The only positive going for JP that should give us

[bluv]

every type throw with accuracy. Last year we know he had a gun but no touch whatsoever on short passes. Now he needs to learn how to better read defenses and be more consistent - things that takes time to develop; certainly more than 16 games on a BAD offensive team with shabby blocking and no scheme! He should definitely be given the rest of this year and possibly even next. We should bring in better O-lineman and more offensive weapons. A more capable veteran QB should also be brought in next year just in case he falters next year and is the only piece holding this team back. But to draft a QB such as Quinn will set this team back 3-4 more years if he doesn't come in and be a game changer like a young Marino for he can't play that Ben or Rivers role for they won't be on a team capable of carrying them! If we have to wait 2-3 years for them to develop then we might as well stay with JP.

[drg2021]

every type throw with accuracy. Last year we know he had a gun but no touch whatsoever on short passes. Now he needs to learn how to better read defenses and be more consistent - things that takes time to develop; certainly more than 16 games on a BAD offensive team with shabby blocking and no scheme! He should definitely be given the rest of this year and possibly even next. We should bring in better O-lineman and more offensive weapons. A more capable veteran QB should also be brought in next year just in case he falters next year and is the only piece holding this team back. But to draft a QB such as Quinn will set this team back 3-4 more years if he doesn't come in and be a game changer like a young Marino for he can't play that Ben or Rivers role for they won't be on a team capable of carrying them! If we have to wait 2-3 years for them to develop then we might as well stay with JP.

826678[/snapback]

Yep he was STELLER yesterday.

[Wraith]

Yep he was STELLER yesterday.

826769[/snapback]

 

Learn to read. Learn to spell. Might as well learn to think while you're at it.

[5 Wide]

I thought JP would light it up yesterday, coming off a bye, in very good weather conditions, against an awful pass defense. Nope..didn't happen. I've been very stout in my backing of Losman and really feel like he needs the time necessary to develop, but I am starting to waver. He slides well in the pocket one moment, then slides right into rushers the next. Doubt is starting to creep in as to whether or not JP has what it takes to lead the team. He is not playing good football.

[drg2021]

Learn to read. Learn to spell. Might as well learn to think while you're at it.

826772[/snapback]

[/quo

Wow thats a very intellectual comment.Thanks for posting, something very imformative,like you are

[Wraith]

Show me where the thread starter says Losman played well? Show me where the author said he played adequately? All he did was mention ONE POSITIVE.

 

You walk in and mangle the spelling in one sarcastic off-topic comment just like you have in three other topics in the last 15 minutes. I repeat: Learn to read, learn to spell, and try thinking once in a while.

[drg2021]

I thought JP would light it up yesterday, coming off a bye, in very good weather conditions, against an awful pass defense.  Nope..didn't happen.  I've been very stout in my backing of Losman and really feel like he needs the time necessary to develop, but I am starting to waver.  He slides well in the pocket one moment, then slides right into rushers the next.  Doubt is starting to creep in as to whether or not JP has what it takes to lead the team.  He is not playing good football.

826777[/snapback]

I think Jp has all the physical tools to play, but mentally he makes Rob Johnson look like a NASA Engineer.Hes NOT NFL material.

[drg2021]

Show me where the thread starter says Losman played well? Show me where the author said he played adequately? All he did was mention ONE POSITIVE.

 

You walk in and mangle the spelling in one sarcastic off-topic comment just like you have in three other topics in the last 15 minutes. I repeat: Learn to read, learn to spell, and try thinking once in a while.

826795[/snapback]

You are an IDIOT.I was making a sarcarstic comment,about his STELLER PLAY,yeserday.62 yards passing doesnt get it done on my sons pee wee team

[Wraith]

You are an IDIOT.I was making a sarcarstic comment,about his STELLER PLAY,yeserday.62 yards passing doesnt get it done on my sons pee wee team

826798[/snapback]

 

One more time: What about his play yesterday, STELLAR or not, has anything to do with the topic of this thread?

 

Work on your reading comprehension. Work on your spelling. Work on your math.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

I can't find the link but yesterday was reading an article from I think it was the "Chris Brown Blog". Fairchild was asked about why doesn't JP roll out more and according to Fairchild they don't want him to run as it retards development. By standing back there and "taking it like a man" it forces the QB to learn to read defenses better. He also stated that college QB's who aren't mobile tend to develop faster as they are use to standing back in the pocket. So that could explain things that JP is now back there fighting instincts to take off.

 

 

I thought JP would light it up yesterday, coming off a bye, in very good weather conditions, against an awful pass defense.  Nope..didn't happen.  I've been very stout in my backing of Losman and really feel like he needs the time necessary to develop, but I am starting to waver.  He slides well in the pocket one moment, then slides right into rushers the next.  Doubt is starting to creep in as to whether or not JP has what it takes to lead the team.  He is not playing good football.

826777[/snapback]

[Tasker]

I agree with the topic starter that JP has shown that he has the physical ability to make any throw, and that is a very encouraging ability if the rest of his game develops like we hope.

 

I agree with those who have said that stellar should almost always be spelled correctly, especially when including in a sarcastic response that will almost definitely create some comebacks.

 

I think that JP not rolling out and scrambling is very likely intentional by the coaching staff to help him learn the reads, etc. and not become a Michael Vick clone (since he can't run like Vick). But I think this pendulum has swung too far towards being stationary, and hopefully once they think he has progressed with his reads, they will encourage him to start using his mobility more when the situation calls for it. I think eight games is enough time for this transition back to happen and for him to start to evolve into the mobile quarterback he can be and not a Drew Bledsoe clone either.

[bluv]

I thought JP would light it up yesterday, coming off a bye, in very good weather conditions, against an awful pass defense.  Nope..didn't happen.  I've been very stout in my backing of Losman and really feel like he needs the time necessary to develop, but I am starting to waver.  He slides well in the pocket one moment, then slides right into rushers the next.  Doubt is starting to creep in as to whether or not JP has what it takes to lead the team.  He is not playing good football.

826777[/snapback]

Yesterday he couldn't slide up in the pocket becuase most of the pressure came up the middle (Harris 3 sacks) and for that reason I think the pass protection look worse yesterday than before as he hardly had time to setup. The run blocking looked much better though.

 

Back to the JP topic though: a young QB needs more than 16 games to be fully evaluated; especially playing on a team with unproven WR, no pass threats at TE and RB, and no offensive identity. JP is far from exonerated as he does tend to hold onto the ball and lock onto one receiver. But for those with a half full outlook will note that when he does make up his mind to throw the ball and is able to step up in a pocket he is much more accurate than last year when he would miss wide open receivers when he would rush throws. He has shown the abilty to make all throws. Another positive is that he doesn't throw a lot of int's; even last year. Fumbling has been a problem as of late but that has come from being blsted blindsided. I say that after 16 games, based on the the history of this league he is pretty much on the same track as most other QB's who have played this game and he has shown some qualities that you just can't teach. But in this era of free agency and quick turn around nobody has any patience in developing young QB's. I mean why pay a 1st round QB 1st round money and give up on him after 16 starts? Some will point to how quick Rivers and Romo caught on but the last time I checked they have sat for the past 3-4 years under the same offensive system with proven offensive stars at the skilled positions. We have neither the proven skilled positions or system!

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

Yesterday he couldn't slide up in the pocket becuase most of the pressure came up the middle (Harris 3 sacks) and for that reason I think the pass protection look worse yesterday than before as he hardly had time to setup. The run blocking looked much better though.

 

Back to the JP topic though: a young QB needs more than 16 games to be fully evaluated; especially playing on a team with unproven WR, no pass threats at TE and RB, and no offensive identity. JP is far from exonerated as he does tend to hold onto the ball and lock onto one receiver. But for those with a half full outlook will note that when he does make up his mind to throw the ball and is able to step up in a pocket he is much more accurate than last year when he would miss wide open receivers when he would rush throws. He has shown the abilty to make all throws. Another positive is that he doesn't throw a lot of int's; even last year. Fumbling has been a problem as of late but that has come from being blsted blindsided. I say that after 16 games, based on the the history of this league he is pretty much on the same track as most other QB's who have played this game and he has shown some qualities that you just can't teach.  But in this era of free agency and quick turn around nobody has any patience in developing young QB's. I mean why pay a 1st round QB 1st round money and give up on him after 16 starts? Some will point to how quick Rivers and Romo caught on but the last time I checked they have sat for the past 3-4 years under the same offensive system with proven offensive stars at the skilled positions. We have neither the proven skilled positions or system!

827009[/snapback]

 

i was unable to watch the game yesterday and so throw out a question. given the performance of the offensive line yesterday, what would a good, established quarterback in today's nfl have been able to do yesterday? forget your individual thoughts on jp for a sec---but what would have happened with a good qb? on the radio, it sounded as if the pressure was fairly intense and consistent, the other members of the offense were not particularly effective, and of the 5 sacks, maybe 2 were directly attributable to jp. i also know that he underthrew evans on a deep ball (but pressure may have prevented him from stepping into it), that one relatively deep pass bounced off robert royal's hands, and that he tossed at least one at the feet of his receiver. additionally, a couple important false starts hurt us, and wm went out on a third and one after getting hit a yard or two deep and busting up his ribs.

 

so, thoughts? name your qb and let me know how many more yards we get.

[JDG]

every type throw with accuracy. Last year we know he had a gun but no touch whatsoever on short passes. Now he needs to learn how to better read defenses and be more consistent - things that takes time to develop; certainly more than 16 games on a BAD offensive team with shabby blocking and no scheme! He should definitely be given the rest of this year and possibly even next. We should bring in better O-lineman and more offensive weapons. A more capable veteran QB should also be brought in next year just in case he falters next year and is the only piece holding this team back. But to draft a QB such as Quinn will set this team back 3-4 more years if he doesn't come in and be a game changer like a young Marino for he can't play that Ben or Rivers role for they won't be on a team capable of carrying them! If we have to wait 2-3 years for them to develop then we might as well stay with JP.

826678[/snapback]

 

There's a problem with your logic.... if 2-3 years from now, JP is still not an adequate NFL QB, and now you are stuck 2-3 years from now drafting a Colt McCoy or a Riley Skinner [or whomever is the best QB that year] and waiting 3-4 years for *him* to develop, then you have just set the program back by 5-7 years by sticking with JP Losman, instead of only the 3-4 years of going with Brady Quinn...

 

JDG

[drg2021]

i was unable to watch the game yesterday and so throw out a question.  given the performance of the offensive line yesterday, what would a good, established quarterback in today's nfl have been able to do yesterday?  forget your individual thoughts on jp for a sec---but what would have happened with a good qb?  on the radio, it sounded as if the pressure was fairly intense and consistent, the other members of the offense were not particularly effective, and of the 5 sacks, maybe 2 were directly attributable to jp.  i also know that he underthrew evans on a deep ball (but pressure may have prevented him from stepping into it), that one relatively deep pass bounced off robert royal's hands, and that he tossed at least one at the feet of his receiver.  additionally, a couple important false starts hurt us, and wm went out on a third and one after getting hit a yard or two deep and busting up his ribs. 

 

so, thoughts? name your qb and let me know how many more yards we get.

827041[/snapback]

Craig Nall,Kelly Holcomb,Jeff George,Doug Flutie,Rob Johnson,to name a few.Jps regressing, from the beginning of the season.Anyone of those qbs would have progressed through their reads and hit the check down in the flat.Against the 32nd rated pass defense in the league we muster 8 completions,absolutlly putrid.

[Wraith]

Craig Nall,Kelly Holcomb,Jeff George,Doug Flutie,Rob Johnson,to name a few.Jps regressing, from the beginning of the season.Anyone of those qbs would have progressed through their reads and hit the check down in the flat.Against the 32nd rated pass defense in the league we muster 8 completions,absolutlly putrid.

827059[/snapback]

 

First of all, you're not answering the question.

 

Second of all, what check down? The Bills almost exclusively used two wide receivers while keeping the TE and back in to block. It was the most conservative play calling to date.

[bluv]

i was unable to watch the game yesterday and so throw out a question.  given the performance of the offensive line yesterday, what would a good, established quarterback in today's nfl have been able to do yesterday?  forget your individual thoughts on jp for a sec---but what would have happened with a good qb?  on the radio, it sounded as if the pressure was fairly intense and consistent, the other members of the offense were not particularly effective, and of the 5 sacks, maybe 2 were directly attributable to jp.  i also know that he underthrew evans on a deep ball (but pressure may have prevented him from stepping into it), that one relatively deep pass bounced off robert royal's hands, and that he tossed at least one at the feet of his receiver.  additionally, a couple important false starts hurt us, and wm went out on a third and one after getting hit a yard or two deep and busting up his ribs. 

 

so, thoughts? name your qb and let me know how many more yards we get.

827041[/snapback]

To me yesterday was the worse the O-line has looked all season from a pass rush standpoint as all the pressuer was up the middle and it was consistent. Now if we had a quick passing attack combined with the succesfull running game we could have been more successful as he could have had maybe 200 yards passing. As a matter of fact if you throw in the 20-30 yard drop by Royal and if he had an extra second to step into the throw he made to EVans tht was swatted away he would have came close to tht number. I don't know if the QB would have mattered as much as the playcalling and blocking in yesterday' game. Maybea McNabb type who is mobile and used can improvise but I mean if they are getting to the QB up the middle witout much blitzing then theire isn't much that can be done from that regard.

 

But a good offensive coordinator would notice this and modify his game plan. I mean Favre had about as much time in the pocket as JP had but there were also more quick hitting pass plays called as well as quick passes over the middle to backs and TE's. Also, once the Packers noticed that there zone blocking running scheme was getting eating up by our qyuick penetrating D they swtch to more smash mouth runs in the second half which yielded more success.

[bluv]

There's a problem with your logic....  if 2-3 years from now, JP is still not an adequate NFL QB, and now you are stuck 2-3 years from now drafting a Colt McCoy or a Riley Skinner [or whomever is the best QB that year] and waiting 3-4 years for *him* to develop, then you have just set the program back by 5-7 years by sticking with JP Losman, instead of only the 3-4 years of going with Brady Quinn...

 

JDG

827055[/snapback]

There is a problem with your logic... if we sit JP and draft a QB next year we will be stuck paying 2 young QB's 1st round money. That pick will take away from adressing other needs on offense in the draft and we will have cap issues and won't be able to add quality free agents. And if this guy doesn't come in and be a game changer then we will be sst back 4-5 years! And just our luck, this young QB gets hurt, JP steps in, pulls a Drew Brees and plays well as we hoped he could all along and then becomes a free agent and signs with another team and we are stucked with an unproven QB! There are a lot of what if scenarios but I'd rather give JP the next year or 2 before I give up on him because regardless how you look at it we are married to him for 2 more years!

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

To me yesterday was the worse the O-line has looked all season from a pass rush standpoint as all the pressuer was up the middle and it was consistent. Now if we had a quick passing attack combined with the succesfull running game we could have been more successful as he could have had maybe 200 yards passing. As a matter of fact if you throw in the 20-30 yard drop by Royal and if he had an extra second to step into the throw he made to EVans tht was swatted away he would have came close to tht number. I don't know if the QB would have mattered as much as the playcalling and blocking in yesterday' game. Maybea McNabb type who is mobile and used can improvise but I mean if they are getting to the QB up the middle witout much blitzing then theire isn't much that can be done from that regard.

 

But a good offensive coordinator would notice this and modify his game plan. I mean Favre had about as much time in the pocket as JP had but there were also more quick hitting pass plays called as well as quick passes over the middle to backs and TE's. Also, once the Packers noticed that there zone blocking running scheme was getting eating up by our qyuick penetrating D they swtch to more smash mouth runs in the second half which yielded more success.

827070[/snapback]

 

 

so i'll discount drg's initial response for not answering in jeopardy format (and you lose credibility points for including rj and flutie in the same sentence).

 

bluv, this is kind of what i thought the answer would be. one potential qb that might be a difference maker because of mobility, and then we're out. and even with a mcnabb, we blow a third and one opportunity, and the pressure is still there throughout the game, and week after week. how the *&% can you gauge consistency when the one consistent element is that we struggle to pass and throw.

 

i feel like we're running in quicksand at this point. there are really no offensive bright spots. everything is in a state of flux, and we still don't know what our current qb could do with decent line help. for the non-believers, he's regressed and can't get it done but he's behind a crappy line. for the people who want to see it through (I'm in this camp), he's struggling and he's behind a crappy line.

 

on the bright side, we're not playing indy at home next week.

[bluv]

so i'll discount drg's initial response for not answering in jeopardy format (and you lose credibility points for including rj and flutie in the same sentence).

 

bluv, this is kind of what i thought the answer would be.  one potential qb that might be a difference maker because of mobility, and then we're out.  and even with a mcnabb, we blow a third and one opportunity, and the pressure is still there throughout the game, and week after week.  how the *&% can you gauge consistency when the one consistent element is that we struggle to pass and throw.   

 

i feel like we're running in quicksand at this point.  there are really no offensive bright spots.  everything is in a state of flux, and we still don't know what our current qb could do with decent line help.  for the non-believers, he's regressed and can't get it done but he's behind a crappy line.  for the people who want to see it through (I'm in this camp), he's struggling and he's behind a crappy line. 

 

on the bright side, we're not playing indy at home next week.

827087[/snapback]

That is why I'm more patent with JP for their is no way you can single him out solely for our poor offensive performance. I mean blocking has been inconsistent for the 1st 8 games (pass blocking was horrible yesterday) and we have no offensive chemistry or identity to speak off. I can see complaints last year as he constantly missed wide open receivers when he had time in the pocket; he hasn't as much this year. I can see if he had more coverage sacks where he held the ball for 6-7 plus seconds. Most of his probelms seem to be reading dfenses and more plays called that require quick setups and release. Until we see better output around him we can't be quick to label him a bust yet. You can't expect greatness from a young QB and say just because Tom Brady or Peyton Manning could produce with this team we should expect the same from JP.