb. If you don't think he could fetch a 2nd or 3rd round pick then you haven't been paying attention to the trade and financial cost of qbs in the NFL over the last few years.
2) aggressively pursue Tony Romo in a trade. I don't love him. I know he is fragile. However, allegedly he will only be dealt to the AFC, his salary is low ($14.5 mil for 2017), and he wouldn't be the long term solution. The cost is reported to be a 2nd round pick with conditions. In this scenario, you get Romo for Tyrod. The trade cost to get Romo would not result in further depleting our small draft pick allotment. And better yet, no money locked up in our starting Qb in 2017 and beyond.
3) tell the world that C. Jones is the future franchise Qb, but he isn't ready yet. Give him plenty of practice reps (as Romo will need down time during the week). Let him develop and evaluate him after the 2017 season
4) draft the best available wr at #10 and tell Romo to entice him to accept a trade here. Romo might like McCoy, a healthy Clay, Watkins and a big, talented (and most importantly, cheap) Wr stud from the draft. Have you seen what the projections for Woods or any other WR2 are in this upcoming FA market????
5) find a solid veteran starting RT in the FA market. RT's are far more affordable than Wr in the FA market.
6) get healthy on D, use draft picks wisely and let McDermitt do his thing. We will be better on D this year. Can't be much worse.
7) cross your fingers on health in 2017. If Romo stays heathy then the bills offense is certainly playoff caliber. And certainly better than last season. Romo and his health are a good fit for a quick passing west coast offense. And we have a very strong running game. If Romo gets hurt then C. Jones takes over and you can cut Romo with no salary cap ramifications and tack a new course next year. And we may be bad enough to get a high draft pick.
Thoughts???
Yore an idiot.
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Fake noos. I got an NFL Mobile Alert that said he's willing to renegotiate. Friday I think it was - came here to see what reaction it would have and got this crazy, regurgitating thread.
My prediction:
- will take a lot less to stay a Bill
- to buy him another WR and rookie QB to compete against
- will WIN said competition
- and a playoff birth
- with a real Defense, OC, and a shiny new WR.
- and hearts of Bills fans again
Ingrates. Dude's been $ as a Bill - taking peanuts only wanting to start - still doesn't care about $ and will prove it.
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Thurman#1, you are again right in a limited kind of way. It is not a fact that TT facilitated the run game. It's a theory. Just like evolution is a theory, and Newton's theory of gravity, and Einstein's theory of relativity - all of which are accepted by the overwhelming majority of scientists. Facts are things that are directly observable. Theories explain the facts.
The facts are the Bills led the NFL in rushing yards and YPC. The fact is that TT/Lynn combo scored 27 points per game. The theory (explanation) that lots of intelligent observers have is that the success of the Bills offense hinged partially on Tyrod's running skills.
You can deny this all you want. People on the fringe deny evolution, global warming, and a lot of other theories that are well supported by facts.
But there's no stat line that can prove - or disprove - that Tyrod facilitated the run game. And if you didn't see it with your own eyes in the way Roman designed his plays or Lynn called the plays, there's no way to convince you.
There's a saying in India: "When a pickpocket walks down the street, all he sees is pockets." Likewise, when a hungry guy drives down the street, he notices all the restaurants. When a horny guy watches a movie, he notices all the hot girls. And whey a Tyrod-hater watches All-22, he notices all Tyrod's shortcomings - and none of his strengths. We tend to see what fulfills our desires and backs up our opinions.
Many of us here actually agree with some of your statements: TT wasn't successful with the deep ball last season, he has trouble finding open receivers, he has accuracy issues and so on. But I think we're a little more nuanced in our evaluations and see that he brought some good to the table with the bad.
While we all hope to eventually have a better QB under center, we can easily imagine worse. We're Bills fans, we've had worse. That's why I'm all in favor of drafting a QB if a good one is available, but keeping Tyrod until someone beats him out for the job.
B-I-N-G-O and Bingo was his name-o.
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Would be something if TT goes to the Browns and leads them to the playoffs. Would be poetic and par for Bills fans.
I'd like to see what he could do now that David Lee is gone and if Mcdermott fixes the D.
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figures TT's only appearance - or any Bill for that matter - would be with Kaep. #mediahatesbuffalo
Otherwise good post. Luv those.
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Let TT go. Sign a Vet to compete with Cardale for starting job. If Mitch Trubisky is still on the board at 4, and the Bills think he is THE guy trade up into Jacksonville's spot (4) and draft him.
Trubisky has played exactly 10 college games.
Lunacy.
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QB or no QB. Superbowl Winning Quarterbacks:
Montana -4
Bradshaw -4
Brady -4
Aikman-3
Manning, P -2
Manning E-2
Plunkett -2
Griese-2
Staubach-2
Big Ben-2
Elway-2
Starr-2
McMahon-1
Rypien-1
Simms-1
Young-1
Wilson-1
Flacco-1
Brees-1
Rodgers -1
Stabler-1
Johnson-1
Hostetler-1
Dawson-1
Williams-1
Dilfer-1
Theismann-1
Favre-1
Warner-1
Unitas-1
Namath-1
Bills need an elite Franchise QB. Other teams manage to find them. Instead, OBD's goal is to make the wildcard game and when they don't, they keep telling everybody how close they are.
TBR
Don't have the time or inclination to research how many of these QB's won a SB in their 1st or 2nd season as a starter which is what you think TT should have already done.
Since you do have such time and inclination, can you show us that ?
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If TT is determined by the new staff to be worth a total of $40m over 3 years (roughly the deal now - could be re-done), as one of the biggest T-Mobile supporters out there I would still draft another QB (and that assumes EJ is out). They could do nothing at QB - including keeping EJ and letting him battle with Cardale for #2 to help CJ develop. If EJ wins out then he wins out as the #2. Not likely but with the new staff, it seems anything is possible.
If TMobile in, EJ out, one waits for the 3rd or 4th round for a dude like this:
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Dak carried a lowly program on his shoulders in the SEC for four years.
Evans played in an extremely QB-friendly system in 2016. I watched Evans in person at the Carrier Dome and the same Syracuse defense that allowed 76 points to Pittsburgh shut Evans and VT down holding them to under 20 points for the win.
And take it easy with the pompous attitude.
Sorry, dude. bout the 'tude.
That SU game was an aberration - Evans was never that bad and the SU D was never that good the rest of the season.
So the stats listed for JE were on his first year with a new coach and a new staff for everyone involved. VT barely had kept its bowl streak alive at 6-6 or 7-5 for the last 3 seasons of Beamer's reign so was almost as lowly - especially on O - as Miss St.
The stats for Dak was after 4 years under the same staff.
Whole debate started about Evans being in the same Stratosphere or not. It's silly to claim he is without NFL data. That said, apples to apples in their last year of college, and being a relative unknown compared to Watson, Trubisky, etc. Evans could be drafted in later rounds and actually be as good as Dak - and if he's not, maybe close, and if horrible (doubtful with that stat line) even then you only lose a 4th rd pick.
Someone to watch as we go through the Combine process at a minimum.
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I see your point, but neither the packers or steelers defenses are championship caliber. They both deserved to lose because of it.
Cool. Just saying the score would have been closer, read: more fun to watch for us, if the 2nd tier receivers caught at least a cold.
And that HOF QB play does not a WR make.
Exactly. Green bay let up like 500 yards after 3 quarters. And Pittsburgh continued to play zone against brady and got burnt. Had little to do with dropped passes
Cool. Just saying the score would have been closer, read: more fun to watch for us, if the 2nd tier receivers caught at least a cold.
And that HOF QB play does not a WR make.
Good assessment. It must be acknowledged though, that both Pitt and GB suffered some pretty bad drive-killing drops from (actually normally sure-handed) WR
But none of them were their #1.
Like for the Bills, not Sammy but Hunter, Woods, Goodwin, Powell.
An excellent 2 game analysis. TT has had 2 good games in his career.
And it was when his receivers also had their best games-see how this works ?
Exactly. Green bay let up like 500 yards after 3 quarters. And Pittsburgh continued to play zone against brady and got burnt. Had little to do with dropped passes
Not sayin games were won or lost by it.
For God's sake catch a pass and stay in the game.
They were being thrown to by HOF QB's
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Aaron Rogers (1st ballot) and Rothlisberger (prolly) were completely beat down today by better teams.
The scores were lopsided but in no way did the losers/visitors have a chance of winning.
The losers would have been able to make it a game if the HOF QB's passes weren't dropped and the second tier receivers were playoff caliber. It was a very obvious thing to watch today. Any WR/TE not named Nelson or Brown shvt the bed. It was awful - like many Bills games this year.
Today was as stark of an example as anyone needs to see where the #1 receiver was shut down (Jordy, Brown) and the next options COULD NOT GET IT DONE DESPITE HOF QB PLAY.
Everyone on here Old School, Ryan, etc. should now see how it's a two way street QB-WR and TT had that interrupted/no talent all year. And when he had it, was spectacular.
This draft class is loaded with WR. That's what this O needs - not a "grasp at straw" QB in the first round. Bills also need a killer DB - also a strong position in this draft.
Stay away from QB in the first few rounds and let TT grow - QB is not a position of need.
That said - always draft a sleeper in a later round.
Many on here know this is mine:
carry on
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I basically agree with this. I would like to see how these 3 QBs fare during the process leading up to the draft though.
FIFY
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No offense, but let me tell you who dumb it is to sit here and lay the lack of playoffs somehow solely on Tyrod and why your post is very wrong. Over the last 3 years, Drew Brees has averaged the following:
5,010 Passing Yards (insane)
34 Touchdowns
69.16 Comp %
Guess how many times Drew Brees has "LEAD" the Saints to the playoffs...ZERO...let me say again...ZERO and only once in the past 5 seasons. By your post here, that would mean Brees must be the problem, because despite being one of the highest scoring teams in the NFL, the Saints STILL missed the playoffs. I mean the Bills were 5th in scoring under Tyrod, but you say its him and the offense as the reason for missing the playoffs.
Guess what Brees WIN % is over that span... .438 with no winning seasons. But how can that be...he should have carried them into the playoffs...of wait, maybe its because its so much more than just QB passing totals that get teams to the playoffs.
More fun facts:
- Tyrod led Bills offense was 5th in the NFL in scoring and 3rd in Touchdowns scored only 2 behind those same Saints.
- Tyrod has a win % leading this Bills team of .520
- Bills scored 25 or more points in 10 of Taylors 15 starts
- The Bills lost 8 games with TT under center, SIX of them were by 6 points or less. 1 of the other 2 we had a 24-9 3rd quarter lead before the D gave up 4 straight TD drives.
- Bills Defense was almost as bad as the Saints...the 16 game ranks are skewed by the anomaly of the Patriots shut out missing Brady (who dropped 41 on us) and Gronk who barely played.
- Bills were 26th in the NFL in points allowed in the other 15 games and 22nd in yards allowed.
In other words, Taylor led this offense to more than enough scoring to lead this team into the postseason. He has a better record than Brees the last 2 years despite Brees being one of the greatest ever to play and having a better WR group overall.
But please, keep telling us all how the offense was why we didn't make the playoffs and putting all the blame on Taylor...who by the way, led us to all those points while our best players on the O around him either missed large parts of time and/or played hurt which includes Sammy, Woods, Glenn, McCoy, Wood, etc.
My nikka...
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Agree with this 100%. His Syracuse game was not impressive given the competition.
Was definitely crazy bad by both D and O. SU had a tremendous game plan so give them every bit of credit they deserve. Game is a complete outlier, however. For both teams. SU never repeated that performance.
Evans was $ every other game save for GT.
Never said he's a guaranteed Dak. If so, I would have pushed for first round as would all of us. I'm just saying that he's got the potential to be a Dak and because of the SU and GT performances, only one season, should do another year, etc.. he will be available in lower rounds. If he turns out to be a bust, only lost a 4th, but - if he is the next Dak, which by all accounts he very well could be, well you see where I'm going.
I'm at the front of the line as a TT supporter, but am realistic enough to know we need to keep drafting QB's in hopes of landing a Russell Wilson or Dak. Jim Kellys and Aaron Rodgers' aren't in every draft. Especially this one. Don't waste a first on Trubisky (only played 10 games) or DeShaun (he's basically a slower TT).
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lol not even in Dak's stratosphere.
Dak Senior Year:
3793 yds
8.0 yds/att
29 TD
5 Int
QB rating 151
588 yds rush
10 rush TD
Evans Junior Year:
3552 yd
8.4 yd/att
29 TD
8 int
QB rating 153
846 rush yds
12 rush TD
Same sphere, dude. And the good news is uniformed folks like you - and ones who might be correc about him leaving too early - will allow him to fall into the third or fourth - just like Dak did.
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4th round this year - possible next Dak:
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My NFC team is Vikes.
It's AD not AP.
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It's debatable but i'd take Tyrod over all the other "game managers".
IMO he adds about 15-20% onto the rushing production over what those guys would.
Basically a yard or a bit more per carry and extra scores.
And that's before HIS OWN rushing totals/TD production.......which I assume are part of the equation already.
The system matters significantly........it puts him in position to do things that he does well.......but it matters a lot with the other game managers as well.
In my opinion he is about 15th best QB in the NFL right now and in the short term he might be more scoring impactful than some of those in the top 15 even.
And though skepticism is warranted........he may have room for improvement.
Whether he gets that much hotter at what he's cold at or not......I still don't think he's come all that close to hitting his ceiling statistically.......I think 35-40 total TD's accounted for rushing and passing....and a near the top of league scoring offense is probably his ceiling if given health and a significant weapon added opposite Sammy at WR2.
Was gonna post something similar. Great point on the rushing production alone. Agree 100 %
Would add:
If one looks at NFL as a pastime/entertainment - which in the big scheme of life it is - Taylor is also miles ahead of those other game managers on the OP list in terms of fun to watch. Watching Smith and Bradford this year was almost painful - I'd rather watch paint dry.
Say what you want about the Bills in the TT era - they weren't boring - largely because at any second you knew TT could do something spectacular.
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To all those Bills fans who think they know what a QB will develop into after watching play him for two years.
I watched a kid get drafted and sit on the bench in his first season with a bad HC, bad team. The next season he got a new HC and coaching staff and he was able to start. He went 8-8 that first year while completing 60.8% of his passes for 526 attempts for 320 completions 3284 yards with 17 TDs, 16 INTs. Not bad for a rookie starter, err most of you would say a second-year player. That team had a 1000+ yard rusher and some decent receivers with 538 passing attempts vs 466 rushing attempts.
In his second year of starting the guy was benched after he went 2-9 with 356 attempts for 205 completions for 2108 yards while throwing 11 TDs, 15 INTs. with a 57.6 completion percentage. He stunk it up and deserved to be benched!
Now up until this point, the team had thrown more than they passed the ball the previous two years and this year the teams OC took a different turn and called for 450 passes vs 525 rushing attempts. This same starting QB who was benched the previous season suddenly started to get better in a run first team. That year this same QB who stinking it up was doing great.
This season that in his third year of being a starting QB he went 11-4 with 400 attempts for 262 completions for 3159 yards with 27 TDs, 7 INTs. The team made the playoffs. His OC was Cam Cameron a man who tutored him and also went on to develop Joe Flacco into another SB winning QB. Anyone guess by now who this QB is?
The point being is that it would really be foolish to dump Tyrod Taylor at this point. Unless the team changes their offensive philosophy to a pass first and wants a different bridge QB who will throw more.
What the team should do is hire Cam Cameron away from LSU and allow him to develop Tyrod Taylor. The team will find out soon enough if he develops further or fails to do so. This team also needs to upgrade the WR, RT positions asap.
Just for info, Cam Cameron was Tyrod's OC in Baltimore for at least a year if not 2.
They've met.
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Lots of bums were great in college and couldn't cut it in the NFL. When can you show some highlights of Tyrod doing it in the NFL? He's had 29 starts in the NFL, surely you can find something, right? You can't! That's why you keep referencing his junior year at VT.
So we've all seen it - maybe it's time for one more ?
And keep in mind most of this is whilst injured.
Cleveland Heavily After Tyrod Taylor.
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Copy that. I am in the camp of seeing what he can do under new OC (especially with David Lee gone) and leadership but draft a QB anyway - like in the 3rd.
TT is entertaining at a minimum, has a high floor and I think the Miami and Seattle Taylor is the one we will be seeing more consistently. It was college - but he always got better every year - and by the time he was a Senior, he was a machine.
In before someone points out that the Miami and Seattle games were both losses - clearly on the D both games.