Barack Obama: "I don't switch positions."

[Chilly]

Sure ya don't

[DC Tom]

Inconsistency we can believe in.

 

 

 

 

 

Really, though...what did anyone expect? Primary campaigning is geared toward the party core; now he's trying to woo moderates.

[pBills]

Hopefully McCain won't claim that he does not change positions.

[Chilly]

Inconsistency we can believe in.

 

Really, though...what did anyone expect? Primary campaigning is geared toward the party core; now he's trying to woo moderates.

 

yap, still fun to laugh at

 

Hopefully McCain won't claim that he does not change positions.

 

plz 2 understand difference between campaigning on new poltick and old politick.

[JK2000]

Meanwhile 8 years of a President who doesn't change positions has been terrific.

 

"The greatest thing about this man is he's steady. You know where he stands. He believes the same thing Wednesday that he believed on Monday, no matter what happened Tuesday. Events can change; this man's beliefs never will." -Stephen Colbert on GWB

[Chilly]

Meanwhile 8 years of a President who doesn't change positions has been terrific.

 

"The greatest thing about this man is he's steady. You know where he stands. He believes the same thing Wednesday that he believed on Monday, no matter what happened Tuesday. Events can change; this man's beliefs never will." -Stephen Colbert on GWB

 

plz 2 read quote

[/dev/null]

plz 2 read quote

What's Vince Young got to do with this?

[pBills]

yap, still fun to laugh at

 

 

 

plz 2 understand difference between campaigning on new poltick and old politick.

 

 

 

They both have flipped, changed or altered some of their original stances. Expected. One states change. The other the Straight Talk Express.

[Chilly]

What's Vince Young got to do with this?

 

He scored higher on the wonderlic than our good friend?

 

They both have flipped, changed or altered some of their original stances. Expected. One states change. The other the Straight Talk Express.

 

Read quote in thread title. Compare to actions. Read campaign messages. Compare messages to McCain. Understand difference.

[billsfanone]

Who doesn't change their minds in life? Given different experiences, changing times, etc???

[pBills]

He scored higher on the wonderlic than our good friend?

 

 

 

Read quote in thread title. Compare to actions. Read campaign messages. Compare messages to McCain. Understand difference.

 

 

 

Dude I understand. To me someone saying "Change to Believe In" - stating that they are going to change DC. Is just as strong as a statement as McCain's "Straight-Talk Express" - which states that he is this maverick politician and what he says is straight-talk. No double speak.

 

Now compare actions - THEY BOTH HAVE FLIP FLOPPED, CHANGED OR ALTERED THEIR OPINIONS. Please tell me now McCain's is different because his flip flops don't mean as much as Obama's flip flops. Give me a break.

 

Personally, I believe they are allowed to do that. I would like to see that. It's better to have someone review the facts and then be able to adjust if need be. Not be pig headed and stay one way for fear of being called a flip-flopper.

[JK2000]

Dude I understand. To me someone saying "Change to Believe In" - stating that they are going to change DC. Is just as strong as a statement as McCain's "Straight-Talk Express" - which states that he is this maverick politician and what he says is straight-talk. No double speak.

 

Now compare actions - THEY BOTH HAVE FLIP FLOPPED, CHANGED OR ALTERED THEIR OPINIONS. Please tell me now McCain's is different because his flip flops don't mean as much as Obama's flip flops. Give me a break.

 

Personally, I believe they are allowed to do that. I would like to see that. It's better to have someone review the facts and then be able to adjust if need be. Not be pig headed and stay one way for fear of being called a flip-flopper.

 

I think that their is a big difference between "flip flopping" on a postion like NASA funding and "flip flopping" on one's core values and beliefs. I'll worry about "flip flopping" when/if McCain says we shouldn't be drilling offshore and Obama says we need to send more troops to Iraq. These "gotcha" stories are already tiresome and it's only August.

[PastaJoe]

I think that their is a big difference between "flip flopping" on a postion like NASA funding and "flip flopping" on one's core values and beliefs. I'll worry about "flip flopping" when/if McCain says we shouldn't be drilling offshore and Obama says we need to send more troops to Iraq. These "gotcha" stories are already tiresome and it's only August.

 

But until this year McCain was against further drilling offshore, and now he's pushing it, so he's already crossed your threshhold. I think the whole drilling debate is silly anyways, because it makes it sound like there is no drilling currently going on, which unfortunately is what some uninformed voters probably believe based on what they've heard from the talking points.

[Chilly]

Dude I understand.

 

Obviously you don't. If you did, you wouldn't have needed to make this post, would you?

 

To me someone saying "Change to Believe In" - stating that they are going to change DC.

 

Very good. Now, take into account the Washington Insider rhetoric, along with the changing the culture of Washington rhetoric.

 

Is just as strong as a statement as McCain's "Straight-Talk Express" - which states that he is this maverick politician and what he says is straight-talk. No double speak.

 

Ah, but he doesn't paint himself as a Washington outsider now does he? He paints himself as a governmental reformer against lobbying interests.

 

Now compare actions - THEY BOTH HAVE FLIP FLOPPED, CHANGED OR ALTERED THEIR OPINIONS. Please tell me now McCain's is different because his flip flops don't mean as much as Obama's flip flops. Give me a break.

 

Hmm... Washington Outsider vs Washington Insider. Yep, they have the same context, don't they?

 

 

Personally, I believe they are allowed to do that. I would like to see that. It's better to have someone review the facts and then be able to adjust if need be. Not be pig headed and stay one way for fear of being called a flip-flopper.

 

The issue is not the changing of positions (Obama's change was a good one). The issue here is he's claimed he's a Washington outsider and different from everyone currently in Washington when he's clearly not. Plz see quote above.

[Chilly]

I think that their is a big difference between "flip flopping" on a postion like NASA funding and "flip flopping" on one's core values and beliefs. I'll worry about "flip flopping" when/if McCain says we shouldn't be drilling offshore and Obama says we need to send more troops to Iraq. These "gotcha" stories are already tiresome and it's only August.

 

Oh, you mean like how Obama changed his position on offshore drilling?

[DC Tom]

Meanwhile 8 years of a President who doesn't change positions has been terrific.

 

"The greatest thing about this man is he's steady. You know where he stands. He believes the same thing Wednesday that he believed on Monday, no matter what happened Tuesday. Events can change; this man's beliefs never will." -Stephen Colbert on GWB

 

 

I think that their is a big difference between "flip flopping" on a postion like NASA funding and "flip flopping" on one's core values and beliefs.

 

 

You really are a bit of a dimwit, aren't you?

[pBills]

Obviously you don't. If you did, you wouldn't have needed to make this post, would you?

 

Very good. Now, take into account the Washington Insider rhetoric, along with the changing the culture of Washington rhetoric.

 

Ah, but he doesn't paint himself as a Washington outsider now does he? He paints himself as a governmental reformer against lobbying interests.

 

Hmm... Washington Outsider vs Washington Insider. Yep, they have the same context, don't they?

 

The issue is not the changing of positions (Obama's change was a good one). The issue here is he's claimed he's a Washington outsider and different from everyone currently in Washington when he's clearly not.

 

 

Quit acting as though you and your opinions are the be all, end all here. BOTH paint themselves as governmental reformers in many ways. McCain may not say that he's a Washington outsider - but he always acts and states that he's some sort of maverick - he's not. I do see your point, however for once expand it and blast McCain once and while. The way he's labeled himself just in this campaign (and flipped) to many is just as bad.

[JK2000]

You really are a bit of a dimwit, aren't you?

 

Wow, good one.

[Chilly]

Quit acting as though you and your opinions are the be all, end all here.

 

No.

 

BOTH paint themselves as governmental reformers in many ways. McCain may not say that he's a Washington outsider - but he always acts and states that he's some sort of maverick - he's not.

 

And?

 

I do see your point

 

Particularly funny given quote #1.

 

however for once expand it and blast McCain once and while.

 

You mean like....

 

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showt...3&hl=McCain

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showt...6&hl=McCain

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showt...1&hl=McCain

 

There's a reason why I don't blast McCain much on this board: There isn't anyone who is completely and utterly infatuated with McCain the way the libs on this board are with Obama.

 

 

The way he's labeled himself just in this campaign (and flipped) to many is just as bad.

 

Particularly funny given quote #3.

[JK2000]

Obviously you don't. If you did, you wouldn't have needed to make this post, would you?

 

 

 

Very good. Now, take into account the Washington Insider rhetoric, along with the changing the culture of Washington rhetoric.

 

 

 

Ah, but he doesn't paint himself as a Washington outsider now does he? He paints himself as a governmental reformer against lobbying interests.

 

 

 

Hmm... Washington Outsider vs Washington Insider. Yep, they have the same context, don't they?

 

 

 

 

The issue is not the changing of positions (Obama's change was a good one). The issue here is he's claimed he's a Washington outsider and different from everyone currently in Washington when he's clearly not. Plz see quote above.

 

So how is naming your bus "Straight Talk Express" and calling yourself a "maverick" not impling that you're a "different" "Washington outsider"?

[Chilly]

So how is naming your bus "Straight Talk Express" and calling yourself a "maverick" not impling that you're a "different" "Washington outsider"?

 

Having a long record of being a maverick in Washington, by definition, means you are a Washington Insider that can, at times, go against the grain.

 

Claiming you are a "Washington Outsider" means you are a completely different type of politician from what we've currently got.

[/dev/null]

There's a reason why I don't blast McCain much on this board: There isn't anyone who is completely and utterly infatuated with McCain the way the libs on this board are with Obama.

 

FTW

[GG]

So how is naming your bus "Straight Talk Express" and calling yourself a "maverick" not impling that you're a "different" "Washington outsider"?

 

How far did that campaign get him in 2000 when it was unveiled?

[JK2000]

How far did that campaign get him in 2000 when it was unveiled?

 

That's because right wingers don't like hearing the truth and would rather vote for someone because he shares their love for jeebus. I think McCain would have been a damn good president in 2000. Today's McCain is another story.

[GG]

That's because right wingers don't like hearing the truth and would rather vote for someone because he shares their love for jeebus. I think McCain would have been a damn good president in 2000. Today's McCain is another story.

 

 

Is McCain telling the truth or not? Or was he for the truth before he decided that he's now against the truth? Or are you flip flopping on your position of him? Or did you just invent a new way to stick in a Bush Bad reference?

 

 

This is so complicated.

[JK2000]

Is McCain telling the truth or not? Or was he for the truth before he decided that he's now against the truth? Or are you flip flopping on your position of him? Or did you just invent a new way to stick in a Bush Bad reference?

 

 

This is so complicated.

 

It's not complicated at all.

[GG]

It's not complicated at all.

 

Obviously, not.

[erynthered]

DC Tom was right.

[DC Tom]

DC Tom was right.

 

No sh--. Ya think?

[/dev/null]

No sh--. Ya think?

Every once in a while even a Crap Throwing Monkey scores a Bullseye

[finknottle]

Not to defend flip-flopping, but it is reasonable when circumstances change. McCain reversed his opposition to offshore drilling in response to the dramatic uptick in oil prices. Obama reversed the cuts he was proposing for NASA to compete in Florida - err, scratch that. Give him the benefit of the doubt for a minute.

 

One of the consequences of his proposed cuts was that it would delay the shuttles replacement by an extra 5 years, to 2019. This leaves a 10 year gap in which we would have to rely on Russia to sell us passage. As many countries who get their energy from Russia have learned, that's not a good situation. Perhaps Obama has re-evaluated the issue in light of events in Georgia.

 

So now he wants to restore funding and extend flying the shuttle by a year - IMO prudent, as far as it goes. But does it go far enough? It still leaves a gap from 2010-2014 in which we have no way to get a man in orbit. Is that good enough? (Not that I have a magic solution.)

[DC Tom]

One of the consequences of his proposed cuts was that it would delay the shuttles replacement by an extra 5 years, to 2019. This leaves a 10 year gap in which we would have to rely on Russia to sell us passage. As many countries who get their energy from Russia have learned, that's not a good situation. Perhaps Obama has re-evaluated the issue in light of events in Georgia.

 

So now he wants to restore funding and extend flying the shuttle by a year - IMO prudent, as far as it goes. But does it go far enough? It still leaves a gap from 2010-2014 in which we have no way to get a man in orbit. Is that good enough? (Not that I have a magic solution.)

 

Obama changed his mind WELL before events in the Caucasus. And I think I read recently that the shuttle's replacement is going to be delayed even further now. Don't remember the year.

 

 

And like I said before...it's just pandering. The radical side of the Democratic Party hates the space program ("Let's spend our money here first and cure hunger and poverty instead of wasting it on the space prog...hold on a sec, I've got a long distance call from Paris..."). He's moderating his positions to appeal more to the center. Change that...is pretty much the same as every other politician's.

[DC Tom]

Meanwhile 8 years of a President who doesn't change positions has been terrific.

 

 

 

http://www.newsweek.com/id/151731/page/1

 

 

Read past the headline, monkey-boy.

[JK2000]

http://www.newsweek.com/id/151731/page/1

 

 

Read past the headline, monkey-boy.

 

Wow, Bush comes off great in this article!

 

"And then there is the administration's record outside of foreign policy. Bush 43 has surely been the most fiscally irresponsible president in American history, taking surpluses that equaled 2.5 percent of GDP and turning them into deficits that are 3 percent. This is a $4 trillion hit on the country's balance sheet. On the central issue of energy policy—the greatest economic challenge and opportunity of our times—Bush has been utterly obstructionist, recycling the self-serving arguments of industry lobbyists. On the whole, Bush's record remains one of failure and missed opportunities"

 

"There was a U.S. president who came into office convinced that everything his predecessor had done was feckless, stupid, ill-informed and venal. He rejected and tried to reverse everything that he could, almost as an article of faith. Before he had even examined the policies carefully, he knew that they had to be changed. The base of his party was delighted by his clarity and fighting spirit. That president, of course, was George W. Bush. His decision to blindly repudiate anything associated with Bill Clinton is what got us into this mess in the first place."

 

"A broad shift in America's approach to the world is justified and overdue. Bush's basic conception of a "global War on Terror," to take but the most obvious example, has been poorly thought-through, badly implemented, and has produced many unintended costs that will linger for years if not decades."

[Chilly]

Obama changed his mind WELL before events in the Caucasus. And I think I read recently that the shuttle's replacement is going to be delayed even further now. Don't remember the year.

 

 

And like I said before...it's just pandering. The radical side of the Democratic Party hates the space program ("Let's spend our money here first and cure hunger and poverty instead of wasting it on the space prog...hold on a sec, I've got a long distance call from Paris..."). He's moderating his positions to appeal more to the center. Change that...is pretty much the same as every other politician's.

 

Yep. In fact, like I mentioned in my previous post, this is a good decision by Obama.

 

Still, its funny to laugh at the guy who claims he's different, but really he's differently abled just like the rest of em.