Turbosrrgood

Good link, and point. For the record I didn't agree at all with the contract the Bills gave him...He wasn't worth it, especially since they were going 3-4...They probably could have had him at half the price, or less. People love to bash him and blame him for all the defensive problems...I wish the Bills had a better player to put there right now...but they dont... This section of the article sums up my personal feeling on him. "Kelsay has been a nice player for the Bills, but nothing phenomenal. He's a standup guy in the locker room. He has been a starter for seven seasons and has missed only two games since the Bills drafted him 48th overall in 2003. " "

I love it when people make posts like this and claim that they "understand what they see on the football field" better than anyone else simply because they disagree. I accept that Kelsey struggles in the open field, and as an OLB in general. When I say he is good against the run, I mean when he plays along the line of scrimage. He has long arms and is strong enough to tackle guys when he gets to them. This strength is seen more when he is playing in a 4-3. I've watched the Bills for more than just "last year". To claim HE got killed against the run when the D-line was awful, and no other LB's were capable of making a tackle is ridiculous. When he plays the 4-3 (his natural position, and where he's played he had played his whole career), he played the run relatively well. I make no claim that Kelsey is great, or a "run stuffer". But compared to moats who people are suggesting start in his place, he is definitely better against the run. When he gets to a guy, he actually tackles him, not bounce off like the rest of the Bills LB's.

The only reason I say that about Poz is that he is more of a 4-3 LB, and really didn't look too good in a 3-4. He's smallish, and makes most of his tackles down field. Plus the injury concerns as you mentioned. He might grab some interest from 4-3 teams. I don't know if I see the Bills making a long term commitment to him (resigning him). I agree that Sheppard will be an immediate starter...He almost has to be, the Bills simply don't have enough talent NOT to start him.

Merriman is definitely key. We need to pray that he can somehow stay healthy and play at a high level. We have SOME young players with upside at the LB position, but I wouldn't use the word great at this point...Here is how I see our 3-4 LB set up as we stand now... OLB - Merriman (cross your fingers, pray, something...) Torbor as backup? OLB - Kelsey/Moats (uhoh) Maybe Torbor? MLB - This is a big mess, not knowing whether we have POZ (probably not). We have Kelvin Sheppard (hasn't played a down, or even signed yet...But he already looks like our best MLB), Then the journeyman veterans Andra Davis, Akin Ayodele. They are both over 30. Ayodele simply sucks in my opinion, Davis was OK in his prime but he's 32 going on 33 now. The wild card here is Batten, he was injured in the preseason last year and was a late round pick projected at MLB. Coleman looked ok to me as well. Looking at this, Sheppard was (hopefully) an improvement. But other than him, even IF Merriman can play, we still need a lot of work....At least our D-line looks better. I didn't include Maybin...he simply isn't worth mentioning. Edit - They also drafted Chris White...but hope he never has to start...He is a special teams guy. With the Bills playing a "hybrid" (wannstedt) defense, they need some 4-3 DE's...The DE's you have listed are PURE 3-4 end (maybe not Carringtion), and don't rush the passer well. That defense can't work without a guy like Kelsey. As far as the OLB's listed...that list doesn't exactly strike fear into the hearts of opposing offenses. Merriman is the only starting quality OLB in my opinion, and hasn't played in 3 years...

I can't argue that. He is a 4-3 end, not an OLB. My question is, who is going to play OLB instead of him? Moats? If you thought Kelsey couldn't seal the edge, make open field, or cover anybody...Watch Moats. Moats is a 1 dementional player and another 4-3 defensive end (and an undersized one at that), being converted to OLB. I really like Moats as a situational pass rusher, but this guy is NOT an NFL starter. Kelsey is less than an ideal LB, but towards the end of last year the Bills were playing just as much 4-3. Kelsey looked good in that formation. The sad truth is that the Bills simply lack talent, and at the moment Kelsey is the best we have at that position...Before we get rid of him we need someone to replace him...

People love to knock Kelsey just for the sake of doing it. Don't forget, he was drafted in the 2nd round several coaches and GM's ago as 4-3 defensive end. He was never a "Bruce smith" pass rusher, but I actually WOULD compare him to a Phil Hanson type. He played all aspects of the 4-3 fairly well, and was good against the run. Now he has been moved to 3-4 LB, a situation that was completely new to him last year on a team with virtually no top end defensive talent. Equally important, they have an awful D-coordinator (Edwards's group was awful in Miami, and awful with the Bills). Kelsey was arguably the Bills best defensive player towards the end of the year while playing a mix of 3-4 and 4-3. Situational pass rusher? He played almost every down, and is good against the run. I am not saying Kelsey is some great player..but people love to blame him for all of the defenses problems without justification. Thank you for some facts about the money, instead of assuming he is getting paid a top end salary. I understand pulling for Moats, but he is not even close to being a starting OLB in the NFL. Ironically HE is the guy that is a pure situational pass rusher. When playing the run he really struggles to wrap guys up, and gets torched in the open field. He pretty much CANT drop into pass coverage. I like Moats rushing the passer, but if he is our starter we are in real trouble... Like it or not, you have to find someone BETTER than Kelsey, before you can replace him.

Yeah, it was interesting thought but it just seems very unlikely for many reasons. Look for the Bills to pick up a less solid, less expensive veteran purely as a backup to Fitz. And/or pick up a young, low risk, "prospect" type of player. Similar to what they did with Brohm (but hopefully better).

That's the key, the Bills probably wouldn't consider picking him up at his current contract (I hope). If he were to be let go by Cincy, that contract is out the window and he is a FA. If he didn't draw much interest MAYBE the Bills could consider it. For those who are saying "Palmer sucks", "he's shot", "Can't play since injuries"...I guess you haven't actually watched him play. Like him or not, the guy is good, and was good LAST YEAR. Just because the Bengals suck, doesn't mean he does. Is he Peyton Manning? No way. Is he better than any QB the Bills have had since Jim Kelly by a wide margin? YES, including Fitz. The guy averages 4k yards per season and 26 TD's when healthy, which is what he did last year (Healthy). I think the Bill's should look for a younger, longer term prospect personally, but give the guy some credit. He's accomplished a lot playing on one of the all time worst franchises. T

Yup, clearly the Bengals are planning for post Palmer life (I was happy the Bills passed on Dalton..., as well as all the other QB's in this draft). I do agree with you though. Fitz played well enough last year, especially compared to who we've had before him recently. The Bills should still be thinking young "franchise" QB for the future, but on a team with low expectations there is no reason to trade picks for minor short term improvement.

I can agree with that statement regarding his 2010 season, and for the record I don't think Palmer would be a big improvement over Fitz. But again, while those quotes are accurate, theretirement thing is completely out of context. If you followed that situation or read ANY of the articles on the matter, he was clearly threatening to retire after the Bengals stated they would not let him go. No one involved actually believed or believes he will really retire.

Palmer never "lost the starting job to Fitz" he got injured. Big difference. Palmer sucked last season? He threw for almost 4000 yards and 26 TD's...Far better than any Bill in a long time (I don't think any Bill has ever thrown for that many yards and TD's in the same season actually)...And you can't use TO as an excuse, the Bills had him the prior year... As a matter of fact, Palmer averages 4000 yards and 26 TD's per season when he's been healthy, on a consistently bad team. The Bengals are a poorly coached team with some big names but a lack of overall talent. If you are going to quote someone don't do it out of context. He said he'd consider retiring IF the Bengals don't let him go. An obvious bluff. I am not saying Palmer is a great QB, or would be that big of an improvement over Fitz...But those statements were a little off.

Wow. So outside variables have absolutely no affect on these stats? Even though we have no idea how they were computed? Even though "pressure" could mean endless different combinations of plays and situations? I'm gonna have to disagree with you on that...

Great statement. Facts. Gotta love em...

+1, people flip out over numbers. Both Rob Johnson and Losman had consistently good QB ratings, but they were consistently awful QB's. They probably destroyed Fitz in these stats as well, Fitz actually got the ball out in an attempt to make plays...Not just take sack after sack...

Lol, yeah I even I'm getting disgusted by that one...

+1, these are just numbers.

I have heard very few (if any?) people say "he is the solution". I have heard many people say hey played better than expected last year and that they are OK with him being the starter this year or until we find someone better. The QB's in the draft hardly looked better to me. I am not "comfortable" with Fitz as our starter, but the sad thing is he's better than the other QB's we've had recently, and better then any available alternatives at the moment. Those kind of stats, or ANY stats are always overblown and usually taken out of context. Fitz had a mess of a team around him, a defense that gave up loads of points, and a pathetic running attack on offense, which meant opposing D's could T off on him against our awful and oft injured o-line. He had virtually no receiving core (except SJ, who dropped plenty of his own). Maybe you'd like the Bills to pick up Rob Johnson or JP Losman, who had better stats and QB ratings, but looked absolutely lost on the field. Fitz is no probowler, but the offense at least looked watchable for stretch's with him at the helm. Have a better solution than him? I'm all ears.

Good points, and his age (and associated drop off in play) are the main reasons I don't like him as a football player. He's always been a love him or hate him guy. Either you enjoy his "antics" as entertainment, or despise them for making a mockery of the game.

I am not slamming him for the specific act, although I understand that my OP kind of suggests that. He is a decent guy, but I think he is an over-rated football player and don't enjoy his kind of ego's on the football field. He was doing it for charity, great. But more import to him was keeping himself in the spotlight, that's what I don't like. My main point was actually that I don't like him as a football player. But I thought the clip was funny too..

Actually I have to say, he is a decent guy compared to other WR's. I just can't stand the over dramatic, excessive, ridiculous celebrations, even when the team is down 30 points. I watch football for football, not clowns. I'd probably like him if he teamed up with Steve-o and did some Jackass clips though. I laughed pretty hard at the clip, he fell off before he got out of the gate. I guess I give him props for trying...

While the Bills leaving Buffalo is unfortunately something that COULD happen. I doubt in any scenario that they go to Toronto. If we've learned anything about the "Bills in Toronto" experiment, it's that Canadiens could care less about them. Most of the people at those games have been from our side of the border, they can't even sell out that tiny baseball stadium. They have had to slash prices and still struggle to fill the place. The Bill's may leave some day depending on what Ralph is scheming, but I doubt Toronto is getting a team anytime soon... Plus, they already have a professional football league in Canada...

I remember a few people suggesting Chad Johnson should be considered as a FA (Something I definitely don't agree with). I saw this clip, sorry but I just could never root for this guy...Even if he was good (which he's not). http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Chad-Ochocinco-falls-off-the-bull-gets-10k-any?urn=nfl-wp2033

Yeah, I am not saying KW is an awful NT by any means. Just not the "3rd best overall player in the NFL in 2010" at that position. I've liked KW ever since the Bills drafted him, I'd just like to see the Bills use him at end or 4-3 DT, or cycle him in at NT, where he can use his natural skills and athleticism. I don't like seeing the Bill's try to use him as an "anchor", when thats just not what he does. The problem is...the Bills don't have anyone even close to good enough to replace him (with Dareus at end).

Yeah, keep in mind...The Bills had the worst run defense...by far. Again, I think Kyle Williams is great...just not as a NT. He was making many of those tackles after being pushed off the line, and because there was NO one else that actually could make a tackle. Kyle is good, maybe if he was playing 4-3 DT I could by into him being rated in the top 10. But you are saying Kyle Williams plays NT better than Vick plays QB? Or better than Arian Foster, CJ2K, or Adrian Peterson plays RB? Better than Clay Mathews plays LB? Better than Revis plays CB? Better than Gates plays TE? It's just not realistic

Sounds good on paper (or in a forum), I just wonder if Troup really has what it takes. He has the size but didn't make any impact last year. If he can, that would be one big powerful line, that should be good against the run and the pass... Imagine that by some miracle Jasper ends up being good...a 375 NT in between Dareus and Williams...