How to Know Things Have Changed

[Adam]

Something will stick out about our offense and defense- the opponent will know that they have to game plan around something or a specific player. Also, just watch the line of scrimmage- when we start winning those battles, good things will happen. It is about process, not end result- and whether somebody is screaming or stoically standing on the sidelines, it won't matter

[IndyJay1234]

Apart from all the x's and o's and how we do on the filed and on the scoreboard, what I am looking for is a sign that this team has changed. When they lose a game, I want to see some locker room rage, helmets bashing in to walls, angry men yelling at eachother, etc. I want nasty, bitter post game press conferences after a loss, not all this gracious loser, corporate PR stuff about how "we need to play better" and "we need to work harder" I want to see Jauron curse out an official. I want to see some personal fouls, maybe even an ejection or two. Some cheap shots, some fines, some sign that this team has some fire.

 

We have been the Boy Scouts of the NFL for too long. I want a sign from this team that they hate losing, deep in their guts flat out hate, hate, hate, hate losing. I hope TO gets in peoples faces from the start, including the coaches.

 

 

You want them to lose and be enraged.. To the point where they lose their composure and make matters worse by taking personal fouls and penalties...

 

Why dont you want them to win?

 

I want them to win. And if they lose. I want them to focus on how to get better and winning not throw a 3 year old temper tantrum.

[Mickey]

Yes, thank you.

 

To say that we need more locker room brouhaha assumes we see and hear everything which already occurs "in the locker room."

 

To say that we should retaliate to cheap play with even cheaper dirtier play is disgraceful.

 

I would also like to add that the Willfork shot came just two games after KE went down. I doubt that physically assaulting another human being was on the minds of ANY Buffalo Bill at that point in time.

You should really become a tennis fan. Football is just way too brutal for you.

 

In football, there is the team that wins and the team that bleats about how mean and bad and immoral the winners are. How they coudla, woulda, shoulda. The point isn't to hurt someone, the point is to actually give a damn, to care enough to play with passion. That is something this team lacks. Ever see a coach take a techinical and see his team rally afterwards? Same thing. If you are really passionate, you are going to cross the line once in awhile.

 

Oh, and while we are talking about cheap shots bringing up KE certainly would qualify. KE was hurt on a perfectly legit play so I am not sure why you would bring that up other than a reach for something to bolster a weak opinion.

 

There is a reason why guys like Dick Butkus, Jack Lambert and Mike Stratton were great players and it wasn't because they never, ever, ever broke the rules or hurt anyone. They played hard, they played mean and because they did, once in awhile they went over the line.

[Mickey]

You want them to lose and be enraged.. To the point where they lose their composure and make matters worse by taking personal fouls and penalties...

 

Why dont you want them to win?

 

I want them to win. And if they lose. I want them to focus on how to get better and winning not throw a 3 year old temper tantrum.

Well then you will get most of what you want, not the wins of course but you won't have to worry about them ever getting angry over a loss. You see, you actually have to give a damn to lose your temper. Apathetic players simply cashing their checks won't lose their temper, not even in the immediate aftermath of a heart breaking loss.

 

All that focus will be great come Tuesday morning but if you can lose a big game one minute and sip tea with the queen the next, then you just don't care.

 

Of course I want them to win dipstick. But if they lose with such aplomb, such grace, such indifference, then they aren't going to win much. In the glory years, when they lost, you didn't want to be in that lockeroom. These guys, losing is just how they roll now isn't it? No need for anyone to get upset and offend your sensibilities. Heaven fofend that we appear to be immature.

 

You must really enjoy 7-9 and watching them get their a$$e$ handed to them by the Patriots every year.

 

One question, have you never seen a guy go over the line, even draw a flag, a foul, a technical, whatever, and have it motivate a team that appeared to be sleepwalking? Exactly and that's all I'm saying.

[Mickey]

Something will stick out about our offense and defense- the opponent will know that they have to game plan around something or a specific player. Also, just watch the line of scrimmage- when we start winning those battles, good things will happen. It is about process, not end result- and whether somebody is screaming or stoically standing on the sidelines, it won't matter

Yeah it does matter. Most of coaching is motivation. Ever actually play a sport? Ever watch an outmanned, outgunned team ride an emotional high right to an upset win? I have. Ever wonder why teams seem to play better on the road? Why would that universal truism be? Because having 70k+ fans going nuts tends to emotionally motivate a team which enhances their performance.

 

When you go to a game, do you sit there silently or do your share of cheering/screaming, etc?

[The Big Cat]

You should really become a tennis fan. Football is just way too brutal for you.

 

Yeah, no.

 

In football, there is the team that wins and the team that bleats about how mean and bad and immoral the winners are. How they coudla, woulda, shoulda. The point isn't to hurt someone, the point is to actually give a damn, to care enough to play with passion. That is something this team lacks.

 

So winners v excuse makers are component exclusive to football? And you know the team lacks passion, how? In comparison to what? Their behavior on the field vs other teams you WATCH ON TV? Yeah, okay.

 

Ever see a coach take a techinical and see his team rally afterwards? Same thing. If you are really passionate, you are going to cross the line once in awhile.

 

I thought we were talking about football.

 

Oh, and while we are talking about cheap shots bringing up KE certainly would qualify. KE was hurt on a perfectly legit play so I am not sure why you would bring that up other than a reach for something to bolster a weak opinion.

 

No, I brought up KE to put into context the players' post-injury mentality, something Jauron talked about in the weeks after, how it was going to be difficult to get them to play fearlessly having been so close to the accident. ON TOP of the team's hyper awareness for their own well-beling, it's highly unlikely they would have actively pursued opportunities to harm others. THAT was the point.

 

And if you think any of the above is BS, then you've clearly never played sports. Almost 50% of sports rehab deals with a players psychology post-injury. To assume KE's injury had no effect on our team's psychology is flat out wrong.

 

There is a reason why guys like Dick Butkus, Jack Lambert and Mike Stratton were great players and it wasn't because they never, ever, ever broke the rules or hurt anyone. They played hard, they played mean and because they did, once in awhile they went over the line.

 

Lambert- out of the league in '84.

Stratton- out of the league in '73.

Butkus- out of the legue in in '73.

 

So in the 25 or 36 years since these guys last played, nothing about the rules, the size of the players, or the speed of the game has changed? And in believing so, our players should model their behaviors after these dinosaurs?

 

Give me a break. I'm not sure why you insist on being such a hard ass and disagreeing with everyone.

[Adam]

Yeah, no.

 

 

 

So winners v excuse makers are component exclusive to football? And you know the team lacks passion, how? In comparison to what? Their behavior on the field vs other teams you WATCH ON TV? Yeah, okay.

 

 

 

I thought we were talking about football.

 

 

 

No, I brought up KE to put into context the players' post-injury mentality, something Jauron talked about in the weeks after, how it was going to be difficult to get them to play fearlessly having been so close to the accident. ON TOP of the team's hyper awareness for their own well-beling, it's highly unlikely they would have actively pursued opportunities to harm others. THAT was the point.

 

And if you think any of the above is BS, then you've clearly never played sports. Almost 50% of sports rehab deals with a players psychology post-injury. To assume KE's injury had no effect on our team's psychology is flat out wrong.

 

 

 

Lambert- out of the league in '84.

Stratton- out of the league in '73.

Butkus- out of the legue in in '73.

 

So in the 25 or 36 years since these guys last played, nothing about the rules, the size of the players, or the speed of the game has changed? And in believing so, our players should model their behaviors after these dinosaurs?

 

Give me a break. I'm not sure why you insist on being such a hard ass and disagreeing with everyone.

He thinks jumping up and down and screaming a lot translates into wins.......he wants Carl Mauck as his head coach

[The Big Cat]

One question, have you never seen a guy go over the line, even draw a flag, a foul, a technical, whatever, and have it motivate a team that appeared to be sleepwalking? Exactly and that's all I'm saying.

 

YES YOU F-CKING TWIT! WEEK 3 LAST YEAR: DONTE WHITNER, TACKLED THE RAIDER IN THE ENDZONE THE BILLS RALLIED TO WIN!

[Mickey]

Maybe the Bills should hire Vince McMahon as HC...

Yeah because a coach stomping up and down and barking at his guys or taking a technical or a team captain kicking some a$$ has never motivated a team.

 

I assume you don't cheer when you go to a game because it doesn't make a difference and, goodness, might be similar to pro wrestling fans cheering their heroes and villains.

[Mickey]

He thinks jumping up and down and screaming a lot translates into wins.......he wants Carl Mauck as his head coach

Sure beats DJ's chin stroking.

 

Why does playing with some emotion and fire, some passion, seem so offensive to you?

[The Big Cat]

Ever wonder why teams seem to play better on the road?

 

?

 

Why would that universal truism be? Because having 70k+ fans going nuts tends to emotionally motivate a team which enhances their performance.

 

When you go to a game, do you sit there silently or do your share of cheering/screaming, etc?

 

No you f-cking idiot, you cheer FOR YOUR TEAM, and the cheers MOTIVATE THE TEAM THEY'RE INTENDED FOR. Jesus, what a half-empty life you must live!

[Adam]

Sure beats DJ's chin stroking.

 

Why does playing with some emotion and fire, some passion, seem so offensive to you?

The Bills do play with fire, passion and emotion.......just not a lot of talent

[Mickey]

YES YOU F-CKING TWIT! WEEK 3 LAST YEAR: DONTE WHITNER, TACKLED THE RAIDER IN THE ENDZONE THE BILLS RALLIED TO WIN!

So why is advocating more of that such a problem with you "Big kitty"?

[The Big Cat]

So why is advocating more of that such a problem with you "Big kitty"?

 

Because I would never advocate dirty, illegal play, and no coach worth his weight in turds would either.

 

The Bills do play with fire, passion and emotion.......just not a lot of talent

 

Yes, thank you. This team plays hard, especially on defense. That's how we were able to squeak out a 7-9 record with such a pathetic offense last year. It baffles me that Bills fans refuse to believe this, for whatever reason.

[Mickey]

?

 

 

 

No you f-cking idiot, you cheer FOR YOUR TEAM, and the cheers MOTIVATE THE TEAM THEY'RE INTENDED FOR. Jesus, what a half-empty life you must live!

Okay, so you admit emotional inspiration is a legitimate factor. Have you never seen a team get motivated by someone yelling at them? If not, you must not have seen a single football coach besides Dick Jauron do his job. Never seen a coach take a T? Its pretty basic, this team is flat, slouching towards mediocrity and has been for years now. It would be nice if someone showed they cared, that they cared a lot. Not sure why you find that so radically off base but maybe you grew up in the Tee Ball generation and never learned to care about winning. You almost have to be to be a Bills fan these days.

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

Because I would never advocate dirty, illegal play, and no coach worth his weight in turds would either.

 

 

 

Yes, thank you. This team plays hard, especially on defense. That's how we were able to squeak out a 7-9 record with such a pathetic offense last year. It baffles me that Bills fans refuse to believe this, for whatever reason.

 

In my experience, those who don't actually understand the sport just resort back to "They aren't trying hard enough!" when the team is losing, because they can't actually explain why in terms of football strategy. The Bills showed just as much fire as any other team last year, but yet again the team dropped a few too many winnable games.

[Mickey]

Because I would never advocate dirty, illegal play, and no coach worth his weight in turds would either.

 

 

 

Yes, thank you. This team plays hard, especially on defense. That's how we were able to squeak out a 7-9 record with such a pathetic offense last year. It baffles me that Bills fans refuse to believe this, for whatever reason.

They eked out 7 wins based on an easy schedule and special teams. Passion is not something they have.

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

Okay, so you admit emotional inspiration is a legitimate factor. Have you never seen a team get motivated by someone yelling at them? If not, you must not have seen a single football coach besides Dick Jauron do his job. Never seen a coach take a T? Its pretty basic, this team is flat, slouching towards mediocrity and has been for years now. It would be nice if someone showed they cared, that they cared a lot. Not sure why you find that so radically off base but maybe you grew up in the Tee Ball generation and never learned to care about winning. You almost have to be to be a Bills fan these days.

 

Yes, I have. I've also seen a team get motivated because they respect the hell out of the guy that they're playing for, and that's the case with Jauron and the Bills. Say what you want about his game strategy, but you can't deny that the Bills play hard for him. That's the way it always was with Tony Dungy. Did you ever see him scream?

[Mickey]

In my experience, those who don't actually understand the sport just resort back to "They aren't trying hard enough!" when the team is losing, because they can't actually explain why in terms of football strategy. The Bills showed just as much fire as any other team last year, but yet again the team dropped a few too many winnable games.

Yep, that was the problem, we just need to tweak a few x's and o's. Same thing the year before and the year before and the year before..... One of these days we will stumble on the right tweak and win a few of those "winnable" games.

 

We talk about the technical side often enough around here, its usually my favorite subject but there is more to football than that and in my opinion, this team doesn't have enough players whose heart and soul hangs on the outcome of every play.

 

Jauron isn't bad on the technical end, a bit conservative for sure but he isn't incompetent. But he is about as inspirational as wet paper and demonstrates all the urgency of a cashier at a DMV. I think that makes a difference on the field and on the scoreboard. Sure we have talent problems and sure we have some pretty questionable game plans but in addition, we lack the passion I think the game requires of winners.

[The Big Cat]

Okay, so you admit emotional inspiration is a legitimate factor. Have you never seen a team get motivated by someone yelling at them? If not, you must not have seen a single football coach besides Dick Jauron do his job. Never seen a coach take a T? Its pretty basic, this team is flat, slouching towards mediocrity and has been for years now. It would be nice if someone showed they cared, that they cared a lot. Not sure why you find that so radically off base but maybe you grew up in the Tee Ball generation and never learned to care about winning. You almost have to be to be a Bills fan these days.

 

You're demonstrating your sheer ignorance on his matter quite wonderfully, Mr. Mouse.

 

Firstly, who's showing they don't care.

 

Secondly, by the way you're going on here, you'd think that getting up in a guy's face and screaming at him is the only way to show you care.

 

Thirdly, ask anyone who has studied sports psychology or who has attended and/or run a coaching clinic and they'll explain to you that yelling at your players should be a last resort, nay AVOIDED AT ALL COSTS. Yelling at your players is lazy, careless coaching.

 

Fourthly, if you think for a second that in the vastly intricate world of professional football, in Rick Majerus' "I'll never coach professional sports because it's like being a step-dad, all the responsibility and no authority" line of thinking that YELLING AT THE PLAYERS will somehow magically solve all our problems, then you don't know jack squat sports, professional sports, or coaching.